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A shocking experience!

Oh this is an old wive's tale... I hate this sort of stuff, the point of this is you cant do squat with one hand tied behind your back... This is a joke. A smart technician will keep both hands available to work on any project but keep his fingers off the hot spots.

HMMMMMMMM.......... I work (now) with high power motor drives and generator controls........ 800V bus, 200 HP output, 480 to 600V AC, that sort of stuff....

YES BY GOLLY I DO have one hand out of trouble when I have to do certain things, like probe around with the power on..... (technically it's illegal.... OSHA etc, but you gotta do what you gotta do sometimes).

So do all the other engineers and techs I have worked with when doing similar stuff, and they are all still around annoying the rest of us......

Otherwise I shut down power and move the meter lead.....

I have personally seen people who did NOT do that get shocked halfway into next week. So far I have not had to use that CPR class, thankfully........

But it won't do much good if your shoes are not good insulators......
 
Anyone that would like to use both hands around live cicuits be my guest. It only takes one time to prove yourself wrong. You can debunk all you care to, I've lost one repair buddy and a transmitter test tech. That's two friends funerals to many to be a macho "I know what I'm doing guy". Tell your families I don't want an invite.
 
HMMMMMMMM.......... I work (now) with high power motor drives and generator controls........ 800V bus, 200 HP output, 480 to 600V AC, that sort of stuff....

YES BY GOLLY I DO have one hand out of trouble when I have to do certain things, like probe around with the power on..... (technically it's illegal.... OSHA etc, but you gotta do what you gotta do sometimes).

So do all the other engineers and techs I have worked with when doing similar stuff, and they are all still around annoying the rest of us......

Otherwise I shut down power and move the meter lead.....

I have personally seen people who did NOT do that get shocked halfway into next week. So far I have not had to use that CPR class, thankfully........

But it won't do much good if your shoes are not good insulators......

Well yeah I'm not saying get into gear with both hands and start probing around. You have to know WHAT YOU ARE LOOKING AT and know what you are doing.

Jerrold you weren't sitting on one hand everytime you worked on an SVT head, lets get real. You knew exactly what you are looking at and where not to stick a hand. When YOU MOVE the clip on lead you can flip the thing off.

I used to be a dealer for a motor control manufacturer and the largest unit I ever commisioned was a pair of 150 HP units.

They were pretty cool, the motors would make full torque at 1RPM. That however would rattle the whole building BOOM BOOM BOOM as each phase clicked by, we only did that once.

The FET's in those controllers were as big as your fist.

Also the check list for startup was like 10 pages in the manual and when you were done going through the checklist, the last thing was stand back and flip the go switch... Pretty interesting. back in 1988 the price for a blown fet was about $1250 each if I remember correctly. It was not something you wanted to do.

That explosion in miami was really something. We were doing a control system in the MARRIOT INFLIGHT KITCHEN in 1980. Thats where the meals for airlines are prepared. They leave the Marriot building in the trucks you see that jack up next to the airliners.

Well the remodel of this kitchen had a new power service going in. There was a pair of electricians working in the power room, both finisihing up two different panels. Because it was about 85 degrees and 85% humidity and the air wasn't up yet the guys were working in shorts, tennis shoes with no socks and no shirts.

The main guy finished up his panel and it was time to light up the main. What nobody knew was there had been some shipping damage to this monster service panel. Apparently the bus bars for the three phase were now cocked in the box and were closer at the bottom than they should have been.

I wasn't in the room, but he had the front of the panel off and heated it up. The arc started at the bottom like across a human hair of some crap that wasnt seen and flashed up melting the bus bars as it went.

The UV light that was given off, like a giant arcwelder. Gave the second man facing the other panel severe sunburn all over his back and legs to the point of blisters.

The guy who was in front of the panel. I saw him sitting on the curb outside waiting for the ambulance, holding his arms out and bent up at the elbows. The flesh just hanging loose from the bones completely cooked. It was ready to fall off just like a well cooked set of ribs. 1st Second and third degree burns everywhere and no hair.

