I don't think the OP was offering to find a sub for the gigs he considered less than prime. I believe the band leader was saying he would find a replacement...and the implied threat was that the OP could be replaced permanently if he complained.
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Am I getting screwed on $?
- Thread starter friskinator
- Start date
I don't think the OP was offering to find a sub for the gigs he considered less than prime. I believe the band leader was saying he would find a replacement...and the implied threat was that the OP could be replaced permanently if he complained.
This is fairly simple. What the singer/manager (whatever you want to call him) makes, and frankly, what the other guys get paid, has nothing to do with you. You have agreed to a rate of compensation, the end.
You need to decide if the compensation you have agreed to is acceptable to you, regardless of what others are making. The answer could vary depending on local vs. travel gigs, if you like.
If you now find some aspect of what you agreed to is unacceptable, you re-negotiate. If you cannot come to an agreement, you have a decision to make. Accept the gig on his terms, or walk. You are not forced to do this gig, you have options. They may not be ones you like, but that is where the decision part comes into play.
You need to decide if the compensation you have agreed to is acceptable to you, regardless of what others are making. The answer could vary depending on local vs. travel gigs, if you like.
If you now find some aspect of what you agreed to is unacceptable, you re-negotiate. If you cannot come to an agreement, you have a decision to make. Accept the gig on his terms, or walk. You are not forced to do this gig, you have options. They may not be ones you like, but that is where the decision part comes into play.
Yeah, I realize. Others had stated that he get a sub for the out of town gigs. I wouldn't sub out a gig that I wouldn't do only one I couldn't do. Than ks for giving me an opportunity to be clearer
Mike
I completely agree. If you are being paid based on a percentage, you have every right to know exactly what is being made per gig. Otherwise, you should get paid a flat fee no matter what the gross is. If you are at the end of your rope with this gig, i would tell the leader that you want to "see the books" or you want a flat fee.
Sounds like the guy I was working for. Eventually you'll find out what he's really getting paid, and then you'll be very sad. I'd probably still be in that band if I was getting an honest percentage of the gross. The word for someone like this is a "user." They generally think of themselves as shrewd businessmen.
There's so little money in this business, it's like the money is really just symbolic. It's respect. If you're not getting paid fairly, you're not getting respect.
If you don't have respect, you don't have anything.
- Aug 16, 2003
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- Endorsing Artist;Essential sound products,Dunlop, Ergo Instruments
Remember you never get what you are worth (In your mind) only what you negotiate.
I worked with a smooth Jazz artist who was part owner of his management company.After playing several very large Jazz fest and getting the same money (which was decent) as smaller gig's, I asked the MD about why that was.He told me that the artist took 50% of the money and out of the other 50% all percentages and band pay were taken out.Now my first thought was "the Artist get paid twice because he shares in the managements cut and my second thought was..........................Shut up and play the Bass,That was the deal I had. He never asked me to take less for some gig's and I know for a fact had went in his own pocket to cover some situations that came up. There's a big difference between working WITH somebody and working FOR somebody; and people often forget that.
If it's a real issue for the OP YOU go talk to the band leader for yourself and clear the air
I worked with a smooth Jazz artist who was part owner of his management company.After playing several very large Jazz fest and getting the same money (which was decent) as smaller gig's, I asked the MD about why that was.He told me that the artist took 50% of the money and out of the other 50% all percentages and band pay were taken out.Now my first thought was "the Artist get paid twice because he shares in the managements cut and my second thought was..........................Shut up and play the Bass,That was the deal I had. He never asked me to take less for some gig's and I know for a fact had went in his own pocket to cover some situations that came up. There's a big difference between working WITH somebody and working FOR somebody; and people often forget that.
If it's a real issue for the OP YOU go talk to the band leader for yourself and clear the air
What everyone is overlooking here is that the agreed upon rate is 10%. Ten percent of what? Without seeing the books, then you cannot know if the payment has been calculated correctly. If you tell me you're going to be paying me a percentage, then you have agreed to show me the books. Otherwise, nobody knows what the correct payment should be.
I agree that if you accept a gig for a certain amount of money, you have no right to complain (unless you were misled into accepting less). But here, it's a percentage and therefore, everything must be put on the table.
Also, 20% for the booking agent is a bit high (IMHO).
