Am I an "incompetent" bass player?

[Mushroo]

Original Thread; How can I hear my bass over the keyboard?

This is the quoted part that bummed me:



We play original music and a few covers. I'll give you a little background. I was 44 years old when I started to learn to play. It was a lifelong dream to play bass and I'm doing it. But the quote didn't hurt my feelings. I'm bummed that I think now I may be "incompetent" because I can't create cool and fantastic bass lines. Hell I still have some trouble with the right notes.

I think you're being a little too thin-skinned about this. The poster in that other thread was responding to a hypothetical situation, in which the keyboardist knows the song's bass line, but the bassist hasn't learned it yet. In that situation, if the keyboardist is playing the correct bass line, but the bassist is making up their own bass line, then there are two different bass lines happening at the same time, and there is a risk the two bass lines will clash with each other.

I didn't read it as an attack on you personally.

 

[FronTowardEnemy]

It's a bit more complicated than that. I joined a "club" where people were taught as a collective group to play different instruments. IE someone wanted to learn guitar, someone wanted to learn to drum, someone bass. So we were formed into groups and taught by 1 instructor. And then when we were deemed worthy we were put on stage. I was part of a group that broke off after we had "earned our wings" to go do our own thing as a real band. Actually both of the bands were formed this way.

Was this school of Rock by any chance?

I sent my son there for a year or so and he did very well.

He is kicking it in a real tight original band now.

 

[Broke]

Was this school of Rock by any chance?

I sent my son there for a year or so and he did very well.

He is kicking it in a real tight original band now.

No this is a group for adults who want to learn to play instruments and form bands.

 

[Broke]

I think you're being a little too thin-skinned about this.

I didn't read it as an attack on you personally.

I'm entirely too old to be thin skinned about anything. But it is concerning to think I may not be doing the right things. Because I want to play properly and learn new techniques. Just like what MalcolmAmos posted. I'm reading through that right now and am finding it helpful

 

[bass12]

There's nothing for you to worry about. Just be aware that learning a few basic things about music theory will give you a much clearer idea of what you're doing - and you'll have a lot more fun playing. I played for years by ear before I had any idea about even the most basic theory. See it as a fun opportunity to broaden your horizons.

 

[Mushroo]

I'm entirely too old to be thin skinned about anything. But it is concerning to think I may not be doing the right things. Because I want to play properly and learn new techniques. Just like what MalcolmAmos posted. I'm reading through that right now and am finding it helpful

I think you can easily avoid the "incompetent" situation described in the other thread, by correctly learning the notes to the bass lines. The issue only arises when one person in the band (the keyboardist) is prepared and has learned the songs, but another person in the band (the bassist) has not done their homework.

 

[TheLowDown33]

Learn something new music related everyday. After a year, you will have learned 365 things, which is more than most people here know.

Seriously though, learn the notes all over the neck, how to read music, and basic theory. That should be enough to get you through 90% of all the musical situations you will ever find yourself in.

 

[Broke]

I think you can easily avoid the "incompetent" situation described in the other thread, by correctly learning the notes to the bass lines. The issue only arises when one person in the band (the keyboardist) is prepared and has studied the material, but another person in the band (the bassist) has not done their homework.

Understood. And I think I'm starting to get the hang of things. I created my first bassline 2 weeks ago to the Johnny Cash song "Jackson". It just didn't sound right just playing roots and needed a country bassline. And it worked out nicely. It wasn't the original bassline but I did what I thought I could work with.

 

[Razman]

OP, I've been playing in a worship team for over 21 years, in a Christian metal band for almost 15 years, and know very little theory. Compared to my daughter, who is 18 and has spent the past four years in HS learning it, I'm quite incompetent.

That said, I'm in my mid-40's had have learned some maturity and bring that into these band contexts - not to mention my tenure, since I'm one of the older members (along with my wife) so we bring experiential value to the table also. And spending time in a group teaches you soft skills that can't be obtained any other way.

I say you've embarked on a fantastic journey, and that some things are only acquired over time, so take that and run with it - you'll be surprised at what you actually know later on down the road.

I'll digress... It irked me when one of the younger pups took issue with my correcting his funky drumming that was inconsistent and unfamiliar to the other musicians on platform one day, causing headaches for all of us. His response was that he was a multi-instrumentalist and that I probably need to learn more to adapt to him. To say he was a little prideful is quite an understatement. However, when put into unfamiliar territory he struggles to play consistently, even on his other instrument (guitar). I spent three years away from this group on another project and then jumped right back in, and had to play some tunes on the fly (it was an exciting time). I gave him a piece of my more 'experienced' mind.

He's less than half my age and has had pretty much 10x the amount of time to practice and play as I've had over the past decade plus, with raising a family, etc. so from that perspective he SHOULD be better than me - but he doesn't know how to serve the needs of the group, lead and inspire them, and work towards ensuring the entire team is successful. IOW, his immaturity is hurting him bigtime.

Ok, my rant is over too - play on, friend.

Raz

 

[cnltb]

I saw on another thread that a bass player who plays "root notes" is incompetent. I've been playing 3 years in 2 bands and I play root notes because that's what I know how to do. I'm kind of down about this right now and don't know what I can do to become competent.

Are you good enough to play the music your band plays?
If yes, then you are certainly competent enough to play in that band.
Further questions to consider
Do you read charts as well as notation fluently(sight read)?
Are you versed in a variety of musical styles?
Do you KNOW THE FINGERBOARD? -where every note is?
Are you as competent as you want to be?

