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Age Issue rears it's ugly head after audition.
- Thread starter eSmith
- Start date
I totally agree with what the other folks on here are saying - that it's lame and narrow-minded to reject a player on the basis of age.
The funny thing is that a guy that age probably had his initial musical development (which we never really lose) somewhere between 1962 - 1977.
Err.. like there was no cool music happening between those dates..
and Buddy Holly died in 1959. and Buddy Holly as a derogatory term???!
I thought rock and roll (in it's all-encompassing sense) was supposed to cut across barriers of colour, creed or roots.
I know a band is not a workplace, but it should be noted that age discrimination is illegal in most countries, for good reason!
The funny thing is that a guy that age probably had his initial musical development (which we never really lose) somewhere between 1962 - 1977.
Err.. like there was no cool music happening between those dates..
and Buddy Holly died in 1959. and Buddy Holly as a derogatory term???!
I thought rock and roll (in it's all-encompassing sense) was supposed to cut across barriers of colour, creed or roots.
I know a band is not a workplace, but it should be noted that age discrimination is illegal in most countries, for good reason!
Yeah, sounds like there's a good possibility that the guitarist wasn't happy about something that wasn't the bassist's age or his playing, and I say that not to invalidate it or demean it. If he wasn't feeling the chemistry with him that you did, or didn't like the package deal that it bordered on, or that maybe they were auditioning you, all that stuff. I remember some auditions where I didn't want them in the band because I just wasn't nuts about them and I probably said some things that weren't relevant, just to put the kabosh on them joining.
You say the guitarist is a good guy so I doubt he was being wrongly age discriminatory. But he probably wasn't digging the whole picture.
Wow, I am not usually around on the weekends, surprised this is still getting as many posts as it is.
OK, next Band Meeting/rehersal is on Wednesday night. We will be having a discussion at that time. I was talking to the other Guitar/bass player in the group and he agreed with me that we were a little quick on the draw there. We will be talking this out with him. He is outvoted but in no way is he "Winning Anyway" We are just not placing a tonne of urgency on anything. we are taking a relaxed approach.
I haven't contacted the singer/bass player yet but will this week. I am not going to leave that as it is I really would like to play with them again. I will do this Thursday after the band meeting so we can all put our cards on the table. I will let the guys know that I am going to call them. They can choose to join me or not and it will not effect our current hang, I have room for two gigs if it comes to that.
The Guitar player is a good guy and it is easy to read into his motives from behind the computer screen but if you knew him you would know most of these scenarios do not apply. Obviously there is something bothering him about it and we will with luck discover that on Wednesday. It does not have to be a confrontation or argument. I do agree with those of you that said we should really sit down and discuss our goals as a group. That has not been done and it could help a lot with these situatitions.
Now, To address those of you who think there is some issue of class between an email or phone call...... Some of you might just want to skip the rest of the email as it is going off topic....
<Rant>
The guitar player made contact with the singer. It was done online. they exchanged email and links to songs we would do and when the night came for them to come we gave them the address in an email and everything worked out perfectly. What is it with you insecure attention seekers that everything has to happen in person or directly in your ears? We don't email in music which most of you can't read, it's in english. Why are you so afraid of email. I strongly contend that you simply need your chance to throw a tantrum like a child or have some stupid last word and if denied of that you get all stupid and say people have no class.
Email was perfectly fine for every bit of communication up to the decision, why suddenly was it not good enough at the end? You people claiming a phone call somehow shows class? Well, to be blunt, Class is something you obviously are not familliar with. Intelligent people only require the communication, not a soapbox to react to the news on.
I personally will never discriminate on age but regardless of how old someone is if they pull this luddite crap where they try to shame those of us using technology into staying back in the dark ages by using older communications methods is simply not hip enough to play with. I'll vote you out the second you start that crap because I will see you are just holding open your spot to get the last word in or throw a tantrum and people who covet that are pretty lame to me.