I agree that if you accept a gig for a certain amount of money, you have no right to complain (unless you were misled into accepting less). But here, it's a percentage and therefore, everything must be put on the table.
Also, 20% for the booking agent is a bit high (IMHO).
I look at it this way, if the singer is so good that deserves more, so be it. If it were me, I'd get with the other "hired guns" and form another band. I'd set up our new band to have a fair and even split on both income and expenses. Of course, it'll be more work, someone will have to find/book shows, etc..With luck the new band will blow away the old one, and you'll have a great story about how the band formed. On the other hand, if the lead singer is really that great, or you don't want to put in the effort to manage a band, then smile and take your 10%.
I agree with some of the other guys.We have a lot a guys in here in originals bands that are struggling.
If someone is handing you 200.00 bucks after a show your doing pretty good. To me it sounds fair if they cleared 2K. If it was 5k or more than you might have to look into it further and have a business meeting.
If someone is handing you 200.00 bucks after a show your doing pretty good. To me it sounds fair if they cleared 2K. If it was 5k or more than you might have to look into it further and have a business meeting.
This is all foolishness…
Stop wasting time and learn a skill that’s in demand.
For instance, one school year and you can be an LPN- $18+ per hour, then school from there for RN or something.
That’s just the fasted/surest thing I can think of right now.
Stop wasting time and learn a skill that’s in demand.
For instance, one school year and you can be an LPN- $18+ per hour, then school from there for RN or something.
That’s just the fasted/surest thing I can think of right now.
Sounds like you're looking at this as a job.
If the job doesn't pay well enough, then it's time to ask for a raise or find a better paying job.
Honestly though, and maybe I'm just totally out of touch here, but for each member of a cover band to make $200 off of a show, that kinda sounds like a pretty sweet deal.
What's the consensus of the other workers? I mean, if everyone but the singer thinks they need higher pay for out of town shows, then why don't you all address that with him together?
- Jun 3, 2009
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- Bassgearu, Music Industry Consulting and Sales. Tech 21, NBE Corp, Sonosphere.
This one is simple. You already stated it. It is HIS band, you are a hired gun. You agreed to his stipulated percentage. You said he does the booking end, so the booking agent fee is going in his pocket. Still fair, its his BUSINESS. You are an employee.
You do have the right to see the actual payment to verify that you are getting the proper percentage, however no matter what else he puts in the numbers you have to live with. His modus operandi actually sounds good. Booking agent comes off the top. 40% for employees (which he does get to count as one). That is 50%. The other 50% goes into the business.
Local gigs versus travelling gigs don't matter nor should they be treated differently. Hotel rooms and meals cost differently in different towns. So, in one town the hotel may cost him $100 per night, others maybe $150, others $75. The 50% that goes into the business has to aggregate in order to pay all overhead and expenses.
If you need more money, ask. If he says no, be polite. You then have to decide if you are making enough for you. At the rate you are getting paid this sounds like a pseudo part-time gig. $200 a night for a part timer is pretty darn good. I'd love to get that kind of cake for steady gigs.
Now, if this is your only income, then maybe you need to look for a day job.
tom
You do have the right to see the actual payment to verify that you are getting the proper percentage, however no matter what else he puts in the numbers you have to live with. His modus operandi actually sounds good. Booking agent comes off the top. 40% for employees (which he does get to count as one). That is 50%. The other 50% goes into the business.
Local gigs versus travelling gigs don't matter nor should they be treated differently. Hotel rooms and meals cost differently in different towns. So, in one town the hotel may cost him $100 per night, others maybe $150, others $75. The 50% that goes into the business has to aggregate in order to pay all overhead and expenses.
If you need more money, ask. If he says no, be polite. You then have to decide if you are making enough for you. At the rate you are getting paid this sounds like a pseudo part-time gig. $200 a night for a part timer is pretty darn good. I'd love to get that kind of cake for steady gigs.
Now, if this is your only income, then maybe you need to look for a day job.
tom
Same here. At least in this market, musicians would crawl through glass for one-night cover gigs that paid that much per guy. Standard going rate here is about half that.
- Jun 3, 2009
- 3,330
- 398
- Disclosures
- Bassgearu, Music Industry Consulting and Sales. Tech 21, NBE Corp, Sonosphere.
I'm with ya, but based on the original post I am assuming that the band leader is paying for food and hotel on travelling gigs. He doesn't say it explicitly but that is what it seems.
