Attenuator for MESA/Boogie Subway TT-800

[wonitta]

Thanks for those replies. Now it makes to me. Specially what agedhorse said. It looks like the Subway WD-800 DI is not post master volume. That might be the one that solves my issue.

 

[Janforth]

If the OP is using the channel switching and 2 channels, he would need 2 channels to the board and hen mute and unmute the desired channel at the board which is a bigger pain.

Not sure if this would work, but Radial JDI has a merge feature that turns the Input and Thru jacks into a passive mixer to sum both signals to mono out, run each effect send (Boogie and Subway) into the JDI’ input and thru, and toggle from the amp.

 

[KellyC]

Attenuators like the Weber are made for the vintage 25-50w tube amps that don't have a master volume so that you can get optimal drive on the tubes for tone purposes without a dB level that will inspire your wife to divorce you.

You're working with an 800w amp.

 

[KellyC]

Thanks for those replies. Now it makes to me. Specially what agedhorse said. It looks like the Subway WD-800 DI is not post master volume. That might be the one that solves my issue.

He literally designed that amp, so it would not be unreasonable to take his words as law.

 

[N4860]

Thanks for those replies. Now it makes to me. Specially what agedhorse said. It looks like the Subway WD-800 DI is not post master volume. That might be the one that solves my issue.

Personally I have both the TT800 and WD800 and I prefer the WD800 but both can get great tones pretty easily. So I'd highly recommend the WD800 if you like the TT. You should be able to sell the TT800 pretty easily too.

 

[S-Bigbottom]

Switch your amp's DI to Pre and done.

Nothing to mess with.
Nothing to buy.
Nothing to mess up.

 

[agedhorse]

Not sure if this would work, but Radial JDI has a merge feature that turns the Input and Thru jacks into a passive mixer to sum both signals to mono out, run each effect send (Boogie and Subway) into the JDI’ input and thru, and toggle from the amp.

That will give a summed signal which will not work in this application. The channels must remain separated, not summed.

 

[sawzalot]

This is yet another reason why I love my Subway Plus preamp...the two DI's on it do exactly what I need.

 

[silky smoove]

Switch your amp's DI to Pre and done.

Nothing to mess with.
Nothing to buy.
Nothing to mess up.

This. This, which has been repeated throughout the thread. Not sure if @wonitta has seen it as they haven't acknowledged this as an option.

 

[g-dude]

Thanks for those replies. Now it makes to me. Specially what agedhorse said. It looks like the Subway WD-800 DI is not post master volume. That might be the one that solves my issue.

I’m confused.

The pre setting on the DI is not controlled by master volume, as has been mentioned.

Why don’t you just do that?

 

[fishdude101101]

No, not a good idea, and there are no commercial attenuators capable of handling anywhere near the power of the amp.

Also, do NOT connect the speaker output to anything but a speaker. The speaker output is not ground referenced and any device that is ground referenced, either through a pin 1 connection on the XLR output, the sleeve connection of a 1/4 jack or through the power supply. Connecting to such a device may damage the amplifier and this is not covered under warranty.

The post DI output has to be post master volume controls in order to track relative levels for the channel switching. If it’s that important to you, there’s the pre DI output that’s also tube driven and pre master volume.

Single channel subways do not operate like this, correct?

 

[dkelley]

Attenuators like the Weber are made for the vintage 25-50w tube amps that don't have a master volume so that you can get optimal drive on the tubes for tone purposes without a dB level that will inspire your wife to divorce you.

You're working with an 800w amp.

and they are meant to go into a speaker cab, at that, which is an ungrounded device. as agedhorse mentioned... so even if you went low enough in volume, you wouldn't ever be able to use one to plug into an input of any other device than a single speaker

 

[Stylee Mousse]

I feel like we are solving a non problem. But I guess that’s a TB speciality.

who are these eggshell sound men who can’t cope? Lotsa pieces of this scenario not spelled out…

 

[agedhorse]

Single channel subways do not operate like this, correct?

Correct, the TT-800 uses this architecture specifically so that the post DI output follows the channel switching. It's a fundamental necessity of the channel switching architecture.

