4x10 and 1x15 Stack?

[f64]

Okay, time for popcorn.
OP- I'm one who mixes these from the same manufacturer and has done so for years. Everyone tells me I'm wrong. I think they have convinced me I'm wrong - but I like the sound. I went one further and built crossovers to keep "some" of the highs off the 10's and "some" of the lows off the 15's and everything seems to balance out. This things made me some serious coin over the years.
Take a look at the last six months Bass Guitar Magazine and Bass Player and count the pro's mixing 10's and 15's. If I listen to those here that do genuinely know and care to guide players they produce every imaginable equation and theory as to why it shouldn't work. I look at the equations and understand them and yes -it shouldn't sound right. I do respect these people and agree that under certain circumstances too much cancellation is going on for it to be effective. All I know is that I did hit on a winner by using cabs from the same manufacturer and cab series. My 15’s are on the bottom and the 10’s are in two rows. One row straight out with the 15’s and the others 25 degrees into the air.
Good luck with it.

 

[73jbass]

You could get the Acoustic 810 cab and be done with it.

 

[DBH_Bass]

You could get the Acoustic 810 cab and be done with it.

I would just do this...

 

[Worldeeeter]

Vic Wooten bi-amped his rig - ADA B500B.

 

[Bassmec]

Right - endorsee does not = sound technician.

I am a sound engineer with over 40 years experience at the top end of this industry.
I know better than to dismiss what can sound great out of hand, just because some hi fi snugglemuffin who thinks they know how to play a cd and hasn't got the faintest idea about the actual situation of a bass guitar rig in actual use with monitors and pa backup.
Well what size speakers are in the pa and monitors. and what's the phase relationship vis a vis your stack on stage relative to, what a member of the audience half way back hears. Hope you have a little labs phase tool or some micro delay setup for that little problem. I have and know how to use them too.
Now what's still out of phase? oh you better turn off the other pickup cos thats seriously out of phase with the other one you got.
Now don't eq your stack as the phase relationship will change between your rig and the front of house oh! and monitors.
Eq is phase distortion too.
Me and Victor Wooten like mixing different speakers because
it can sound great!, not always but it can if you choose the right stuff, especially if you have two amps with separate eq to get the best from each.

PS I play a clean dirty rig and I don't want tweeters or tens in my dirt sound as I like a pair of 15s for that, but I do like an eden 8 x 10 in my clean, am I wrong or is there some phenomenally stupid dogma and generalization going on here.

 

[StraightSix]

You could get the Acoustic 810 cab and be done with it.

At 143lbs, I wouldn't.

I would suggest a fEARful 1212/6 which weighs around 60lbs.

 

[StraightSix]

Bassmec - I'm not dismissing out of hand, my comment was in response to NortyFiner earlier in the thread. All I'm suggesting is that just because someone like Mr.W uses a particular combination of equipment, doesn't mean it is the best combination for everyone.

We are here helping give advice to a player who wants suggestions for a new rig - is it wrong to suggest that the best course of action is the scientifically proven one...?

 

[Kwesi]

Just clarifying for those who haven't seen it.

Tonal benefit of choosing two 410s over a 410/115 stack: Subjective (of course)

Efficiency, safety and perceived volume benefits of choosing two 410s over a 410/115 stack: Generally absolute.

I think I've got that right, anyway...

 

[Febs]

You are just trapped in a world where a guy in a garage with woodworking tools and an oscilloscope is the final authority on the production of sound,

This sort of mischaracterizations of the argument gets pretty tiresome too.

 

[rmars]

If it were me I would skip the 2 cheap cabs and get one decent one and I wouldn't mix drivers (been down that road 20 years ago). You could pick up one of the Genz Focus 410's for a little more than the Acoustic pair and I'm sure it would be substantially better. Maybe a GK or used Ampeg 410 would be a good option. I would skip the Acoustic amp and spend another $20 and get an Ampeg PF-350 Portaflex or maybe a GK MB200.

 

[butcher]

I'm thinking of purchasing an Acoustic B115, B410, and B200H as a bass stack. I play jazz, chinese, fusion, rock, bluegrass and classical on an Ibanez BTB - 400QM. I've read a lot about this Acoustic setup and it seems pretty great! I found a special deal where I can get all three of them, and two free speaker cables for only $650 with free shipping.

Is this a good deal for a full stack?

-and-

would the 115 cab potentially fart out early and limit the volume of the stack? (and if yes, is there some way I can balance the frequencies and volume distributed to each cab)?

