Double Bass Advice on learning/practicing...

[sloppysubs]

Hello friends,

This may be a long post, and I apologize in advance for that, however, I feel that I need the greater wisdom of other DB players.

I am currently in a situation where I still play and record, but I do not tour/play out or any of that anymore. That said, I am finally trying to do my due diligence and actually learn how to play my DB (I am more often getting asked to use it over EB for projects). I have played EB since I was 11 (I'm 37 now) and have fooled with DB for the last 10 years on and off. I have had 2 or 3 teachers whom were all quite talented but never could seem to make things click for me. When I started as a kid with EB lessons, I foolishly bucked learning the basics and thus cannot read sheet music and don't know scales, etc. It is (now) embarrassing and (likely) inhibiting me (I think).

I have returned to trying to teach myself with practice being one hour every night M-F. Before I play I try to stretch my hand and arms and all that. I do work on posture and stance. And then... I sorta falter. I have the Simandl books, beginner books, intonation plus books, jazz standard books and all that... but I can't read sheet. I do try, I don't just give up, but it takes me 4 times longer to work through anything if I'm making an honest effort to read the sheet and not the tab/finger numbers. This often results in feeling frustrated and feeling like I am making little progress.

From this point I have moved to trying to take songs I know on EB and apply them DB. I found this to be an alright exercise but underwhelming. Currently I am attempting to learn jazz songs on the DB. I have started off with alternating between "So What" and "Acknowledgement", both of which are more challenging than I had thought them to be. Previous to this time I have never even learned a jazz song on EB; surely another error, ha. I am enjoying this process much more than applying EB tunes to DB. I am not without my challenges though:

I don't see much available sheet music in the way for many of these jazz tunes. "So What" is in my jazz standard book, but not "Acknowledgement". Moreover, I find virtually no tabs or even walk through/play along vids on YouTube. I do my best to put my ears to work, though with the recording techniques of the day, the bass part isn't always audible or distinguishable. Also, I have some fairly gnarly tinnitus and outside the comforts of my own home am often wearing ear plugs. I don't think this is a breaker, it is just another challenge to overcome.

From the perspective of the collective wisdom of the DB community: what is the best way for me to move forward in this is practice? Do I forgo learning sheet for ear practice, working through scales and learning tunes off the record? Do I labor over learning sheet? What is important at this point? What would help me get better at this instrument I so love and yet struggle with?

I should mention in closing that right around the time I began playing DB officially (10 years or so ago) I broke my left (fretting) hand in a soccer game: my left hand moves much slower than it did and even this many years on with practice and playing, I still get soreness, cramps and all that on occasion.

I also tend to lean toward the bassists and sounds of the new thing. Jimmy Garrison, Henry Grimes, Ronnie Boykins, Stafford James etc. I love Wilbur Ware and Monk's guys, Paul Chambers, etc. etc. etc. I just happen to really lean into the "weirder" stuff. That said, on many of those free jazz records (seeing as that I don't know theory) those guys are all over with seemingly no rhyme or reason, though I know it does exist. How does one practice to become a decent or even talented free jazz player? How is the playing of these musicians looked at one whole? Does the community look at this as noise or as music with a benefit if learned? Or what about Charlie Haden's performance on "Earth" with Alice Coltrane? How is the monolithic groove bass player looked at?

I know this was rambling. I have a cornucopia of questions as it relates to learning DB and what to learn/aim for. Thank all of you for reading and helping, I am looking forward to continuing to learn and improve, hopefully with more discernible progress and a greater sense of confidence in my ability on the instrument.

THANK YOU.