I have a lot of respect for power.

BOB
 
I got zapped by 800v by accidentally touching the anode cap on a tube in an old amp. Threw me across the room about 6 feet onto my arse. Knocked me out for a few seconds and was in a daze the rest of the night. Left a couple nice rf burns on my thumb too.

But back to topic. A couple years ago, I thought that 120vac was a joke. Sure, I knew if I dropped a toaster in the bathtub it would be bad, but never did I think it could be bad dry. Boy, was I wrong. I grounded out a 120vac circuit while changing a plug in the house. Thought the power was off. Still, I'll take that over the tube amp mishap me and my cat both endured. Cats are curious. Amp was on, top was off. Cat walks across table into amp that is on. Cat is shot about 8 feet in the air straight up like a rocket. Cat not happy when it lands.:hmm: Cats do have 9 lives.
 
OK so now we are telling Electrical Fishing Stories.

Back in the 70's we were moving a set of Hz Generators that were powered off of 230 3 Phase AC. These were very very ancient devices that used variable Hz to change speed of a set of Quill Winders.

I remember it like it was yesterday. Good ol Woody Franklin lugged the wires together in the trough which was the last thing to do. Somehow he lugged the six hots from the machines together and the six hots from the 400 amp breaker panel together.

So anyway we throw the main Breaker then each breaker for the two machines and nothing happens til we hit the last breaker then all hell breaks loose. Sounded like an Air Raid over London in WWII complete with bombs going off. Not sure why the breakers did not kick, or the jacks didnt trip on the pole, but the Tranformers blew and what can only be called an experience from WWIII. Shut down power over half of Downtown Calhoun.

It was funny after it was over with but it wasnt funny when it was happening. No one was hurt and that is the important thing.
 
"Say WHAT? You were cordless and got lit up? I think there was a thunderstorm and a lightning strike nearby, especially to dim the lights. I'd believe your vision dimmed but not the lights..."

If you check the first word of the last paragraph it explains what I do now "wireless". This happened 35 years ago. Weather was warm,dry, and sunny. The arc from the mic to my lips and teeth also corresponded exactly to when the lights dimmed and then returned. It seemed like the shock lasted at least 30 but it was probably 5-10 seconds. I pulled away, but believe me it took every effort of my determination to get off that SHOCK. My hands were welded to the strings. My feet were welded to the ground. Nothing else in the room dimmed except the lights and my future if I didn't get free. Sorry, no lightning strike. :eek:
 
This is part of the reason I use a foam pop filter on my mic ...only took once or twice to get zapped on the lips to figure out I didn't like it. :D.

Back in the day I was in "Redbone", a native American group (Come and Get Your Love) and we were opening for Cheech and Chong in Ames, IA or thereabouts. It was a June evening and thunderstorms were blowing up and the stage was covered but everything was wet. Roadie handed me my '72 P and I walked up to the mike, hands on the strings and an arc about 6 inches jumped from my face to the mike. I was okay, dazzed and confused, but they put a foam cover on and we proceeded to play. Have always used one since.
 
99% it's the lamp.....

2 things that happen.......

1) the paper insulation tube between the lamp screw-in part and the outer metal shell gets broken or tears..... letting the shell touch the metal when you yank the pull-chain.

2) the lamp doesn't have a polarized plug (or is mis-wired), and gets plugged-in so the screw-shell is hot..... (the little center part is supposed to be hot, and the screw-shell on the neutral)

it's a stupid construction, from about 1900, but there are millions of them out there.....

I agree 100% with Jerrold. Lamps use the cheap, ancient technology.
That lamp chain should have been insulated or, at the very least, tied
to the return side of the outlet through a polarized plug. That lamp is
almost undoubtedly the source of your problem.

