Enjoy the benefits of a premium membership!
Upgrade Account
-
TalkBass has been independent since 1998. Add your voice.
Create a free account to reply to discussions, view embedded media, and browse with fewer display ads.
Join free Log in
Want zero display ads or expanded classifieds tools? Compare plans.
A more defined sounding P-bass. HOW?
- Thread starter Kelpie
- Start date
I agree with selling it and finding something that will suit your situation better. You may find something I like an HH Stingray more to your liking. But the alternative to that would be some quarter pounders and active pre-amp. Try maybe some DR Low Riders, too
Personally, I've never understood why people want to "cut through the mix". I'd much rather "support the mix". Give it the big, fat, rump shaking foundation it needs. And I've found that when I do this, people can still hear every note clearly. Most soundmen go for a "clicky" sounding kick drum, so a big fat bass sound compliments that. Opposites...they are what makes the music move. Now if the drummer was using a felt beater on a natural skinned head or something, I'd go for a brighter sound...but 99.9% of the time, the fat bass sound is what works...what makes people walk to the bar in time to the music without even realizing it.
However, if you MUST have a bright, "cut through the mix" bass sounds, stainless steel strings will help that...as others have suggested.
Best of luck to you !
However, if you MUST have a bright, "cut through the mix" bass sounds, stainless steel strings will help that...as others have suggested.
Best of luck to you !
Personally, I've never understood why people want to "cut through the mix". I'd much rather "support the mix". Give it the big, fat, rump shaking foundation it needs. And I've found that when I do this, people can still hear every note clearly. Most soundmen go for a "clicky" sounding kick drum, so a big fat bass sound compliments that. Opposites...they are what makes the music move. Now if the drummer was using a felt beater on a natural skinned head or something, I'd go for a brighter sound...but 99.9% of the time, the fat bass sound is what works...what makes people walk to the bar in time to the music without even realizing it.
However, if you MUST have a bright, "cut through the mix" bass sounds, stainless steel strings will help that...as others have suggested.
Best of luck to you !
I can try to help you understand. I'm going to make an assumption that you are a rock bassist. This is why it might be hard for you to relate to the role of bass in other genres like Funk, Soul, RnB, Jazz...especially smooth jazz. Often in rock music, the bass essentially plays a supporting role to the guitar. However, bass ays a very different, and more prominent role in the genres above. The tonal requirements are also very different. Different genres require different approaches musically and tonally.
Actually, I play rock, country, have played funk, soul, Motown, etc. With about 3500 gigs under my belt, I've played quite a few styles of music. I still always believe that job #1 for the bass is to support the song and make the booty shake. But that's MY opinion, and yours is just as valid as mine for your situation.
Something cheap you might try is to replace the tone pot with a no-load pot. When you rotate all the way to the detent, it basically bypasses the tone pot, sending everything your pickup offers to your pedals/amp/foh. You'll lose the mud and gain definition. If that doesn't help then maybe try another pickup / bass / etc ...
Short of buying a J bass, you need to put a J pickup in that P. Sorry, but it's the truth. I have over 32,000 posts, so you know that's a fact.
Actually, I play rock, country, have played funk, soul, Motown, etc. With about 3500 gigs under my belt, I've played quite a few styles of music. I still always believe that job #1 for the bass is to support the song and make the booty shake. But that's MY opinion, and yours is just as valid as mine for your situation.
Not to beat a dead horse, but to drill a little deeper into this...bass players that play in rock bands and country bands that do funk, soul, Motown etc...it's a whole different feel from from the way funk, soul bands do funk. To hear a funk band play Superstitious is a whole different vibe than hearing a band rooted in rock do it. It becomes a distorted guitar rock sounding song and the groove and feel is VERY different...night and day really. I certainly don't know your musical background or what bands you have played in or whatever. I'm really just trying to make a general point; but the guys I know ROOTED in funk, jazz, RnB, Soul, Motown definitely want to cut thru
Believe me, I "get" what you're saying. I honestly wasn't even referring to "rock or country bands attempting to play soul, funk, etc". I was talking only about my personal experience having played in rock, country, motown, soul, and funk bands. I've never played in a neo-soul band though...that'd kinda be fun...I dig the flow of the bass lines in general. Oh, and also, I'm DEFINITELY not saying I go for a "tubby, non-distinct" tone...only one that has some round, warm low end.
Diversity makes the world go 'round.
T
That's a good distinction...when think of 'cut thru' I'm with you. I also think of it as really any tone where each note is clearly heard and defined. It can range from a Jaco tone to a big fat Neo Soul tone...as long as the notes are clear.
Believe me, I "get" what you're saying. I honestly wasn't even referring to "rock or country bands attempting to play soul, funk, etc". I was talking only about my personal experience having played in rock, country, motown, soul, and funk bands. I've never played in a neo-soul band though...that'd kinda be fun...I dig the flow of the bass lines in general. Oh, and also, I'm DEFINITELY not saying I go for a "tubby, non-distinct" tone...only one that has some round, warm low end.
