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Am I wasting my time?

M

malicant

Oct 14, 2011
72
2
#1
Hi folks. This is just a question for far more experienced musicians than I, of which there are many.

Single August of last year, I've been playing with a keyboardist/composer with the aim of setting up an electronic band. The guy writes some good music and I get on well with him so I can't really say that I'm unhappy there. The issue however is that still, after about nine months since meeting the guy, it's still just the two of us.

To be fair, the guy has done a lot to try to get other people on board but for some reason, it just doesn't seem to be happening. We've jammed with five or six guitarists, several drummers and a lot of singers have been on the cards only for them to slip off the radar after a few weeks. The reasons behind all this range from "too busy" (which reeks of excuse) to a straight up "not interested".

The acid bite for me has come in the last few weeks. There was meant to be a proper session early next week with a drummer and a guitarist but the drummer can't make it as he's playing with his other band that night. This struck a chord with me as I really, really don't want to be a part of someone's side project.

I'm not a bass prodigy but I can play to a high level and I have a lot of musical knowledge, more than the guys we've auditioned I might add. What I lack is experience as I've never played very much with others and I'm beginning to think that there's something about the music or the project that I can't see but that a guy with experience would spot easily. Why is it that, with loads of songs already composed, this thing can't get going?

Thanks guys.
 
#2
This is pretty typical of doing a startup, especially an originals band. If you're auditioning people for a cover band, they at least have an idea of what style of music to expect. With originals, they need to hear what the music's like and, if they're not into it, they're not going to hang. Just keep bringing people in until something clicks. It takes time.
 
#3
malicant said:
The acid bite for me has come in the last few weeks. There was meant to be a proper session early next week with a drummer and a guitarist but the drummer can't make it as he's playing with his other band that night. This struck a chord with me as I really, really don't want to be a part of someone's side project.
Click to expand...
If you don't want to do someone else's project, what do you have to offer that they would want to do yours? I'd reconsider that stance. If I were you and the keyboard player, I'd go out and do whatever projects you can to go out and meet other musicians and get them interested in working on your project, too. You have to give musicians an incentive for doing it, either monetary or the offer to help them do their separate things in return for doing yours.
 
#4
Forming a band is a ******** of work, including blood, sweat and several tears as well...
My current band, which I have a feeling will stick together now, is my fourth band. You will make the experience that the first band you form will not last (almost never will), but it is the experience you'll need to form one that will last!!
I formed this band together with the guitarist, and during the last 3 years I saw 8 drummers come and go. The first had 5 other bands and quit when we told him we wouldn't do this for a living, the second told us he wasn't good enough for us, the third kept smoking dope all day. One was deaf as hell (dear children: USE EARPLUGS ALL THE TIME OR END UP LIKE HIM), two other never showed up again after their auditions... The very last one now is the first one with balls who doesn't get pissed if you tell him "your drumming doesn't fit the riff, maybe we can loop the riff a bit and try some things" but simply works with us, has ideas, just want the best we can achieve and isn't an arrogant ****.
It's a bit like a company - you have to pick out the right personal. Since you have nothing (or few) to offer, this is the tricky part. Being an international top-act, you are almost free to choose whoever you want, but being a start-up band with no basic and reputation, you have to work with what you have/get.
Don't mind it!! I know it can be frustrating, but if you keep focused and be willing to practice (everybody in your band) you can get there!! It's actually quite a fun to work with what you get, because... you never know what you get and this is what makes your style "unique"
 
#6
The best way to attract decent musicians is to have gigs on the calendar.

Do you really need guitarists and drummers to play electronic music? A singer should be enough to start booking gigs. Can you or the keyboardist sing the material? If not finding just a singer shouldn't be too hard.

The suggestion about playing in other projects to network is a great one, too. Both keyboardists and bassists are in demand.
 
#7
So you're too good to be in a band with someone who has something else going on too? How much are you going to pay your musicians to keep them solely committed to your project? 'Cause if someone told me that I'd have to drop everything else, they'd better be paying all my bills.
 
#8
malicant said:
Why is it that, with loads of songs already composed, this thing can't get going?
Click to expand...

Not enough information here. The best I can do - actually the best any of us can do - is to speculate. :eyebrow:

My speculation is that the material may not be developed & produced to a high enough degree for other players to fully grasp the potential of it - even assuming, that is, that this is really good stuff, which is a really big assumption. If so, that may be as much of an indictment of their lack of vision and their lack of creativity, as anything else - maybe even more so. :hmm:

In my experience, there are a great many good players who are capable of replicating existing material to a high degree of polish. But not nearly so many are truly adept at composing & arranging 100% original material - and doing it really well. It is an art form all its own really.

Perhaps you've simply not been looking in the right places. Perhaps you simply haven't connected with the right people yet. If you know in your heart that this is superb stuff (again I'm assuming), and you truly believe it it, then don't give up.

Shake things up. Start getting some YouTube demos out there, in order to attract musicians you might not have reached otherwise. Take the advice to start gigging some of it - including perhaps a drum machine + some prerecorded backing tracks. Anything to open up new channels, by which to attract the resources you need. :hmm:

MM
 
#9
On a side note I'd focus on the drummer first. You're not likely to find a guitarist to commit to a band with no drummer. I certainly wouldn't join a band with no drummer.
 
