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Aluminum reinforcement rods? Maybe?

MrArose13

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Commercial User
Aug 15, 2011
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Atlanta Georgia
www.rosebudbasses.com
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Owner/Luthier:RoseBud Basses & Guitars LLC
How's it going all?

So I've had this thought of using aluminum for reinforcement rods instead of CF bouncing around in my head for a while and thought it was about time to present it to the collective.

I searched around a bit and saw some concepts, but not the way i'm thinking. I literally want to use the same installation method as CF, but with aluminum. What say YOU?

So, I'm look for any info: good idea, bad idea, experience, theories, let me hear it.
 
When I looked into this a few years ago, seemed like the consensus was that 7075 aluminum was necessary to avoid the movement with temperature in service. But I'm not an engineer, so no idea.

Rick Toone did something related, but not available anymore. [Invalid or Expired Link Removed] He's got other writings on the topic as well on his site in various places.

Some luthiers have used them for "fixed" rods in place of truss rods, and they are used on the old Japanese style boxed trussrods, so their use in necks is established. I haven't tried it yet - still using up my stock of CF rods, but I'll try it one day. Hopefully others will chime in... :)
 
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I have an Ovation Matrix acoustic guitar with an aluminum neck. No truss rod. While the frets are ground down to almost nothing, the neck has not moved an iota in 50 years, even moving from New Jersey to Arizona. I'm not sure what kind of aluminum it is, but it's stable.
 
I like aluminum for reinforcing necks. Done right, it's stiffer and lighter weight than the carbon fiber bars. No need for big bars. The key is to use thin aluminum plates which are standing up on edge, so they add stiffness in the direction that you want to add stiffness.

One version of my truss rods that I provide to my clients has optional aluminum stiffener plates built into it. They are made from 6061 plate 0.070" thick, cut into a long wedge that is 3/8" deep at the headstock end tapering to 5/8" deep at the heel. They also have slots cut into them to cause the neck to go into the right shape of relief curve. The two plates are right on either side of the truss rod.

I've also made all aluminum truss rods for a few clients who needed super light weight. For those, I use 7075 aluminum alloy for the strength of the threads.
 
Bruce, your the man! For the most part that's what I'm going for. I was guessing you knew something about this. Thank you for taking a moment to share your knowledge. If you have (or when have) time for some questions,

- Do you have pix of this on your web page?
- What's the quality/grade of the aluminum you get at the big box stores?
- Why do you make them wedge shaped as opposed to straight Like Cf?
- for give me, but I'm not picturing how the cut in slots works?
 
Here are some pictures of two of these truss rod assemblies, and how they go together. These are in a guitar length, for 25 1/2" scale necks. These are double-acting single-rod truss rods, which are made into a "cartridge" assembly, with adjustment at the heel end via a spoke wheel. The whole assembly is cast solid in epoxy in a special mold. These are installed by routing a tapered trough in the neck and gluing in the whole assembly, while gluing the fingerboard on.

Anyway, you can see the two vertical aluminum plates on either side of the rod. These are an option for my clients who want additional stiffness in the their necks. The standard models have maple strips where the aluminum is on these. As I mentioned above, the plates are made from 6061 aluminum, 0.070" thick. They stand vertically and are wedge-shaped, the same as the whole cartridge, starting at 3/8" deep at the anchor end (which ends up between the nut and the 1st fret) and tapering to 5/8" deep at the heel.

The plates are simple stiffening beams. Making them thin and tall gives them more stiffness per weight added, as compared to putting a wider shallower bar up against the underside of the fingerboard. The plates could even be thinner than 0.070" and be nearly as stiff. Even 0.030" thick plates of this same depth would provide plenty of stiffness for the job, as long as they are fully supported on either side to prevent them from buckling. I used 0.070" plate for these because it worked right for the stack up of these parts.

The tapered depth and the additional saw slots along the top of the plates vary the stiffness along the length of the neck, which is what I want. As the string tension is applied, I want the neck to curl up into a particular shape, with most of the curvature in the 0 to 5th fret zone and very little curvature from the 5th to the heel. The tapering stiffness of the plates, combined with the geometry of the truss rod, cause that to happen. The truss rod, of course, allows you to adjust the amount of curvature.

Now, if I were installing this style of aluminum stiffening plates directly into a neck, rather than in this cartridge assembly, I would rout or saw a 1/4" wide slot x the 3/8" to 5/8" tapering depth. The aluminum plate would go into the slot, with a slice of maple tightly beside it to fill up the 1/4" width. All set in with hard epoxy. Putting in a 1/4" thick aluminum plate would be a waste of weight, even in aluminum. From an engineering standpoint, what makes it stiff in this case is the depth of the plate, not the width (thickness).

And yes, this same idea can be used with other materials than aluminum. If I wanted to use carbon fiber, I would make up plates similar to these aluminum plates, like 1/16" wide x 3/8" to 5/8" deep, installed about the same way. Carbon fiber TOW stranding, set into epoxy resin. That's how I make the "back straps" on most of my other truss rod installations. But, aluminum is simple and very light weight for its strength.

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Thank you SOOO much Bruce! I truly feel better informed. I'm almost ready to adopt aluminum as my new go to material for reinforcement rods. I only have two more questions.

1) - do you think the aluminum you can get from HD will work for this, (have you tried it? I believe it's 6063) or is it best to stick with 6061?

2) - how did you decide where to put the cuts, was there an equation involved, or simple equal spacing from 0-5?
 
MrARose;

I would use either 6061 or 6063 aluminum. Check the labels carefully on the aluminum bars that they sell in hardware stores. If it's 6063, it will say so. If it doesn't say anything, it's probably 3003, which is really soft and gummy. I call 3003 Cheesealum, an alloy of aluminum and cheese. It would probably do the job, but it's awful to work with.