The people demanding the phone call over email are the same dorks that 10 years ago were crying when calls were made instead of face to face. Get over it, you do not own MY time and get no say in how much of it is used telling you it isn't going to work out.
Nothing shows a lack of class like pointing fingers at others and saying they have no class just because you are not getting your own petty way...
</Rant>
Now back to our regularly scheduled programming....
Have a great day everyone.
-eSmith.
OK, next Band Meeting/rehersal is on Wednesday night. We will be having a discussion at that time. I was talking to the other Guitar/bass player in the group and he agreed with me that we were a little quick on the draw there. We will be talking this out with him. He is outvoted but in no way is he "Winning Anyway" We are just not placing a tonne of urgency on anything. we are taking a relaxed approach.
I haven't contacted the singer/bass player yet but will this week. I am not going to leave that as it is I really would like to play with them again. I will do this Thursday after the band meeting so we can all put our cards on the table. I will let the guys know that I am going to call them. They can choose to join me or not and it will not effect our current hang, I have room for two gigs if it comes to that.
The Guitar player is a good guy and it is easy to read into his motives from behind the computer screen but if you knew him you would know most of these scenarios do not apply. Obviously there is something bothering him about it and we will with luck discover that on Wednesday. It does not have to be a confrontation or argument. I do agree with those of you that said we should really sit down and discuss our goals as a group. That has not been done and it could help a lot with these situatitions.
Now, To address those of you who think there is some issue of class between an email or phone call...... Some of you might just want to skip the rest of the email as it is going off topic....
<Rant>
The guitar player made contact with the singer. It was done online. they exchanged email and links to songs we would do and when the night came for them to come we gave them the address in an email and everything worked out perfectly. What is it with you insecure attention seekers that everything has to happen in person or directly in your ears? We don't email in music which most of you can't read, it's in english. Why are you so afraid of email. I strongly contend that you simply need your chance to throw a tantrum like a child or have some stupid last word and if denied of that you get all stupid and say people have no class.
Email was perfectly fine for every bit of communication up to the decision, why suddenly was it not good enough at the end? You people claiming a phone call somehow shows class? Well, to be blunt, Class is something you obviously are not familliar with. Intelligent people only require the communication, not a soapbox to react to the news on.
I personally will never discriminate on age but regardless of how old someone is if they pull this luddite crap where they try to shame those of us using technology into staying back in the dark ages by using older communications methods is simply not hip enough to play with. I'll vote you out the second you start that crap because I will see you are just holding open your spot to get the last word in or throw a tantrum and people who covet that are pretty lame to me.
The people demanding the phone call over email are the same dorks that 10 years ago were crying when calls were made instead of face to face. Get over it, you do not own MY time and get no say in how much of it is used telling you it isn't going to work out.
Nothing shows a lack of class like pointing fingers at others and saying they have no class just because you are not getting your own petty way...
</Rant>
Now back to our regularly scheduled programming....
Have a great day everyone.
-eSmith.
I'm 41. My guitarist is 39.
Our drummer is 60. He kicks ass. Musicians who stay in form only get better with age. Don't miss out on all that experience. Tell your less-enlightened bandmates that this is a treat for them.
On a side note, I made a call to a longtime friend of mine on the weekend. It was the guy who taught me to play drums back around 1985. As you might guess, he's pushing 64 himself. I told him the story and he was very interested.
He found it kind of funny but was very interested as this kind of thing might effect him someday. (Not likely, it's a small market he is in and he is very well known as a goto drummer)
Anyway, Age and music go together like Age and Wine. The older the better really. I really agree with the poster above who found it weird people covet old instruments but not old musicians..... Thats so true.
-eSmith.
He found it kind of funny but was very interested as this kind of thing might effect him someday. (Not likely, it's a small market he is in and he is very well known as a goto drummer)
Anyway, Age and music go together like Age and Wine. The older the better really. I really agree with the poster above who found it weird people covet old instruments but not old musicians..... Thats so true.
-eSmith.
Post fail.
None of us are dorks. I think implying that is a rule violation.
