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Ampeg PF20T vs. PF50T
- Thread starter el murdoque
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I haven't compared those actual two but I was using an amp with a similar power section to the PF-20T last year (2 6v6 power tubes). IME it was fine for mellower settings such as drummerless cocktail Jazz. Add drums with sticks, or even just assertive vocals & guitar and it runs out of power pretty quickly onstage.
IME the greater wattage of the PF-50T expands the utility window appreciably. (Won't get *loud* loud but it can do loud-ish - especially with a bigger 4 ohm cab.)
I also routinely use the extra padded input (for my extra-hot upright bass signal) and the ultra hi & ultra lo switches (to add acoustic "sizzle" or old-school "thud"), all of which are absent from the 20T.
All those things are worth the extra money and weight to me. YMMV/HTH
IME the greater wattage of the PF-50T expands the utility window appreciably. (Won't get *loud* loud but it can do loud-ish - especially with a bigger 4 ohm cab.)
I also routinely use the extra padded input (for my extra-hot upright bass signal) and the ultra hi & ultra lo switches (to add acoustic "sizzle" or old-school "thud"), all of which are absent from the 20T.
All those things are worth the extra money and weight to me. YMMV/HTH
I believe the 50T also features a mid-selector, which the 20T does not.
I have read home recordists on the official thread (which you might want to check out) suggest that they preferred the tone on the 20T.
One guy had both a 20 and 50 because he liked the former for tracking, the latter for gigs.
I have read home recordists on the official thread (which you might want to check out) suggest that they preferred the tone on the 20T.
One guy had both a 20 and 50 because he liked the former for tracking, the latter for gigs.
I've owned 15W and 18W heads in the past. I know they are not much use in anything more than acoustic coffehouse gigs. The question is how much more you get out of 50.
I guess I'll have to order one from somewhere with a 30 day return policy and then see if I can get some utility out of 50W.
I have compared the heads and own the PF50T.
The PF20T is a great great great sounding amp, true Ampeg bliss.
Having said that, the PF50T is even better.
The thirty extra Watts do make a difference, more volume, more in your face.
And the extra features (for me especially the 5-way mid selector) are a big plus too.
I don't remember a (big) difference in sound, they both Ampeg Portaflex tube heads.
The PF20T is really the PF50T's little sister.
If you're trying to decide which one to get, it is best IMHO to make clear you goals with the amp.
Home practice, studio recording (pro or leisure), rehearsing, gigging, Jazz or hardcore and so on.
The PF20T is a great great great sounding amp, true Ampeg bliss.
Having said that, the PF50T is even better.
The thirty extra Watts do make a difference, more volume, more in your face.
And the extra features (for me especially the 5-way mid selector) are a big plus too.
I don't remember a (big) difference in sound, they both Ampeg Portaflex tube heads.
The PF20T is really the PF50T's little sister.
If you're trying to decide which one to get, it is best IMHO to make clear you goals with the amp.
Home practice, studio recording (pro or leisure), rehearsing, gigging, Jazz or hardcore and so on.
I want one of these but cannot really decide which one to get. The PF50 is obviously more versatile having a mid selector, Ultra high and low selector and a -15db pad. But reading some professional reviews they state that the PF20 has a better tone that comes closer to the vintage B15. I will only be using it for recording at home and the price difference is not a problem or a deciding factor. Maybe the PF20 makes more sense as it will snugly fit on top of my existing Micro VR 210 cab, but the extra features of the PF50 makes me want one of those......Arrrrrgghhhhh!
I was trying to remember if the TB reviewers I read who loved both amps but gave the 20 the edge for recording had happened to have offered any theories as to why this was so. Couldn't recall any such detail.
My own conjecture is that in addition to the fact the 20 would (obviously) break up (even) sooner, the "purer tone" as it is lauded is in fact down to the simplified tone circuit on that model. If so, I vote for the 20 (since you plan to record with it and because it fits your cab, and because perceived volume is not likely to be THAT different).
Yes I agree......I think I will go for the PF20 seeing as it will just be for home recording with headphones. I am currently a quarter of the way through a TB thread of 128 pages highlighting the PF20 AND PF50 models. So wish me luck.....!
Thought this would be the spot to ask this. I'm kinda addicted to the PF line up and loving my RB210. Well I was at my local shop (always a dangerous place for me, and my wallet) but I stumbled upon a used pf50t. I loved the sound of it and it was at a good price. Went back a couple days later, and of course it sold. Currently my stack is a pf800 and 2xpf115he. Question, really I would use it for recording, but wouldn't really mind playing out with it. For the small use I would be using it for I can't justify the 1k price tag of the pf50t, and I know it really wouldn't hold up for my heavy band. Anyone have experience with the pf20t and using it for recording and possibly running it as a preamp to my pf800 for a little more kick from the power section if I wanted to get some rube sound with my hard rock group? Should I just save up for the pf50t, or would the pf20t suffice for what I want?
I like the idea of an 'ol skool tube head but for the life of me I just can't justify the cost of an amp with such little power. To spend $700-1000 for an amp that would be woefully inadequate on the job and the extra weight makes me scratch my head.
I've not ever used one, but ain't that one of the beauties of these amps.....? Being able to run OUTTA the post tranny/ post power tube section... into a larger amp. Thus enabling the full toob sound to a large/ louder amp.
As I said, I haven't used one, tried etc....
As I said, I haven't used one, tried etc....
