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Anyone with more than one signal path?

kiat

kiat

Aug 31, 2010
179
79
Louth, Lincolnshire
blog.papalima.com
#1
Hello TBers,

My wireless bass receiver has an inbuilt splitter with two independent 1/4" TS outputs and I'm thinking of running them each through separate signal paths, then recombining them post-processing into a single mono signal, to emulate two separate basses playing in unison, perfectly or imperfectly. E.g. "Walk on the Wild Side", "I Want You Back", "Black Dog".
I'm pretty sure this will sound very different to putting all the effects into a linear, single signal path.

Does anyone do this with 2+ signal paths? Is there a thread on this already?
 
#2
If you're talking about delaying one of the signals so that it's a 'doubling' effect, I wouldn't bother for live, it'll end up muddying the mix and making you sound worse overall. But, if you mean applying different effects to each signal chain, then yeah, that's something I've been doing for years, it can result in massive tones. Though, I should add the caveat that it's even better running each signal chain into its own amp.
 
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#4
Barghest said:
If you're talking about delaying one of the signals so that it's a 'doubling' effect, I wouldn't bother for live, it'll end up muddying the mix and making you sound worse overall. But, if you mean applying different effects to each signal chain, then yeah, that's something I've been doing for years, it can result in massive tones. Though, I should add the caveat that it's even better running each signal chain into its own amp.
Click to expand...
What I want to do is the 2nd scenario. Good to hear you've been doing this - can you elaborate on examples of your chains?

I mostly play in small (sub-200) venues, so it could work well feeding one chain into my stage amp and the other into FOH.
 
#5
Zbysek said:
I am using crossover splitter to divide my signal into two frequency ranges. I apply different effects to either range (Compressor and octaver to lows, dirt and envelope filter to mids/highs) a then blend the two signals back together.
Click to expand...
It's not what I intended to experiment with, but I hadn't thought of sorting the signal by frequency range - fascinating! What make/model do use to do the splitting?
 
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#7
kiat said:
Is there a thread on this already?
Click to expand...
In case you want to read more about parallel processing, check the following threads:

BurningSkies

Thread 'Cross-Over (Crossover or Splitter) pedals'

I've been using a 'crossover' pedal now for a couple years. I find it to be a great pedal-board utility, but have been sort of underwhelmed by TB's representation of them in the Effects forum. So... I guess it's time to fix that.


I want to talk about the hows and whys of using a crossover, have a resource for those who want to look at options, and give some quick pros and cons of the ones I've got experience with.

So...What is a crossover pedal and why would you want one?

-A cross-over pedal takes your bass' signal and splits it in two... with the 'lows' below a point going one place...
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D

Thread 'Parallel Processing for Metal "Clanky" Tones'

TB team,

I'm trying to learn more about parallel processing for what I've seen called a "clanky" metal bass tone. Recently I posted a thread asking for input on a rack bass rig that I'm putting together and user FugaziBomb described a processing path which split the frequencies and then ran the low side through an octave effect so that as they climbed the fretboard the octaver maintained a presence in the low octave range. That got me thinking about other pedal setups using parallel processing. I've been eyeballing the Darkglass X7 because it seems to do a lot of what I want but there are...
  • Deloofs
  • chorus darkglass distortion ls-2 ls2 octave overdrive parallel processing x7
  • Replies: 89
  • Forum: Effects [BG]
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D

Thread 'KMA Tyler for Parallel Processing'

I recently picked up a used original/non-deluxe KMA Tyler and it rules. I wanted to come here and write a review and description of how I’m using it.

I’ve been looking for an analog way to do parallel processing (nothing wrong with digital I just wanted to go the analog route). I’m able to get the tone I want in my DAW by splitting the signal, low passing at 100hz and slamming with limiting, and high passing the other at 1000hz and running it through distortion. I had been using an EHX Tri Parallel Mixer and was able to get close using the onboard tone controls but it wasn’t quite there...
  • Deloofs
  • boss compression distortion kma limiter parallel tyler
  • Replies: 31
  • Forum: Effects [BG]
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Valvehead

Thread 'Best parallel bass processing dirtbox for dUg Pinnick/Chris Squire tone?'

I have owned the Tech 21 DP-3X and a Darkglass X pedal.
The Darkglass was sounding too modern, the DP-3X has impossible tiny knobs for controls.

Currently owning the Two Notes Le Bass which is doing a pretty good job.
We need ballsy low end with kinda classic guitar OD on top.