 

[oren]

My personal opinion, as another player who came to double bass later rather than earlier (started in my mid-40s) after many years of electric:

I think it’s important to learn some proper technique on the instrument (my first teacher said “This is a big instrument, and it will hurt you if you don’t play it properly, but fortunately we have two hundred years of schooling on how to play it right”). I also think that if you want to play jazz, it will be very helpful to acquire some basic skill in reading music. The good news is that you should be able to work on both of those goals together, by finding a teacher who will work with you through one of the methods for learning bass (many teachers use Simandl, but there are others). Go talk to a few teachers in your area, and be specific about your goals, and see who feels right for you. Don’t be afraid to be taken back to the very beginning, despite your years of electric playing. Last year I decided to finally start work on learning the bow, and I found a local teacher who started me right back at Mary Had A Little Lamb and the first page of Simandl. Be prepared for regular daily practice - the upright doesn’t forgive taking days off if you want to develop tolerable intonation.

The good news is that the ears you’ve developed playing electric and your experience in filling the role of a bass player in musical contexts will help you to make progress and to enjoy the instrument. I hope you have a great time!

 

[AGCurry]

As one who played DB for decades without reading music and without a single lesson...

When I retired from my non-music career, I decided I would learn to play DB properly. I found a teacher, found a bow, started practicing every day, and joined an orchestra.

It kicked my tuches - still does! - but it's a worthwhile commitment. When I get discouraged about the pace of improvement, I ask myself "What else am I doing?"

The thing about reading (I get your frustration - I'm not very good at it myself) is that it provides a path to the other important stuff like fingering, bowing, string crossings, intonation, etc. ... getting to that other stuff without reading might be possible, but it's much harder, if for no other reason than almost all of the pedagogic material uses it.

FIND A TEACHER. My teacher uses Simandl but he's not limited to it. The George Vance curriculum is good in that you play actual songs, as is the Suzuki method. Pretend you're in kindergarten... it takes as long as it takes. You may be different, but I find that having a teacher adds incentive - I don't want to disappoint him, so I try harder (practice more).

 

[Papageno]

As said by others, find a teacher to guide you with proper left hand and right hand technique (trying to transfer what you know from EB would simply not work well; in the worst case you may hurt yourself, and/or have hard time playing in tune).

I would recommend learning to read (bass clef to start with). This is no as difficult as you seem to believe, if you go for it progressively. Besides this:
- learn your fingerboard (all the notes up to the octave harmonics, then it repeats)
- learn and practice your scales, modes, arpeggios
- learn and practice walking bass lines (some theory background would be good for this, as understanding harmony makes this much easier).

 

[Carl Hillman]

What is important at this point?

Grab a bow and Simandl and start at the beginning of the book. This will give you a technical base and teach you to read. (whole notes at first. we all had to do it.) Take weekly lessons with a teacher, preferably an orchestral player.

As far as jazz playing goes, for right now set aside time to listen daily. I'd suggest concentrating on music with recognizable forms and harmony for now. As a teacher once told me, you should be able to play inside before you can play outside.
Focus in on just a few classic albums you like and really get to know them...to the point where you can pretty much sing the solos.

You should also see if you can possibly practice more than just an hour a day.

 

[g-dude]

The first step to sight reading is to start learning where the open strings are.

Once you have a great grasp on that, the other notes start to become easier.

If you have some Real Books, focus on simply learning how to play the melodies to songs you recognize.

 

[sloppysubs]

All of this is great information. Thank all of y'all.

It's good to know that other people understand and empathize. Really glad for the extra confidence boost to hang in for the long ride.

Thank you again.

 

[Dogfightgiggle]

I can’t read well either so I put the Zimmerman edition of the Beethoven symphonies and the Bellson Rhythm book back on my stand. I’ll cycle in other things too here and there.

Do you have a “mastery project”, a piece of music that you are going to spend the next year or two boring into?

 

[sloppysubs]

I can’t read well either so I put the Zimmerman edition of the Beethoven symphonies and the Bellson Rhythm book back on my stand. I’ll cycle in other things too here and there.

Do you have a “mastery project”, a piece of music that you are going to spend the next year or two boring into?

At this time I don't have any larger, one particular project. That said, as I am working through "So What" and "Acknowledgement" I will likely just move into taking on A Love Supreme in its entirety.