 

[logdrum]

Instead of giving up on the TT-800 and buying aWD-800. Get 2 DI (I recommend Warm Audio passive with an output pad and it also has pass-through - not sure if you need to get that back to the returns since the FX loops are series ) and get the signal from the effects sends (there are 2). I do think the WARM with the output pad would be an advantage because you can mimic the ratio of your channel volume. Or work with the FOH so that he trims the faders accordingly

That's what the manual suggests. There's nothing super special about the Subway DI. A good transformer DI will be more than enough. Those WARMS use Cinemag. JDI passive if you want Jensen.

 

[agedhorse]

Instead of giving up on the TT-800 and buying aWD-800. Get 2 DI (I recommend Warm Audio passive with an output pad and it also has pass-through - not sure if you need to get that back to the returns since the FX loops are series ) and get the signal from the effects sends (there are 2). I do think the WARM with the output pad would be an advantage because you can mimic the ratio of your channel volume. Or work with the FOH so that he trims the faders accordingly

That's what the manual suggests. There's nothing super special about the Subway DI. A good transformer DI will be more than enough. Those WARMS use Cinemag. JDI passive if you want Jensen.

View attachment 5376920

ANY reasonable passive DI will be plenty fine, no need to buy into the marketing of such "special" devices when driven from an active source.

The problem with this solution, however, is that both effects sends are always active so if channel switching is used, the channels on the console also need to be switched. This feature is really intended for tracking along with the pre-DI so that choices can me made at mixdown.

 

[Grahams Groove]

This thread is making me crazy every time I check back. Why are people talking about attenuators and splitters and purchasing multiple DI boxes?

The amp does what the OP is asking, and the manual explains it clearly.

 

[logdrum]

ANY reasonable passive DI will be plenty fine, no need to buy into the marketing of such "special" devices when driven from an active source.

The problem with this solution, however, is that both effects sends are always active so if channel switching is used, the channels on the console also need to be switched. This feature is really intended for tracking along with the pre-DI so that choices can me made at mixdown.

Well if that tone from the 2 channels is something the OP needs but he does not want to set the master at a volume that would either be too much stage volume or not enough signal post DI. I don't see any other way but to use the effect sends. You guys wrote it in the manual. So maybe update your manual and explain it a bit further.

Are you saying that regardless of what channel is used that both sends will be active. If so maybe add it to the manual as well.

About the DI recommendations, it's not like I am recommending a Noble or Reddi. The WARMs cost me 99 each. Mesa Subway owners are not on a tight budget. But yeah, they can use Behringer's 2 and they even have a 2 channel version to even lower th cost.

 

[agedhorse]

Well if that tone from the 2 channels is something the OP needs but he does not want to set the master at a volume that would either be too much stage volume or not enough signal post DI. I don't see any other way but to use the effect sends. You guys wrote it in the manual. So maybe update your manual and explain it a bit further.

Are you saying that regardless of what channel is used that both sends will be active. If so maybe add it to the manual as well.

About the DI recommendations, it's not like I am recommending a Noble or Reddi. The WARMs cost me 99 each. Mesa Subway owners are not on a tight budget. But yeah, they can use Behringer's 2 and they even have a 2 channel version to even lower th cost.

The signal flow and switching diagram shows everything. Both channels are active all the time, the effects sends are pre channel switching and the post eq DI is post channel switching. This is discussed in the manual. It’s s asking been discussed how summing the two channels was never the intent due to serious phase differences between the two channels from the very different voicings.

 

[Pep]

Hello!

My chain goes from my Mesa Subway amp to an X32 and then to FOH. I'm also plugging into a Mesa Subway 2x15 cab. I want to be able to control the cab volume without affecting the level that goes out to FOH. The issue is that the amp master volume (both pre and post) affect what goes out to FOH.

I've read that attenuators could be a solution to tame the cab volume without messing with the amp master level. What attenuators would you guys recommend that are suitable for this situation? Thanks!

Direct Box. Place it after whatever effects you’re using. Problem solved.