And while it is true that amps, not volts, kill. It takes volts to get
those amps to flow through your body. The lowest voltage known
to have killed a man was 42 volts. 120 volts can easily be fatal.
 
The most shocking story that I have is from when I worked as a hardware engineer on computer systems, back in the days when you had to use voltmeters and oscilloscopes to fix room fulls of equipment to component level rather than swap out circuit boards.

We also had to fix all the peripherals and I was called out to fix a big dot matrix printer that had a dead power supply. These things used to create a huge amount of noise so they had a big heavy soundproof lid that you could lift up like the hood on a car to work underneath it. Underneath there was a further casing over the power supply which I removed. The power supply was mounted horizontally, and once the cover was off you could see the back of the PSU circuit board. Also on the back of the circuit board were the heads of 1/4" cap head screws which connected several big capacitors onto the circuit board.

One of these capacitors was whistling, so obviously on it's way out - a known fault that was usually the cause of the dead power supply. I put my head down close to the back of the board to listen to which cap was whistling. Now normally, there was a very thin sheet of clear perspex over the back of the circuit board which insulated the back of the board, but I didn't notice that on this particular printer, it was missing.

As I tried to listen, I caught my chin on one of the capacitor studs. It was like getting a right hander from Mike Tyson and I shot back really hard, only to crack the back of my head on the heavy soundroof cover above me. This caused a reflex action to duck back down and I caught my chin on the stud again and yes....you guessed it, cracked the back of my head again. Fortunately, I managed to stop ducking back down again or I could have been oscillating all day :rolleyes:

I was pretty sore afterwards I can tell you
 
RB......

That story is a textbook case illustrating the reason for "arc flash' regulations now......

Most of the "live mic" stories can be traced back to a few causes...

1) a soundman who decides he's had it with hum, and puts "ground lifters" on everything.

2) a bar where the wiring just sort of "grew", possibly put in by the owner.

3) venues where the bozo electricians put in surface boxes and didn't "pigtail" the covers to the boxes...... so after the last painting of the walls (and boxes, of course) the contact isn't very good......
 
my teacher used to electricute students as a demo
Really?! A demo for who, the local morgue?

From http://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/electrocute...
elec·tro·cute Listen to the pronunciation of electrocute
Pronunciation:
\i-ˈlek-trə-ˌkyüt\
Function:
transitive verb
Inflected Form(s):
elec·tro·cut·ed; elec·tro·cut·ing
Etymology:
electr- + -cute (as in execute)
Date:
1889

1 : to execute (a criminal) by electricity

2 : to kill by electric shock

Take a break from the BS dude, this is a serious topic.
 
Jools, send me your address, I'm sending you one of my motorcycle helmets... Thats the serviceman's story from hell if I ever heard one. I'm sure I could think up one of over the years if I think long enough.

OK, about 6 months ago. Carrying my home computer into my office to do some work on it. I'm walking from one higher parking lot to the the lower lot down the driveway, (This is because some ******* parked in my reserved spot) I'm talking to one of the office gals as I walk, step off the drive and into a pothole... I go down on my left hip, oh yeah I'm in shorts. Land on my blackberry, throw the computer straight ahead and it skids across the lot pieces flying everywhere.

Busted Blackberry, twisted ankle, skined knee, skined up forearm, twisted back, 10" bruise where the blackberry nuked my thigh and the gal looks at me and says, "BOB are you OK?" My answer was, NOOOOO... I think I'm really hurt this time.

Oh that was thursday and we left for the Indy 500 Saturday morning and parked a mile from the track. My Partner was an 87 year old guy and its hard to say who was faster. We had his GS and my Son along and we were constantly telling them to slow down.

Where's the electrical part of this one? Well... I was carrying electrical gear. Milka Duno and Danika Patrick got into an electrically charged fight? OK, well, I think we've worked this topic over pretty good. Where's Kelly when you need him. BOB
 
The most shocking story that I have is from when I worked as a hardware engineer on computer systems, back in the days when you had to use voltmeters and oscilloscopes to fix room fulls of equipment to component level rather than swap out circuit boards.