The struggle is real with that price. The used one, that I'm currently kicking myself in the a$$ for not grabbing, was $750 for the 50t. The only way I can justify it is that the 50t really sounded like a small V4b. If you look at the other tube options from ampeg (v4b, svt-cl, and if you consider the pro series) the price is pretty good. If I could get a sound of the tube v4b from the pf20t for recording, and plus push it out louder through my pf800 then I think $700 is worth it. I just can't find anyone that has dabbled in this area, or feed back on the tone of the pf20t. Like I said, I've tried the 50 and really liked it, but if the 20 is the same and is strong enough to push the pf800 power section then I'll go for it. None of my local stores carry it, so I might be going to sweetwater, and just have a return label waiting.
I have the PF20T and use it for recording through the Tranny out DI. Tone is fantastic IMO. My guitarist buddy, who I record with, when he heard the PF20 (with a Sting Ray 4H) run into his DAW remarked, "that's what bass should sound like".
I seem to recall a discussion on how to run the 20T through a poweramp so it is definitely do-able. I think the discussion was in the thread for PF20T, PF50T, and PF112HLF.
It will also work for a small gig if using the right cab(s). I occasionally run mine through a pair of 112AVs and it's surprising how much volume that combo puts out. Depends on the setting/band, of course.
I seem to recall a discussion on how to run the 20T through a poweramp so it is definitely do-able. I think the discussion was in the thread for PF20T, PF50T, and PF112HLF.
It will also work for a small gig if using the right cab(s). I occasionally run mine through a pair of 112AVs and it's surprising how much volume that combo puts out. Depends on the setting/band, of course.
There are lots of pedals that emulate the sound of an Ampeg tube head (Sansamp, just to name one popular example).
Personally to me, that seems like a better approach than using a PF50T or PF20T basically as a glorified effects pedal into your PF800.
Also I have my doubts that the Transformer Balanced Line Out puts out enough "juice" to drive a power amp to gig volume. It says "Line" but I don't think it is true line level; I think you would probably need a preamp.
Final comment, I wouldn't assume that the PF50T and PF20T sound identical. They have different preamps.
(Source: PF20T owner but haven't tried the PF50T yet.)
Used as an actual amp head to drive a cabinet, it's great!
I think you should stick with the PF800 and get a pedal if you need 800w but think your tone is too clean.
Personally to me, that seems like a better approach than using a PF50T or PF20T basically as a glorified effects pedal into your PF800.
Also I have my doubts that the Transformer Balanced Line Out puts out enough "juice" to drive a power amp to gig volume. It says "Line" but I don't think it is true line level; I think you would probably need a preamp.
Final comment, I wouldn't assume that the PF50T and PF20T sound identical. They have different preamps.
(Source: PF20T owner but haven't tried the PF50T yet.)
Used as an actual amp head to drive a cabinet, it's great!
I think you should stick with the PF800 and get a pedal if you need 800w but think your tone is too clean.
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I ended up owning both the 20 and the 50.
The 20 was bought off ebay for a ridiculous price. I must admit that in hindsight, I liked that one a lot more than the 50. I assumed for some reason that the 50 had an FX loop, which it does not.
It has different tubes, though. And the Ampeg typical EQ secition (HI/LO Buttons, Mid selection with 5 settings).
The small one was a bit simpler with just bass/mids/treble.
All in all I would say: The PF 20 sounds a bit warmer and a bit softer, and it reaches saturation a lot earlier. I've had problems running out of headroom playing an active 6 string with boosted bass into it. The low notes were not clean enough. The PF 50 has that kind of headroom and is even capable of producing a serious volume, depending on the size and quality of your cabinets.
The transistor out on both is able to drive a poweramp, but it is a bit too weak to get 100%.
It is a bit noisy, too (I've had mine without the hum buster mod). I ended up selling both.
The transistor out sounds like a good idea on paper, but I preferred the pre out because it sounded MUCH better - and when you're only utilizing the preamp section, it's a bit much to carry the whole amp.
JeezyMcNuggles
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Yes. It's worth it.
Expanded pre amp
Bigger power amp
Louder, cleaner, more tonal options.
Keep you pf800. It's an amazing little amp. I've owned 2 of them, and will probably buy one again. It's just always a sure thing.
If you want a tube amp, I highly recommend a v4b. Best amp I've ever owned.
Hey guys, I'm seeing some conflicting input here (which is to be expected) and I'm trying to discern between the PF20 T and the 50T. Here's what I'll be using it for. I am completely ampless for live gigs and I'm trying to get a great full tube amp tone going through the board to FOH. I have a pedal board full of stuff to compress, preamp and DI and I'm just not happy with it. It seems to me the DI outs on these could be an awesome way to get that Ampeg tone right into the board? So, I'm guessing for that use only the 20 would do it. However, there will be times here and there where an actual cabinet will be needed (I have other rigs I can use but would like to use this if possible) so that might make it prudent to get the 50? Thoughts? I keep hearing that the 20 might not be loud enough for a full band gig but I'm surprised by that. I play guitar as well and I have a 20 watt all tube guitar head (Marshall) and that 20 watts is louder than I could ever want!! Why is the wattage in all tube bass amps not the same way?? Thanks for the input!
Lance
Lance
Hi LVannerson
A guitar will get way louder than a bass with the same watts.
This is because the low notes of a bass guitar need a lot of power to get loud. More than higher notes.
Regarding the PF50T: the tranny out is sublime as I have experienced at the gigs I have played.
The PF20T has great sound but isn't powerful enough when playing in a band.
IMHO YMMV
A guitar will get way louder than a bass with the same watts.
This is because the low notes of a bass guitar need a lot of power to get loud. More than higher notes.
Regarding the PF50T: the tranny out is sublime as I have experienced at the gigs I have played.
The PF20T has great sound but isn't powerful enough when playing in a band.
IMHO YMMV
