Cool project. Here is a thread that I posted of me trying to save a 1978 Musicmaster. Came out great in the end and was a good learning experience for me. 197X Fender Musicmaster "restoration"
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1978 Musicmaster Bass Project
- Thread starter Wally Balls
- Start date
That bridge looks sweet.
There's one out there in black. I'm tempted to buy it and chrome it!
There's one out there in black. I'm tempted to buy it and chrome it!
Somebody in the Musicmaster Bass Club thread pointed me to a Wilkinson bridge that has swivel saddles and I wound up using those with my original bridge. It worked out great! Pics here.
Yeah, the one I found was black, but then so is the bass, so I just went with it. Looks alright, the bridge area finish is a trainwreck anyway, so it's not a showpiece
. Plays nice though!
I can’t say enough about the Aero pickup in mine….it sounds like a sc p bass. Strong and with plenty bite. Hand wound and great reviews.
This is not intended to be a anti-bass-modding lecture...just an observation I had.
I have a P-bass knockoff someone gave me with a dead pickup. I started playing with the rout shape so I could try different pickups in it (from my guitar parts box).
One of the pickups I tried was a dual-rail strat replacement pickup, and it rocked. It still sounded like a P-bass and being a humbucker, it was noise-free. My experiments with that thing have shown that the bulk of the P-bass sound characteristics come from where the pickup is under the strings, along the string length...not the fact that it’s that staggered split design.
Sub-experiments of moving a few different pickups I tried (including a humbucker out of a Les Paul knockoff) toward and away from the bridge in my expanded rout cavity Seemed to make a bigger sonic difference than the actual pickup configuration itself, which really surprised me. I liked it a little less toward the neck, and a lot less toward the bridge. For me at least, the P-bass location is the way to go.
If this seems reasonable to you so far, I see two ways this info could influence your project:
1: Your bass looks killer as is, and the pickguard is already routed for a strat-shaped pickup. Slap a strat sized dual rail humbucker in it from Seymour Duncan, DiMarzio or any of ten zillion less expensive online vendors, and call it a day. No routing, plenty of output, drops right in and is quiet when you stop playing, under a bank of old fluorescent lights with failing ballasts.
2: if what you’re after is specifically the P-bass-est tone you can get from a Music Master, and you’re already committed to routing and the Novak pickup set, make sure you’re aware of the pickup location on a P-bass before you get crazy with the router, or you might be in for a tonal surprise...not necessarily in the direction you intended.
And 3: whatever you decide to do, post pics! Sounds like a potentially very cool project!
I have a P-bass knockoff someone gave me with a dead pickup. I started playing with the rout shape so I could try different pickups in it (from my guitar parts box).
One of the pickups I tried was a dual-rail strat replacement pickup, and it rocked. It still sounded like a P-bass and being a humbucker, it was noise-free. My experiments with that thing have shown that the bulk of the P-bass sound characteristics come from where the pickup is under the strings, along the string length...not the fact that it’s that staggered split design.
Sub-experiments of moving a few different pickups I tried (including a humbucker out of a Les Paul knockoff) toward and away from the bridge in my expanded rout cavity Seemed to make a bigger sonic difference than the actual pickup configuration itself, which really surprised me. I liked it a little less toward the neck, and a lot less toward the bridge. For me at least, the P-bass location is the way to go.
If this seems reasonable to you so far, I see two ways this info could influence your project:
1: Your bass looks killer as is, and the pickguard is already routed for a strat-shaped pickup. Slap a strat sized dual rail humbucker in it from Seymour Duncan, DiMarzio or any of ten zillion less expensive online vendors, and call it a day. No routing, plenty of output, drops right in and is quiet when you stop playing, under a bank of old fluorescent lights with failing ballasts.
2: if what you’re after is specifically the P-bass-est tone you can get from a Music Master, and you’re already committed to routing and the Novak pickup set, make sure you’re aware of the pickup location on a P-bass before you get crazy with the router, or you might be in for a tonal surprise...not necessarily in the direction you intended.
And 3: whatever you decide to do, post pics! Sounds like a potentially very cool project!
This is a super nice '78, but you already know that and are still committed to modding. That being the case, go for it!!
I've posted pics of my rescued basses before, one of which was a super-sad and badly abused '78 Musicmaster... Already modded, (apparently with a dreamer tool), but the bones were good, as was the aftermarket pickup...
Since there was already a "cavern" chiseled out under the guard, (including a battery pocket), I just routed out a "swimming pool" to clean things up and allow different pickups. I have another guard with a Novak BS/DS setup and can switch in a few minutes... I can also throw a stock guard with a "correct" replacement pickup and no one would ever know just by looking!
For simplicity sake, you just might want to explore some of the drop-in after market pickups from Aero, Novak, or Sentell... they are really great, not at all weak or shy and come in a lot of different flavors you might find likeable! If you've already got a sound in your head that you want out of this bass, then dive in and do the best work you can!! After all, it is your bass
Sounds like a fun project!-robert
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that strat pickup in there is one of the defining characteristics of the bass! You’ll miss it! I’d keep it in! It’s a gorgeous sounding bass as it is. Before you take out the pickups I’d recommend sitting with it and messing with the height of the pickups first, you can get warmth and roundness out of that set of pickups, they’re not thin sounding; that’s just people projecting what they think a guitar pickup in a bass is gonna do psychologically.