Wondering if the Orange Bass Butler would be an upgrade.
Seeing as it is a rather pricy pedal I want some certainty before pulling the trigger.

Which pedal do you think is best fit for the job?
Muddytone

Thread 'The Joys of Parallel Dirt'

A fellow called Chapster tried a thread on this just over a year ago ("running dirt pedals in parallel"), but it didn't take off, I've found little else on it, and this is too important to let go. So, my first thread (or at least post) ...

I have myself an EHX Tri-Parallel Mixer that allows me to run a dry signal along with three parallel chains/channels and blend them at the end (with phase switching options, levels and an eq knob for each) and have been experimenting with it for about six months now. I run a large pedalboard and got the mixer to allow different routing options (I'm now...
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JehuJava

Thread 'Parallel effects processing'

I'm thinking about trying this. Not many effect pedal based samples are on the internet. Anyone have any good samples of this? I mean beyond running a clean channel and effect channel. Maybe something with multiple effects on different channels at the same time?
 
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#8
Not quite, but I a lot of parallel processing is happening in my signal chain, due to pedals with clean/dry blend functionality, and several effects loop pedals/mixers as well.

Which essentially gives the same result.

For my basic "clean" tone for example I got a picthshifter set to blend in a parallel 1 octave up effect, then I got an overdriven preamp/drive blended with parallel clean/dry signal via a Boss LS-2, and finally an amp/cab emulator with a build in drive, set to just on the verge of breakup, again blended parallely.

Other than that I have high gain distortion chain, where 2 distortion pedals are blended in parallel with each other, both blended with a bit of parallel clean/dry signal, and another 3 channel mixer pedal that blends respectively phaser, flanger and clean/dry signal in parallel as I desire.

Beside that delay and reverb effect that also is blended in parallel with clean/dry signal.

I can recommend experimenting with blending different drive pedals in parallel, to obtain unique drive characters and tones, phaser and flanger blended in parallel with each other sounds amazing too.
 
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#9
You can do this with something as simple as an HX Stomp which allows to two parallel paths. The bigger Helix units allow for even more. In my case I split the signal before the Stomp and run the other signal to another multi- effects unit. I connect the effects loop on each unit to each other. That way I can have multiple combinations of different routings across several parallel paths. I can route the entire combined output to come from the either unit or I can take the outputs from each effects unit separately. There are many ways to go about it and it gives you so many more creative sound opportunities.
 
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#11
I am splitting my signal for personal creative work at home, but not using it live (mostly because I don't think the guitar player liked me playing in his sandbox so to speak). My split signal is basically creating a rhythm guitar tone that is playing the same as the bass (similar to what Mike Kerr does for his Royal Blood tone). It isn't quite the same as what he does, but my own take on it. It involves an ABY switch box that splits the signal with channel A going to my normal bass board and amp. Channel B hits an octave pedal that takes the signal up an octave, then into various pedals to achieve the desired result, including a BOSS Harmonist pedal to add the additional 5th up for a pseudo-power chord and finally into a guitar amp. I think it sounds pretty cool and has it's uses...but again, not something I am currently utilizing outside my home studio.
 
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#12
Aye.

Bass --> Tuner --> Compressor --> Splitter (Morley ABY Mix)---->

> Mix A Out --> Preamp --> Audio Interface Channel 1 --> Ableton Live "Bass Channel" ----->
> Mix B Out --> 1 octave down 100% Wet --> LPF Always on @ 200Hz -->Audio Interface Channel 2 --> Ableton Live "Sub Channel" ----->

> Ableton Live Bass & Sub Subgroup Channel.

That way i can put different FX on the Bass and Sub channels, or on the group of both channels, and automate the FX and Mutes accordingly & independently. Sometimes i have automations as fine grained as 1 single note so that 1 note sounds different from the rest of the measure.

It's for a very specific project where i'm doing dance music with live instruments. Everyone needs Ableton, and everyone's copy of ableton need to be sync'd using Ableton Link, and we have to play lock-step with Ableton's BPM, which is also automated across songs, so all the automations happen the exact right moments. Think electronic music DJ set, but everything is being played with instruments that sound like synths, and songs overlapping.
 
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#13
I often use it inside my Ampero. Mostly I use a clean and an overdrive split/blend, but I also use the Ric-O-Sound of my Rickenbacker bass with the stereo input of the Ampero. My band is doing "While My Guitar Gently Weeps", and with my setup I can emulate the double-tracked bass (one DI, one amped) on the recording.
 