We also had to fix all the peripherals and I was called out to fix a big dot matrix printer that had a dead power supply. These things used to create a huge amount of noise so they had a big heavy soundproof lid that you could lift up like the hood on a car to work underneath it. Underneath there was a further casing over the power supply which I removed. The power supply was mounted horizontally, and once the cover was off you could see the back of the PSU circuit board. Also on the back of the circuit board were the heads of 1/4" cap head screws which connected several big capacitors onto the circuit board.

One of these capacitors was whistling, so obviously on it's way out - a known fault that was usually the cause of the dead power supply. I put my head down close to the back of the board to listen to which cap was whistling. Now normally, there was a very thin sheet of clear perspex over the back of the circuit board which insulated the back of the board, but I didn't notice that on this particular printer, it was missing.

As I tried to listen, I caught my chin on one of the capacitor studs. It was like getting a right hander from Mike Tyson and I shot back really hard, only to crack the back of my head on the heavy soundroof cover above me. This caused a reflex action to duck back down and I caught my chin on the stud again and yes....you guessed it, cracked the back of my head again. Fortunately, I managed to stop ducking back down again or I could have been oscillating all day :rolleyes:

I was pretty sore afterwards I can tell you

I dont care who ya are that was funny. That sounds like one of my days. Glad to hear your still with us.


You guys wish me luck I'm trying out for a new Band tonight in Atlanta. My old band is just about Petered out. I want to do more playing than they do evidently. Going to be making music with a couple of guys freshly graduated from AIM. Hoping it works out.
 
RB......

That story is a textbook case illustrating the reason for "arc flash' regulations now......

Most of the "live mic" stories can be traced back to a few causes...

1) a soundman who decides he's had it with hum, and puts "ground lifters" on everything.

2) a bar where the wiring just sort of "grew", possibly put in by the owner.

3) venues where the bozo electricians put in surface boxes and didn't "pigtail" the covers to the boxes...... so after the last painting of the walls (and boxes, of course) the contact isn't very good......

Isn't the rule for singing guitarists to touch the guitar pickups to the microphone before attempting to sing? I was reading that if two plugs are out of phase it will cause a loop, and that the pickups will get the arc before your lips if that's the case. Or that best practice is to make sure all your equipment is plugged into the same outlet to eliminate phase problems?

~S
 
That's why I sold off my Sunn 2000, it still had the suicide cord and switch. My guitardist said eveything was setup and ready to go, I had come straight from work.
First song I came up to the mike for backups and the lights dimmed (my lights) and my lip hurt like hell. Never trust a guitardist........
 
Isn't the rule for singing guitarists to touch the guitar pickups to the microphone before attempting to sing? I was reading that if two plugs are out of phase it will cause a loop, and that the pickups will get the arc before your lips if that's the case. Or that best practice is to make sure all your equipment is plugged into the same outlet to eliminate phase problems?

~S

All newer stuff won't have the problems, unless it is A) bad or B) plugged into a ground lifter.

The old stuff has problems because most of it was/is 2 wire, no ground. Sometimes a capacitor is connected to a switch, so that if you put the switch the right way, the currents cancel out........ Only if they don't, you can get a zap from leakage.

Only in the latter case is the "polarity", (what you called "phase" ) important. Not only does old stuff have 2 wire cords, a lot of it isn't "polarized", the plug goes in either way.... so the leakage I mentioned may be opposite on two pieces of equipment. If you get between them, you get the zap.

NO three-wire stuff should EVER give a zap..... unless the ground pin was broken off "because it hummed".......

REALLY new two wire stuff is "double-insulated" , passes UL/CE/c-tick etc and also won't cause problems with zapping (unless it's defective).

The one outlet deal is more with three-wire and hum.