 

[SmokinJoe992]

As many others have said before me, learning to play the bass is a journey, not a destination. There is no finish line. I, like you, started late in life and I have been playing for only 2 1/2 years. I have played in several bands during this time, one of which has played over 40 shows in the last year. I constantly surround myself with and play with people that are much better musicians than me, and I continue to get better everyday. I still feel like I am incompetent most of the time, but I am having a blast.

 

[Mushroo]

Understood. And I think I'm starting to get the hang of things. I created my first bassline 2 weeks ago to the Johnny Cash song "Jackson". It just didn't sound right just playing roots and needed a country bassline. And it worked out nicely. It wasn't the original bassline but I did what I thought I could work with.

Let's say you wanted to learn the original bass line note-for-note, what would be your process?

 

[THUNDERGODX]

Listen to other players, both recorded and live.
When you hear something you like on a recorded song, sit down, find the first note and then the second one.
and so on.
Thats how I used to learn saxophone music. Find a note..find the next one...remember the first one too.
My ignorance of scales and theory then really put a lot of extra time on me.
Learn at least a major scale. Everything will fall into that.

 

[Groove Doctor]

If it sounds good then it is good.

 

[Broke]

That said, I'm in my mid-40's had have learned some maturity and bring that into these band contexts - not to mention my tenure, since I'm one of the older members (along with my wife) so we bring experiential value to the table also. And spending time in a group teaches you soft skills that can't be obtained any other way.

Raz

I don't know if you saw but I'm 47 so I guess I'm "older" also. The youngest member of our band is 37

 

[Broke]

Are you good enough to play the music your band plays?
If yes, then you are certainly competent enough to play in that band.
Further questions to consider
Do you read charts as well as notation fluently(sight read)?
Are you versed in a variety of musical styles?
Do you KNOW THE FINGERBOARD? -where every note is?
Are you as competent as you want to be?

Don't read charts or sight read
Don't know a variety of musical styles
I don't know the entire fingerboard but I know enough for now I guess. I really need to work on this
I'm NOT as competent as I would like to be.

 

[hrodbert696]

Original Thread; How can I hear my bass over the keyboard?

This is the quoted part that bummed me:



We play original music and a few covers. I'll give you a little background. I was 44 years old when I started to learn to play. It was a lifelong dream to play bass and I'm doing it. But the quote didn't hurt my feelings. I'm bummed that I think now I may be "incompetent" because I can't create cool and fantastic bass lines. Hell I still have some trouble with the right notes.

OK, I'll try to be fair but blunt: like @bass12 said, you're limited. "Competence" is relative. I'm competent to drive my car to work, but I'm incompetent to drive in a NASCAR race. So whether you're a "competent" bass player, or not, depends entirely on what music you're playing and how well you play it. If all you know how to do is roots, and all that your band (and any audience you have) needs or wants from you is to play roots, then you are competent to the bass chair in that band. If you're trying to play Jamerson lines from Motown songs or Chris Squire lines from Yes, then you're not competent for that. You're probably fine in, say, a pop-punk band doing Ramones and Blink-182.

If you want to expand your abilities and overcome your limitations - I'd suggest starting to learn your scales, so that you know what someone means when they suggest to add a fifth now and then. Then chord tones. Yes, I know, you don't know what those are - yet. You can look them up. Plenty of info on them in the "general instruction" forum here at TB and various other places. I would also suggest the book Bass Fitness for exercises to build your accuracy and speed. Also, start learning lines from songs you admire - you can work from tabs at first, then try branching out to figure out songs by ear. Work gradually from the simple to the complicated.

Don't let your age bother you. I was 38 or 39 when I started, not much younger than you were. I'm 48 now. Worked on learning the above stuff and practiced regularly. Here's the latest cover from one of my bands (just put the video out today):


I'm amazed these talented people let me play with them. If I can figure out how to play this stuff, so can you. Time and attention.

 

[bassplayertom77]

There are a lot of players that can't play the root and stick to it. There's a name for them: Unemployed.

Keep your chin up, don't compare yourself to others. You're doing fantastic.

 

[bearfoot]

No. You are not incompetent. Playing the wrong root notes (unintended), and poor timing, is incompetence that can train wreck the band.

Everything we do is based off the root. One by one, you will be learning the intervals based from it, and developing your own sense of taste and style as to when to apply them.

The 4th, 5th, and octave is first on the list.

Don't sweat it. The 4th is the "oom-pah". The 5th is "Ricky don't lose that number", or bossa nova / rhumba.
The octaves are disco. The 3rd is blues, "riders on the storm".

It'll come easy.

 

[Mushroo]

Learning to read & write music would be a good first step to help you feel more competent.

I learned to read music just like I learned to read English.

When I was a little kid, my parents would read out loud to me. I would follow along in the book and try to make sense of the funny symbols. Eventually, my brain figured out the connection between the letters on the page and the sounds my parents were speaking.

Same thing for learning music. I would get ahold of the sheet music to popular songs and follow along while I listened to the album. Eventually, I started to see the connection between the sheet music and the musical sounds. For example, when the bass line goes up, the notes are written higher on the staff, and when the bass line goes down, the notes are written lower on the staff. Or, another example, when you hear an "out of key" note, usually that matches up with an "accidental" symbol (sharps, naturals, or flats) in the sheet music.

Learning to read & write is very important. But it's also very important to develop your ear. Particularly in the country/Americana genres, often songs are taught by ear, there is no sheet music.