#14
kiat said:
What I want to do is the 2nd scenario. Good to hear you've been doing this - can you elaborate on examples of your chains?

I mostly play in small (sub-200) venues, so it could work well feeding one chain into my stage amp and the other into FOH.
Click to expand...
Yep, as others have said, it's a well documented technique, with a lot of people employing it to their own benefits. For me, my way of doing it was coming in to my board mono, wireless, tuner, etc. then immediately into a transformer isolated ABY box, always set to Y except for the moments I wanted that scuzzy, nasty, all mids and treble sound so I'd kill the 'clean' send from there. It's after the split that I used different effects, in my case a Sansamp clone on my 'clean' for just a little grit, and the other side I moved through a few things, from a DS1 to eventually a DOD 250, running into a guitar head into my 8x10. The sound was monstrous.
 
#15
I had a 'need'* to cop the Tom Petersson 12 string bass tone into two amps thing. I'm not willing to invest in a 12 string bass** for one or two songs, so I took a pedalboard approach- with an EHX Nano POG splitting an octave up from my dry tone, and directing the octave up to a Line 6 POD Express, which handles the guitar amp sim, drive and modulation fx. It works amazingly well, especially if I use a stereo DI out of the POD Express using flange, chorus and reverb fx on the guitar patches. With a single guitar player, I can fill in the mix when he solos if the song calls for it. I use a volume pedal to fade the effect in and out.

EDIT: looking at my actual board, I'm using the Olympic Preamp's Thru output to route to the POG. I believe I did try the dry out of the POG but it was noisier with or without POG or POD engaged. The EQ2 can also be used for splitting / combining and HPF / LPF (more or less).

I've tried using the POD Ex for bass modulation too- chorus, flange, phase, reverb, etc and a even dirt, and it works quite well and you can HPF the patches on the POD express to retain the full low / mid clarity of the dry bass tone.

* Do I even need to explain what I mean by need? That which goes without saying need not be said...
* The domestic harmony tax steep on such an item; Pedals are easier to blend in / hide in plain sight.


Path is tuner > Olympic in, > Thru to the Vol pedal >POD >POG. no return path- out goes to a DI or into aux-in on my amp / could use the EQ2 to mix it back in)
FX loop on the Olympic to the Empress comp > C4 > EQ2 > fx loop in on the Olympic, then DI to the board, amp out to my stage amp.

1759857262917.png
 
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#16
I have been playing two signals for years at this point. Either with the pedalboard of with the Helix. Basically some effects, then split the signal and have their own dedicated signal chain. Two DI's out, two signals into the stereo poweramp into two different cabs.

One signal is mainly a normal bass signal, maybe a bit thicker. The other one contains drives, distortions and all that stuff.

The effects before the splitting are octaves or heavy ambient sounds, where I am not interested in hearing a clean signal through (mainly for noises, in between songs and so on).
 
#17
kiat said:
I mostly play in small (sub-200) venues, so it could work well feeding one chain into my stage amp and the other into FOH.
Click to expand...

This is, quite possibly, a recipe for disaster. It will produce great results if the FOH person is capable enough and willing to work with you on such a setup. (Hint: Your average sound person for a sub 200 venue did not graduate with honors from a well known sound engineering college).

In the mindset of a sound person for a small venue, you might be a welcome challenge, a worthy sidequest for an otherwise boring evening.
You might also be something else entirely: More work than anticipated.
 
#18
kiat said:
Hello TBers,

My wireless bass receiver has an inbuilt splitter with two independent 1/4" TS outputs and I'm thinking of running them each through separate signal paths, then recombining them post-processing into a single mono signal, to emulate two separate basses playing in unison, perfectly or imperfectly. E.g. "Walk on the Wild Side", "I Want You Back", "Black Dog".
I'm pretty sure this will sound very different to putting all the effects into a linear, single signal path.

Does anyone do this with 2+ signal paths? Is there a thread on this already?
Click to expand...
I'm primarily driving the bus and singing backups with my current band - nothing fancy with my bass sound right now - but I picked up an EHX Tri-Parallel Mixer a while ago knowing that if I wanted to do this or that... or the other on the fly, this could be a good enabler. Not quite the same as let's say a Boss LS-2, but when I want to noodle with my signal going in different directions when I'm funkin' around at home, this box let's me have some fun.
 
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