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Age Issue rears it's ugly head after audition.

Wow, I am not usually around on the weekends, surprised this is still getting as many posts as it is.

OK, next Band Meeting/rehersal is on Wednesday night. We will be having a discussion at that time. I was talking to the other Guitar/bass player in the group and he agreed with me that we were a little quick on the draw there. We will be talking this out with him. He is outvoted but in no way is he "Winning Anyway" We are just not placing a tonne of urgency on anything. we are taking a relaxed approach.

I haven't contacted the singer/bass player yet but will this week. I am not going to leave that as it is I really would like to play with them again. I will do this Thursday after the band meeting so we can all put our cards on the table. I will let the guys know that I am going to call them. They can choose to join me or not and it will not effect our current hang, I have room for two gigs if it comes to that.

The Guitar player is a good guy and it is easy to read into his motives from behind the computer screen but if you knew him you would know most of these scenarios do not apply. Obviously there is something bothering him about it and we will with luck discover that on Wednesday. It does not have to be a confrontation or argument. I do agree with those of you that said we should really sit down and discuss our goals as a group. That has not been done and it could help a lot with these situatitions.

Now, To address those of you who think there is some issue of class between an email or phone call...... Some of you might just want to skip the rest of the email as it is going off topic....


<Rant>

The guitar player made contact with the singer. It was done online. they exchanged email and links to songs we would do and when the night came for them to come we gave them the address in an email and everything worked out perfectly. What is it with you insecure attention seekers that everything has to happen in person or directly in your ears? We don't email in music which most of you can't read, it's in english. Why are you so afraid of email. I strongly contend that you simply need your chance to throw a tantrum like a child or have some stupid last word and if denied of that you get all stupid and say people have no class.

Email was perfectly fine for every bit of communication up to the decision, why suddenly was it not good enough at the end? You people claiming a phone call somehow shows class? Well, to be blunt, Class is something you obviously are not familliar with. Intelligent people only require the communication, not a soapbox to react to the news on.

I personally will never discriminate on age but regardless of how old someone is if they pull this luddite crap where they try to shame those of us using technology into staying back in the dark ages by using older communications methods is simply not hip enough to play with. I'll vote you out the second you start that crap because I will see you are just holding open your spot to get the last word in or throw a tantrum and people who covet that are pretty lame to me.

The people demanding the phone call over email are the same dorks that 10 years ago were crying when calls were made instead of face to face. Get over it, you do not own MY time and get no say in how much of it is used telling you it isn't going to work out.

Nothing shows a lack of class like pointing fingers at others and saying they have no class just because you are not getting your own petty way...

</Rant>

Now back to our regularly scheduled programming....

Have a great day everyone.

-eSmith.

E-mail is good for most communications, thtere might be a few instances where face to face or a phone call might be better.

For me, I like e-mail and everyone in the band using it.It's the best tool for closing the loops.

when I run across these guys that don't use e-mail when it's the protocol for comunication between band members it concerns me.

Also from where I stand it's people my age that understand the technology and use it.It just makes things easier.

For example when I see someone paying a stack of bills with envelopes and all these things called stamps, it just seems dated and weird to me.
 
@ 37 i would have no problem playing with someone that old if he played the same kind of music I liked. Dunno if i can say anything to anyone who isnt comfortable playing with someone that old though. I know ive had issues in the past with playing with young singers. That is more of a no tolerance for immaturity thing though and we had a 20yo chick who had so much drama I didnt want to deal with it.
 
For example when I see someone paying a stack of bills with envelopes and all these things called stamps, it just seems dated and weird to me.

No offence, but you've never been screwed by online banking, have you? I have and I'll never trust it again.

To me there are 4 different levels of communications that you can use here:
Face to face.
Phone call.
Email.
Text.

With face to face and phone calls, you can (depending on the relative communication skills of the parties involved) pretty much work things out right away. Emails and text messages are really open to miss-interpretation. I highly doubt that there's anyone on this board that hasn't had a email, text or post miss-read or thought "I should have phrased that better" after hitting the submit button. While this doesn't happen all the time, it does happen. When you're in a band, it's less likely that an email or text will be read wrong because they deal with you all the time and know you're communication style.

Just use technology with care and you'll be all right, for the most part.
 
Such a fun thread.

Older &#8800; better/experienced
I'm 44 and inexperienced in music/bands, I'm a late boomer and started music but a few years ago. I've played with people half my age who have twice the experience I have (and chops beyond my ken), I learned a lot from them and remain grateful for the experience. The bands I'm in have no discrimination issues with age, gender, creed, repertoire ... perhaps not even musicianship since I'm in them. In fact, I've never come across any discrimination in my limited experience of jams and gigs. How fortunate I am, judging from this thread.

Speaking of judging...
It is also understandable that a boy-band wouldn't want Lee Sklar and his great grey bearded visage when the rest of the band members barely have face fuzz and the market of the band is pubescent girls.

"Communication Breakdown, it's always the same."
Avenues of communication do not matter when there is a misunderstanding. It is what it is; whether that misunderstanding came about during a face-to-face or in a hand-delivered guilded envelope sealed with stamped wax.

"Gee, I should've worded that differently"
At least with a text-based missive, you can write it, leave it, come back to it, edit it, refine it.

Face-to-face, what's been said cannot be taken back just as an email sent cannot be recalled. It's been my experience that you may plan what you're going to say, but it never comes out quite the way you rehearsed it in your mind. For whatever it's worth, I prefer face-to-face over other avenues of communication, but not by much.

Each situation must be dealt with according to its own merits.

Play on,
FF
 
Turns out he's 64 but I swear you would never guess he's that old. He's got a hip look for a blues band and would look fine in our lineup.

So after they leave and we do the band meeting thing, our lead guitar player states he doesn't think it will work, the guy is too old.