No heavy engineering on the slots to allow the curvature. Just an educated guess on the spacing, starting at the 5th and getting closer together towards the nut. I'm just getting these cartridge truss rods into production, and haven't done much field testing yet. I have used this style of aluminum reinforcing plates in necks in the past, though.

The two in the pictures are being tested by Bill Asher. I just built him a neck structure with one of them installed. It's going in one of his custom guitars. He's been using a simpler version of my truss rod in his guitar necks for about 5 years. If these prototypes work well, we may switch over to them for all of his necks.

Tim Cloonan is also testing some of these in a couple of short scale basses, although the ones he has so far don't have the aluminum plates. Several other bass builders are in line to try these out.
 
Awesome Bruce! Cheesealum, Ha Ha. I think I had some of that on a sandwich last week. I use hardware store aluminum angle on my custom cases.

With that, I'm ready to start some experiments.

I just want to say thanks again, I truly appreciate you taking the time to share you knowledge and experience with me... and all of us really.
 
MrARose;

I would use either 6061 or 6063 aluminum. Check the labels carefully on the aluminum bars that they sell in hardware stores. If it's 6063, it will say so. If it doesn't say anything, it's probably 3003, which is really soft and gummy. I call 3003 Cheesealum, an alloy of aluminum and cheese. It would probably do the job, but it's awful to work with.
...
Hah! 3000 series is gummy, yes. Try cutting 1000 some time! Or rather, don't.

6061 and 6063 are really best in the T5 or T6 (or T51 or T61) temper, e.g. 6061-T6. Both for the working properties, and for the machining properties. Now, that's the way they're ordinarily available from industrial metal suppliers or online outfits such as Metal Supermarket, but I'd be a little untrustworthy of something from box stores that wasn't fully described.
 
One other note about choosing aluminum alloys: 6061 and 6063 are almost the same in their basic properties of strength, machining, etc. But 6063 is often called "architectural aluminum". It's commonly sold in standard extruded shapes (bars, angles, channels, etc.) which are a nice smooth finish, and they are anodized. They are made to be used in decorative applications where appearance and some weather resistance are desired. That's why those bars and angles at the Home Depot are shiny. I use 6063 angles and channels a lot around here for making fixtures and things for the shop.

But, if you are going to machine parts from those pretty shapes, the anodized finish can cause a few problems. Also, glues don't stick well to the anodized surface. So, if you are making some neck reinforcing bars from 6063 strip stock, you should go over them with coarse sandpaper before gluing, to roughen up the surfaces. That's not really necessary with 6061, unless it's a highly stressed glue joint.

Outside of the Home Depot market, 6061-T6 is the most commonly available aluminum alloy. It's a good general purpose aluminum. I buy it in bar stock and flat sheets. When the parts need to be higher strength, I use 7075. It's about three times the price of 6061. For sheet metal parts that have bending and folding, I use 5052. It bends nicely but it a little soft for machining. For parts that specifically need to be soft and squishy and cheese-like, I use 3003. I've only messed with 1000 series alloys a few times, and yeah, it was like a bar of aluminum putty.

I buy most of my metal stock online from OnlineMetals and SpeedyMetals. OnlineMetals are closer to me, so their delivery is faster. SpeedyMetals is a bit more expensive, but they sell bar stock by the inch, and they will cut it right to lengths that you specify. They cater to small orders and hobbyists. Both places have good web sites; very easy to shop online with them.
 
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Ibanez has been using titanium in their prestige and premium bass necks for a few years now. My only problem with aluminum would be the loss of density/mass possibly adding to the development of dead spots, but the removal of moisture holding mass might improve dead spots, so it may just take experimentation.
 
Loss of density/mass? Aluminum is about 3 times heavier than maple. Adding aluminum stiffeners to a neck will increase both its weight and its stiffness. Both will increase the natural resonance frequency, which will hopefully shift the dead spots up out of the annoying range.

Carbon fiber bars are also heavier than the wood that they are replacing.

I haven't found any use for titanium in reinforcing necks, other than the marketing value of being "titanium reinforced". Which sure sounds cool. Titanium is about half the weight of steel. But aluminum is about 1/3 the weight of steel. And titanium is much more expensive and harder to machine. Titanium is mainly used where you need light weight, high temperature resistance, and long fatigue life. Such as key aircraft structural parts. I made some titanium truss rods for a client some years back, and my conclusion was that they weren't worth the cost or trouble. I made 7075 truss rods that were lighter than the titanium rods, and just as strong.
 
Thermal expansion-wise, steel and titanium are preferable over aluminum because they are better matched to the wood. Sugar maple has a longitudinal TE coefficient of 3.82 x10^-6 °K-1. Ti is 8.6 (same units), steel is about 12, and aluminum 23. These give you conflicting differentials expansions of Ti vs. maple = 4.8, steel vs. maple = 8.2, Al vs. maple = 19.2. As far as carbon fiber rods, unidirectional CFRP has a longitudinal CTE of -0.1, for a differential to maple of -4.9 . (That's right, unidirectional CF actually has a very small shrinkage as it heats.)

So in this respect, CF and titanium are the best matches, and steel has a more than double advantage over aluminum.

Applying it to a real situation, if a 24" long aluminum bar is glued up with 24" of maple neck at 65°F, and the neck gets to 90°F, the maple will expand in length by .001" while the aluminum is trying to expand by .007". This sets up internal stresses. Whether they are sufficient to be detrimental in performance is a matter of design and degree, but I surely will never put aluminum in a neck unless I am confident that it lies very close to the neutral axis.
 
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