I think a lot of us might have missed some important details from the OP.

First, how simple of a rig are you looking for? By this I mean how much stuff are you looking to haul around, plug in and adjust to get some tone. That would make a difference between what you will need to do to get the best tone/sound out of some of the choices that will be recommended to you.

What kind of venues are you looking to play? Are you going to have to provide the bass volume for the gigs or will you be going through a big PA and only need your rig to provide stage volume?

The Acoustic stuff is really at the bottom end of the offerings that are available. It is an old name but the old stuff and the new stuff have nothing to do with each other - Kustom is the same way.

If you do not have to provide huge volume from your rig, I would rather see you put your $$ in a bit better amp and one capable cab.

You are going to learn quite a bit about what you like and don't like about rigs as you use them (and abuse them .

I wish I had all the money I have spent on lesser performance/quality cabs, heads and combos and used it to invest in a really nice rig that fits my needs that I would have for a long time. But then, education is always expensive, isn't it?

 

[rmars]

I
I wish I had all the money I have spent on lesser performance/quality cabs, heads and combos and used it to invest in a really nice rig that fits my needs that I would have for a long time. But then, education is always expensive, isn't it?

Me too!

 

[DeathFromBelow]

You are not wrong. You are just trapped in a world where a guy in a garage with woodworking tools and an oscilloscope is the final authority on the production of sound, notwithstanding your 40 years of actually making it happen where the rubber meets the road.

This could be the best post I have ever read on Talkbass.

 

[lomo]

Right - endorsee does not = sound technician.

Take it a step further: unless an endorsee was using the product before he was compensated for doing so, he is biased, by definition. IMO, anyone who endorses a power cable as having a meaningful influence on tone isn't worth listening to regarding equipment, no matter how great his chops are, or how nice a dude he may be.

 

[GregC]

You are not wrong. You are just trapped in a world where a guy in a garage with woodworking tools and an oscilloscope is the final authority on the production of sound, notwithstanding your 40 years of actually making it happen where the rubber meets the road.

I hope so. The only thing I've found more tiring is how people in agreement on the other side of the argument appeal to authority with their extensive engineering backgrounds and 50-plus years of professional playing experience. "Hi, I'm Will Lee and I recently went back to MIT to receive my doctorate in acoustics and quantum physics. Let me tell you why mixing driver sizes is the worst possible thing you can do."

It shouldn't surprise me that an argument here ends up in a volume war. This is a place for bass players after all...

Heh.

 

[NortyFiner]

My bad on Vic's bi-amped rig.

Anyway, to the OP: I agree partly with those whom are saying get more suitable gear, though not necessarily a "better brand". The new Acoustic stuff is cheap, but it's not BAD gear, and you don't need to impress a bunch of knowitall nicknames on a message board with your equipment. You also don't need expensive brand names to impress your audience; the average human being is barely sentient, let alone able to tell any difference between musical brands. If the new Acoustic tone works for you and you like what you get from the 410+115, then to blazes with what anyone here thinks.

 

[billfitzmaurice]

I'm thinking of purchasing an Acoustic B115, B410, and B200H as a bass stack.

Play through two B410, two B115, and one B410 with one B115. Buy the system that sounds best to you. Yours is the only opinion that counts.

You are just trapped in a world where a guy in a garage with woodworking tools and an oscilloscope is the final authority on the production of sound, notwithstanding your 40 years of actually making it happen where the rubber meets the road.

OTOH there are those who have actually done both.

 

[1n3]

You are not wrong. You are just trapped in a world where a guy in a garage with woodworking tools and an oscilloscope is the final authority on the production of sound, notwithstanding your 40 years of actually making it happen where the rubber meets the road.

This sort of mischaracterizations of the argument gets pretty tiresome too.

Amen. The anti-engineering ethos around here is discouraging; one reason I don't post much any more.

 

[Teknoman]

I gotta ask young man,did any of the above help you make a decision?

 

[rodl2005]

Play through two B410, two B115, and one B410 with one B115. Buy the system that sounds best to you. Yours is the only opinion that counts.

OTOH there are those who have actually done both.

Been gigging since '77 & altho I didn't really know why until recently, I always found matching drivers (& vertical stacking) sounded best.
I tried the most commonly seen 410 & 115 rig numerous times & wasn't ever as impressed as when I used 2x15"s, or 2 x 410's & NOW 2 or 3 X 1x12"s impresses more than any 210 or 410 & 115 rig has.
I ain't no white coat, but I know what I like...