What do you guys think?

I think that you don't actually have an "age issue". You have an "idiot guitard issue"... :rolleyes: :eyebrow:

MM
 
Well, We had a chat about it. Guitar payer definatly has issues. When asked he literally said the at 64 he feels you can't be creative...... :rollno: He thinks we hit our creative peak in our 20's and it receeds from there and by 64 you got nothing left..... :hmm:

Needless to say, we didn't agree at all. I asked him where he got the data on that and so far no source has been provided. I made sure to remind him he is getting there himself.

In Any event, thats broken. I am going to still jam with them because it really is a fun hang but on the musical side of things I'm going to expand and jam with others when I can. The jamspace is mine and I'm there every night, as a group we get together once a week so I have 6 open nights a week I could set something up on.

And I agree, it's a guitard issue, not an age issue. There is not one defensible statement he made about age.

Thanks for the advice.

-eSmith.
 
In Any event, thats broken. I am going to still jam with them because it really is a fun hang but on the musical side of things I'm going to expand and jam with others when I can. The jamspace is mine and I'm there every night, as a group we get together once a week so I have 6 open nights a week I could set something up on.

And I agree, it's a guitard issue, not an age issue. There is not one defensible statement he made about age.

Thanks for the advice.

Yeah, this is one of those times when the initial gut reaction was correct.

Good call on your part keeping ties with those two. Maybe you'll get a chance to pursue it sans age-discrimination types and end up making some GREAT MUSIC.

Good luck with everything.
 
Thanks EC, I'm actually writing the email to them now. I hope I'm not too late but will understand if I am. Either way I will do what I can to get the door open a bit. Maybe go see them at an open stage and do a song or two. Stuff like that. Basic Networking.

Ideally, If I could find a group of people who all have over 20 years playing..... Well, I would be honored if they took me under thier wing.

I may see about taking along the guitar/bass player too. He didn't have any issue at all with his age and thought he sounded good like I did.

-eSmith.
 
Well, We had a chat about it. Guitar payer definatly has issues. When asked he literally said the at 64 he feels you can't be creative...... :rollno: He thinks we hit our creative peak in our 20's and it receeds from there and by 64 you got nothing left..... :hmm:
Creativity does peak, depending on the field it might be in the 20s or later. Take a look here, this is a decent summary of the research:

Link Removed

So what, though? Do you really require the drummer to come up with groundbreaking innovations in a blues band?
 
Thanks for the link. Very interesting for sure. I'll have to read it at home tonight, kinda long to read at work, i just scrolled down to the one graph that pretty much agrees with the guitar player.

I would start to wonder if all things are equal. Some people are simply more creative than others and I still think age is meaningless in that.

If one person is incredibly creative at 20 but only mildly creative at 65 and another person has zero creativity at 20... Well a mildly creative old fart is better to me than some 20 year old braindead person. Also, age brings with it far more than creativity, I think I would miss out on a lot if I wasn't willing to listen to those who know more than me, either older or younger.

-eSmith.
 
I'm in a band (I'm 45) and the guys are younger (early 20's) and I'm showing up sober, the lead guy likes to drink. I'm practiced and I keep hearing the lead guy out of tune and last session told me to only play root notes for a song I spent weeks finding fills to make it less boring. I'm getting smart and finding most young musicians are super poor in this economy and bass players are a commodity that should be respected instead of treaded like monkeys.
 
+1 you should call the couple and let them know you enjoyed the jam, and advertise your services as a drummer. they might come up with a good configuration that would work for you.

You can never have too many contacts. Particularly if you're into the blues, roots rock, folk, etc ... lot's of party & pickup gigs. Some of those can be near transcendent just due to a bunch of new energy keeping folks on their toes.

Just make it a low key approach.

oh, yeah - the addendum.. Age does not equal wisdom. I've played with some older cat's that were wonderful. I've played with a few who were too rigid and set in their ways and really couldn't see much beyond the rim of their rut. the real 'take away' is that music has nothing to do with age.

In my setting there are some matters of practicality. I know nothing of pop music in the 90's and early 2000's - I just wasn't interested in it back then. So if someone wants to throw down a quick Greenday/Oasis/______ tune - I probably won't know it - oh sure, I'll be able to fake it after a cycle but I won't own it for a while. Someone wants to thrown down something from the 60's - mid 80's or later 2000's - I'll probably have heard it and will own it by the time we're done with the head. That makes me a good call for some gig's and less so for others. For the record I actually learned a Weezer tune and a Puddle of Mud tune for a gig a few years back...
 
i wouldnt worry about age if you guys are playing covers. However, if you are doing a tribute band thingy or original band with a certain image you wanna follow, then its logical to find someone who fits in aesthetically
 
I think you missed out on a good bassist with his chops together.

Maybe it's okay to not want a 64-year old in your band. How old are the rest of you? The band I was in until last year was comprised of mid twenty-somethings. I'm 35. We had a blast playing music, and gigging.

I left because my wife and I found we were expecting our first child (planned). I also work full-time ("real" job"), and have been going to graduate school at night. The other guys were unmarried, childless, and didn't have school. They had jobs besides the band, but it was a very different lifestyle. They rented apartments. I own a home (meaning...chores, yard work, etc etc etc).

Maybe a 64-year old was just too much of a difference for your lead player. Nothing wrong with that. If you liked the bass player and singer enough you could always replace the lead player.

My band ages run from 19-23 and honestly even a 40 somethings (maybe late 30's) would be to old for us. The age difference makes it difficult to relate and mesh as a group which IMO/IME is an important part of being a successful band. Case in point I played on a praise team that had a variety of ages me being the youngest (17 at the time) to the oldest being late 50's and as a band we could make music but as a group we were never truly unified.