We are all communicating on an online forum. I doubt that any of us here are afraid of email, but it is everyone's right to voice their opinion regarding its use in a rejection. If you only expect viewpoints that agree with yours, you are likely to be disappointed.
Viewpoints on the topic sure, however the contact method is not in question here, nobody involved had a problem with that at all. This thread is about the age issue.
Coming into a topic and trying to change it to soapbox on a personal pet peeve is also a no no is it not?
Getting upset that you are called out on it and then making statments about rule violations as if you were somehow offended seems like an attempt to get the thread closed doesn't it?
I can imply that people doing the above are dorks. I didn't call anyone in particular a dork, if you are standing up and saying you identify with this, well... that's on you, not me.
-eSmith.
Coming into a topic and trying to change it to soapbox on a personal pet peeve is also a no no is it not?
Getting upset that you are called out on it and then making statments about rule violations as if you were somehow offended seems like an attempt to get the thread closed doesn't it?
I can imply that people doing the above are dorks. I didn't call anyone in particular a dork, if you are standing up and saying you identify with this, well... that's on you, not me.
-eSmith.
I think you might want to question that lead guitar player of yours. What you wrote reads like a successful audition.
Signed,
baffled lead guitarist.
I guess Tony Levin won't be sitting in with your group anytime soon. (not a blues dude but I'm guessing he'd get the job done. 
) Born in 56 so he must have nothing left by now! 
Music is a LIFE TIME of learning for those who keep their attitudes in check and their minds open. But don't worry... you know a singer and bass player that you could join if things get too rough.
) Born in 56 so he must have nothing left by now! Music is a LIFE TIME of learning for those who keep their attitudes in check and their minds open. But don't worry... you know a singer and bass player that you could join if things get too rough.
Still a rule violation.
Calling a group of people a name insults each one of them.
FWIW, it doesn't add more credibility to your answer. Here or in your non-band life.
i could dig age discrimination if it's a band of young 20 year olds looking to appeal to a young audience. but a blues band? get real!
Seriously. I'm all for being shallow, care a lot about audience age, and all that, but a 64-year-old drummer in a blues band is not a problem.
I am 62, singer 25, drummer 25, guitar 30, guitar 40. Rock-Godsmack, 5 finger death punch, cage the elephant,Kings of Leon, Shinedown plus some old candlebox, tom petty i appropriate venues. Is this a 62 year-old music?
Now in fairness, there were 2 clubs that questioned our leader about what we played when he saw me on load-in. In the last year and a half we have been in regular rotation and have played there about five times and still on upcoming schedule.
I would never hire myself as a front man for this band but more because I am not animated.(Picture Bill Wymann standing basically still in the back playing bass)
As a homeowner I have responsibilities but I have never missed a rehearsal or turned down a gig. By the way, rehearsal and gigs are in PA 1 1/2 hours drive each way minimum. My age meant I had the money to supply the PA and the vehicle to transport it.
As a 62 year-old non-frontman bass player the only downside is most of the extended family are not into rock and wont drive 3 hour roundtrip to a bar starting at 10 pm
Reconsider the age factor.
Now in fairness, there were 2 clubs that questioned our leader about what we played when he saw me on load-in. In the last year and a half we have been in regular rotation and have played there about five times and still on upcoming schedule.
I would never hire myself as a front man for this band but more because I am not animated.(Picture Bill Wymann standing basically still in the back playing bass)
As a homeowner I have responsibilities but I have never missed a rehearsal or turned down a gig. By the way, rehearsal and gigs are in PA 1 1/2 hours drive each way minimum. My age meant I had the money to supply the PA and the vehicle to transport it.
As a 62 year-old non-frontman bass player the only downside is most of the extended family are not into rock and wont drive 3 hour roundtrip to a bar starting at 10 pm
Reconsider the age factor.
okcrum
in your chest
That's just what I was thinking as well. Maybe I'm a little nuts but I think an older guy in that type of band actually looks cool and adds some sort of "legitness" to it.