That bass has a 6 pole guitar pickup. It has an e that sits over the pole. An a and a d that sits between the poles and a g that sits over the pole, so the e and the g have more sustain and the d and the a have less sustain. Nothing sounds like a musicmaster, and they sound better than mustangs and p basses, but you’re gonna have to move that pickup to find that out, if it’s backed all the way away from the strings it’s gonna sound thinner.
I say this cause the p cavity will destroy the possibility of going back
that bass has had that pickup for more than 40 years, maybe try to find a mustang body and use the neck from this one. Or find a squire bronco
Edit: oh yeah if the electronics are toast maybe do whatever but also maybe get a strat pickup for it, I would still not rout for a new pickup, that’s a lot of the character of that bass, is how wrong it is and yet it’s the only fender bass that I like the sound of lol
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I used to have one of these, they really are nice little basses. I would probably leave it mostly alone as they are getting harder to find now, and if I were changing things I'd keep it so it could be returned to stock configuration easily.
You could try a dual rail type Strat mini humbucker pickup, I have one here I've been playing with and the results are promising. I'd probably switch the bridge out for a Fender vintage hi-mass which has the threaded rod type saddles that allow you to adjust string spacing and I think it will fit the MM screw pattern too.
I had a hipshot on my bronco but I needed it for another project, so I put the original bridge back on and it works fine. I would not rush to change anything that is not broke.
A decent humbucker 'drop in' strat pickup and new pots and these things can sound great.
A decent humbucker 'drop in' strat pickup and new pots and these things can sound great.
The thing with a Musicmaster bridge (original) is that they're a pain in the butt . Beyond the intonation difficulties (it's rare to see that two saddle style for a reason), it also has the design flaw of too short a space between the string anchor point and the saddle, particularly for the bass E string - so the string end windings go on top of the saddle. I got around this by first running the string through a couple of machine screw nuts of a similar size, to serve as spacers in order to have the string sit right. So okay, it can be dealt with, but it's not a great feature. This is on a late 70's model, some others may vary. On the Squier bridge, this problem has been addressed, it's slightly longer. The Hipshot replacement bridge also addresses this issue (as well as intonation), so it's a considerable improvement ... if you can find one.
. Beyond the intonation difficulties (it's rare to see that two saddle style for a reason), it also has the design flaw of too short a space between the string anchor point and the saddle, particularly for the bass E string - so the string end windings go on top of the saddle. I got around this by first running the string through a couple of machine screw nuts of a similar size, to serve as spacers in order to have the string sit right. So okay, it can be dealt with, but it's not a great feature. This is on a late 70's model, some others may vary. On the Squier bridge, this problem has been addressed, it's slightly longer. The Hipshot replacement bridge also addresses this issue (as well as intonation), so it's a considerable improvement ... if you can find one.
I was just going to mention the Aero drop in replacement. Great pickup! Whenever anyone asks me to work on a Musicmaster Bass, I suggest that Aero pickup.
here here. i also use my MM bass with original pickup. Only change i made was removed the extra cap. There are 2 capacitors, whereas the standard fender Jazz/Precision wiring is one cap. that additional cap is what negatively affects tone IMO. remove that and the pickup is great.
The thing with a Musicmaster bridge (original) is that they're a pain in the butt
I ended up ordering a black hipshot direct replacement. It’s light years better than what’s on there now. I also decided to get all the original hardware checked out and tuned up. My plan is to have the original set as a back up or if I just want to change my tone. I’ll just swap pickguards that are completely set up so it’s just plug and play. I saw that another member here does that, thanks for the great idea.
I ended up taking her apart today and was surprised how good it all looked. Everything is on order now, just waiting for it to arrive to start the rebuild
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I didn’t think anyone made a direct replacement bridge. Can you share the link?
Here are the two that I found in stock at fretnation. I went with the one with the chrome saddles. I was wanting all chrome but this will do for now.
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This is a super nice '78, but you already know that and are still committed to modding. That being the case, go for it!!
I've posted pics of my rescued basses before, one of which was a super-sad and badly abused '78 Musicmaster... Already modded, (apparently with a dreamer tool), but the bones were good, as was the aftermarket pickup...
View attachment 4547471
Since there was already a "cavern" chiseled out under the guard, (including a battery pocket), I just routed out a "swimming pool" to clean things up and allow different pickups. I have another guard with a Novak BS/DS setup and can switch in a few minutes... I can also throw a stock guard with a "correct" replacement pickup and no one would ever know just by looking!
For simplicity sake, you just might want to explore some of the drop-in after market pickups from Aero, Novak, or Sentell... they are really great, not at all weak or shy and come in a lot of different flavors you might find likeable! If you've already got a sound in your head that you want out of this bass, then dive in and do the best work you can!! After all, it is your bass
-robert
thanks for the idea to have pickguards fully set up for easy swap out. I’m going to do the same. My plan is to take the original parts to a tech and get them straightened out. I’ll set all of that up on the original pickguard. I have a tortoise pickguard on order that I will put the new pickups and new control panel.
I still want to use split PB pickups on the new set up. Depending oh how all of this goes I may set up a 3rd pickguard with something else. Right now my focus is getting the old stuff sounding as good as possible and building my first set up.
Your pic shows the 2 capacitors. See which one is the 47uf cap and keep that one. I forget the other value cap I believe it’s the round disc one, that’s the one I removed.
If you do go with separate pickguard, do yourself a favor and use some sort of quick-connect for the bridge ground-wire... Makes change out a breeze!!
-robert
I will definitely do that! How does that pickup sound? I don’t know if I’ve heard one on a MM. Maybe post some playing?