#10
I went through this too, except me and the keyboardist were just trying to get a cover band together, not even originals. Drummers would audition and say, "Well, call me when you find a guitarist," and guitarists would audition and say "call me when you have a drummer" - and by then the drummer had already taken up with another project. After about nine months we gave up and pulled the plug. I would second JimmyM's advice - go out and play with some other projects, go to open mics with your stuff, network and see if you can get people interested.
 
#11
Thanks lads, many great replies as always.

Some more info. I don't think superb would be the word I'd use to describe the music but it is good and it does allow me play in ways I enjoy so in that sense, that would be good for me. We actually did have a guitarist for a while but he left as he simply couldn't think of anything to play that would work for the tunes.

So you're too good to be in a band with someone who has something else going on too? How much are you going to pay your musicians to keep them solely committed to your project? 'Cause if someone told me that I'd have to drop everything else, they'd better be paying all my bills.
Click to expand...

I don't think I'm too good for anything, please don't think that I meant that. I simply meant that I don't want to be a part of a band that isn't taken seriously, that's all. Thanks for replying though.

I'm getting the scene that I really lack experience in these matters :(
 
#13
malicant said:
I don't think I'm too good for anything, please don't think that I meant that. I simply meant that I don't want to be a part of a band that isn't taken seriously, that's all. Thanks for replying though.

I'm getting the scene that I really lack experience in these matters :(
Click to expand...
Nothing wrong with lacking experience ... as long as you have brains you'll learn. Just for reference, I work in FOUR different projects (a country band, and three singer/songwriter duos) either on bass guitar, upright bass, or acoustic guitar. I'm equally "serious" about all of them. No ONE of them keeps me as busy as I want to be, but all together it works out just about right. No complaints from the other players, I've been with the latest project for over three years now.
 
#14
Take any gigs you can get, networking opportunities once your "out there" is MUCH more available.

Also be creative, for instance don't limit yourself to a "drummer" also seek "percussionist", someone on congas or a djembe, find a singer that's good with a tamborine or who can at least operate an egg shaker can at least get you started.

Also, your comment about "taken seriously" raises a red flag. When you get started forming a band, it is important to NOT take yourself too seriously, at least at first. Forming a band requires attracting different people often for different reasons, some of which may have little to do with MAKING IT.

Be someone you would want to be in a band with, get out there, network, and you'll see things start happening.

Good luck! :)
 
#15
Munjibunga said:
This is pretty typical of doing a startup, especially an originals band. If you're auditioning people for a cover band, they at least have an idea of what style of music to expect. With originals, they need to hear what the music's like and, if they're not into it, they're not going to hang. Just keep bringing people in until something clicks. It takes time.
Click to expand...

Do you have the time and is this where you want to spend it?

Blue
 
#16
O.P.
These things take time.
Anything worth having is worth waiting for.

GOOD, experienced musicians are in demand, therefore likely to be involved in multiple projects.

Stay the course, expand the pool of musicians you know, ask for and LISTEN to constructive critique. Take the advice, and HEED what advice is given.
 
#18
guy n. cognito said:
Around here, the bands that get taken seriously either have

1. Paid gigs lined up,
2. Paid rehearsal
3. REALLY good music that someone believes will lead to 1 or 2.
Click to expand...

I agree to a degree, good music and even great music doesn't always lead to paid gigs. Sometimes it's a matter of location.

I know several originals bands that have wonderful material and are on the path to break up because they can't get giigs.

I think we all know of marginal bands with marginal material that are gigging all the time and making money.

blue
 
#19
Hmm, I’m wondering if might have something to do with your original music - can you post a link to some samples I can he hear?

malicant said:
Hi folks. This is just a question for far more experienced musicians than I, of which there are many.

Single August of last year, I've been playing with a keyboardist/composer with the aim of setting up an electronic band. The guy writes some good music and I get on well with him so I can't really say that I'm unhappy there. The issue however is that still, after about nine months since meeting the guy, it's still just the two of us.

To be fair, the guy has done a lot to try to get other people on board but for some reason, it just doesn't seem to be happening. We've jammed with five or six guitarists, several drummers and a lot of singers have been on the cards only for them to slip off the radar after a few weeks. The reasons behind all this range from "too busy" (which reeks of excuse) to a straight up "not interested".

The acid bite for me has come in the last few weeks. There was meant to be a proper session early next week with a drummer and a guitarist but the drummer can't make it as he's playing with his other band that night. This struck a chord with me as I really, really don't want to be a part of someone's side project.

I'm not a bass prodigy but I can play to a high level and I have a lot of musical knowledge, more than the guys we've auditioned I might add. What I lack is experience as I've never played very much with others and I'm beginning to think that there's something about the music or the project that I can't see but that a guy with experience would spot easily. Why is it that, with loads of songs already composed, this thing can't get going?

Thanks guys.
Click to expand...
 
#20
bluewine said:
How do these start ups attract good musicians when you can't offer them gigs or money?

Blue
Click to expand...

I should think the answer to this question would be obvious: Because a new band, built on a foundation of truly inspired original material, offers creative/artistic opportunities that covering existing material doesn't begin to match. Because it offers the opportunity to create something that has never existed before - an opportunity that is incredibly exciting to a genuine musical artist. And because, although it's not as easy to generate an immediate revenue stream as with cover music, on a longer-term basis a successful original band offers the opportunity to produce income from multiple revenue streams (i.e. royalties, licensing fees, etc.) that simply don't exist for cover bands.

That's for starters... :eyebrow:

MM
 

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