Diversity makes the world go 'round.
That's a good distinction...when think of 'cut thru' I'm with you. I also think of it as really any tone where each note is clearly heard and defined. It can range from a Jaco tone to a big fat Neo Soul tone...as long as the notes are clear.
For a clearer, better defined tone from your Pbass you need to boost the upper, upper mids - 1.5-2kHz. Most amps have an upper mids control that is not effective this high. Of my 6 bass amps, only one does this. If you have an amp with upper mids boost in that range you will get a clearer, better articulated tone from your Pbass. Changing the cap on the Pbass tone control won't get you there as that only alters the frequency where cutting begins (a tone control only cuts - it cannot boost). Of course, changing pups and strings opens up a whole world of change.
When I want "a more defined sounding P-bass", I play a Jazz. I'm pretty sure that's exactly what Leo invented it for.
This I tend to agree with. P's and J's are different animals and sometimes u bring the J...sometimes the P. Depends on the gig.
these are the right answers.
500k volume, 500k or even no-load tone pots will bring out the attack and "character" of the bass. in the mix it'll sound more like "P-bass" instead of just "bass".
roll your tone back to like "7" to get right back to the original sound.
500k volume, 500k or even no-load tone pots will bring out the attack and "character" of the bass. in the mix it'll sound more like "P-bass" instead of just "bass".
roll your tone back to like "7" to get right back to the original sound.
Dude, OP, I had this exact problem. Granite I have active EMG's in my P and a maple fb, but even after these things, I was having issues cutting in the mix. My P sat in it extremely well. But it wasn't present. As present as I wanted/needed it. So I started asking the same question you did. I haven't read through this thread so sorry if I'm repeating or echoing anyone. But for me, it was all about EQ. I run my P through a GK 1001rb II. While I love my amp, it didn't have the EQ stretch I needed for my P. So I kept digging and asking. I tried a few things. They didn't seem to work the way I wanted them to. Someone told me I needed an EQ with the 800hz freq. so I got a source audio programmable EQ. That's all it took. I'm cutting through like a hot knife through warm butter. Kicking the mix right in the balls. I'm super happy. Not saying you need an SA PEQ but, IMO, getting an external EQ will get you where you wanna go. I guess I should go back and see if you named the amp you're using. If your amp has a graphic EQ, you should be good. It's all about that 500-800hz upper mids range I believe. I hope that "hz" is the right term.
Killing gods
Killing gods
I play a 4003, but also own a P bass.
No load tone pot, VERY high value volume pot(I use 10meg - it's an on/off switch now) and get an eq and boost somewhere from 2-3K
Everyone suggests 800hz-1K, but that is upper end of the body of your sound and will probably change the inherent sound of your P. 2K+ will bring out definition.
[Invalid or Expired Link Removed]
And Fralin pickups sound very defined and sweet on a Precision. If I didn't have my Ric, it would be a nice P with Fralins for sure.
No load tone pot, VERY high value volume pot(I use 10meg - it's an on/off switch now) and get an eq and boost somewhere from 2-3K
Everyone suggests 800hz-1K, but that is upper end of the body of your sound and will probably change the inherent sound of your P. 2K+ will bring out definition.
[Invalid or Expired Link Removed]
And Fralin pickups sound very defined and sweet on a Precision. If I didn't have my Ric, it would be a nice P with Fralins for sure.
You're going to get a boatload of advice that is going to be all over the place.
Short answer: Lighter gauge strings, back the pickups away from the strings (may reduce output but greatly increases clarity), then work on your amplification chain to work any remaining mud out of your tone (EQ, amp and cabinet selection, location of amp in room, etc).
Don't butcher a perfectly good Precision with Jazz pickups. Get a Jazz if you think you want to add that janky burp and scratch clank and 2 pickup phasing stuff to "cut through". IMO of course. I'm a Precision junky so take it for what it's worth.
Good luck.
Short answer: Lighter gauge strings, back the pickups away from the strings (may reduce output but greatly increases clarity), then work on your amplification chain to work any remaining mud out of your tone (EQ, amp and cabinet selection, location of amp in room, etc).
Don't butcher a perfectly good Precision with Jazz pickups. Get a Jazz if you think you want to add that janky burp and scratch clank and 2 pickup phasing stuff to "cut through". IMO of course. I'm a Precision junky so take it for what it's worth.
Good luck.
When I had an MIA P, I searched for the perfect "thump/cut" mix, and found it with a Fralin Pickup. They have more punch and low end clarity than the Fender pickups I've tried, and one of these or the other "modern vintage" pickups like Nordstrand would probably help. I'd start with strings though, and FWIW I've found that DR Fat Beams are wonderful on P-basses (now a G&L SB-2 in my case), and SS Lo-Riders might be great to maximize cut. Otherwise, an outboard pre like Sadowsky, or other signal processing, could help. With a different bass that I found hard to get right in the mix (a G&L L-1500), I got wonderful results with an Aphex Bass Xciter, but I'm not sure how it would do with a P-bass.
