I never said the patrons were continuously recording. We had our camcorder doing that. Two people indicated they were uncomfortable.
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Audience members unconfortable with video recording
- Thread starter Marley's Ghost
- Start date
I never said the patrons were continuously recording. We had our camcorder doing that. Two people indicated they were uncomfortable.
You should check the law - I'm not a lawyer, but it looks like in Florida it depends on the use - if it is for private viewing you are probably ok, but if you are using videos for promotion or advertising you could get into trouble.
"The four types of privacy actions include: (1) appropriation, involving the unauthorized use of a person's name or likeness; (2) intrusion, involving physical or electronic intrusion into one's private quarters; (3) public disclosure of private facts, involving the dissemination of truthful private information that a reasonable person would find objectionable; and (4) false light in the public eye, involving the publication of facts that place a person in a false light even though the facts themselves may not be defamatory."
If you film someone in a bar who has told their spouse they are going to a movie and it breaks up the marriage, you may be liable to action. If you film someone drunk they could bring action for defamation or disclosing private facts.
Notice on Google Street View all the licence plates and faces are blurred out - people have a right to privacy.
"The four types of privacy actions include: (1) appropriation, involving the unauthorized use of a person's name or likeness; (2) intrusion, involving physical or electronic intrusion into one's private quarters; (3) public disclosure of private facts, involving the dissemination of truthful private information that a reasonable person would find objectionable; and (4) false light in the public eye, involving the publication of facts that place a person in a false light even though the facts themselves may not be defamatory."
If you film someone in a bar who has told their spouse they are going to a movie and it breaks up the marriage, you may be liable to action. If you film someone drunk they could bring action for defamation or disclosing private facts.
Notice on Google Street View all the licence plates and faces are blurred out - people have a right to privacy.
- Jan 26, 2014
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- I teach lessons and perform live music in and around San Diego CA. Sometimes I even make money doing it!
You're shooting a video of your band, and people are worried about being incidentally caught in that video? No, I don't think people can legally have an expectation of privacy in a public place, but I'm not a lawyer and don't know this specific scenario. If somebody raised a stink about it, I would reach into my pocket, hand them their ticket fee, and be done with them, hopefully for the rest of our lives.
It's amazing what people will complain about.
Pay the audience and get model release forms.
Sound unreasonable? How about if I show up to your band's gigs and record you (for whatever reason) without paying you or even getting your permission? Fair?
Clubs are private property. The rules are set by the club owner. I would avoid going to clubs that were ok with a band doing this (well intentioned or not), but that's me.
Sound unreasonable? How about if I show up to your band's gigs and record you (for whatever reason) without paying you or even getting your permission? Fair?
Clubs are private property. The rules are set by the club owner. I would avoid going to clubs that were ok with a band doing this (well intentioned or not), but that's me.
An audience member videoing is one thing. You can't be held responsible for that. But a video the band is taking, or having taken for them is a different matter.
Also, a video casually taken of the audience and posted on YT that landed somebody in hot water for something isn't a good thing. Especially if the person affected decides to do something to the band in retaliation. Which is particularly problematic because you'll never know that person is out to get you till it happens.
It's not entirely far fetched these days.
Equally amazing what people can sue about and how that alone can make your personal life and finances a total nightmare whether they win or lose. Because win or lose, legal problems will cost you. Even if you win out in the end. Don't expect you'll be able to recoup any of your legal expenses either. And even trying to (assuming it's allowed - there are rules about that too) will cost you even more time, money, and grief.
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FYI - bars aren't public spaces. The street in front may be in certain circumstances. But not inside the place. It's private property and the management has control over who may enter. So it's not automatic or that simple.
Time was when most places didn't allow photography or videotaping - period. With the advent of phone cams and photo posting sites and YouTube some people seem to think the privacy laws have fundamentally changed.
They haven't.
- Jan 26, 2014
- 1,525
- 1,946
- Disclosures
- I teach lessons and perform live music in and around San Diego CA. Sometimes I even make money doing it!
Is anyone here commenting actually a lawyer with any background in such a case? Of the billions of people inadvertently captured on video, where is the legal precedent for any of this worry?
This literally happens at every gig I've ever played or been to... Nobody in the crowd takes photos or videos of your band during your set? Or if they do, they PAY YOU!? LOL
About the time you put that on social media, if you are, and someone looses their job or something to that affect you might be opening yourself up to a lawsuit.
I've never cared about the audience taking photos or videos of my band, personally. But I think you missed my point.
If some one wants to take a photo, video or audio recording of your band and release it (for money, attention, whatever) you should have a say in that (see: intellectual property laws). I am arguing that this same rule should apply to any person in a privately owned public space (setting).
Fortunately in Florida we have a two-party consent law. We respect privacy here. There are exceptions to the two-party consent if you don't have a reasonable expectation of privacy, but it gets pretty indistinct quickly (legally speaking), so act at your own risk.
Just so you know, my tone is not combative (no offense taken or given at all). I'm just exploring the topic.
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I don't want to be anywhere near a camera unless the camera guy tells me I'm pretty and gives me a T-shirt.
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There are two issues here, and one is more minor than the other.
Minor: Potential discomfort by audience knowing they are being filmed and not knowing what that footage is being used for.
Major: Using someone's likeness, without written consent, in the promotional materials for your business. This is the one you are going to get sued over.
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Minor: Potential discomfort by audience knowing they are being filmed and not knowing what that footage is being used for.
Major: Using someone's likeness, without written consent, in the promotional materials for your business. This is the one you are going to get sued over.
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Wow. We shoot video all the time in public places. We aim it at the band, at the crowd. My drummer routinely brings a GoPro and clips it somewhere. Our fans spontaneously bust out their hand-held devices and shoot video all the time. We have lots of patrons, guests, and audience members in those videos. We post stuff to our web site and Facebook all the time. Most bands in my neighborhood are doing the exact same thing.
I guess it should come as no surprise that a small percentage of those people in the videos may include those who want to protect their privacy even out in public, and in this sue-happy society of ours my band mates and I are at risk.
Crying shame.
I guess it should come as no surprise that a small percentage of those people in the videos may include those who want to protect their privacy even out in public, and in this sue-happy society of ours my band mates and I are at risk.
Crying shame.
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I tend to assume that most shows are being videotaped.
many are!
it starts, i think, with getting the club's permission, and then the audience's (giving notice). some venues simply don't allow it. some don't care. i think the OP's experience is pretty common: local bar, video taping the band for fun and promotion.
- Sep 4, 2010
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- Endorsing: Martin Keith Guitars
In the scene that I play in (more of a listening party environment than drunken bar-type of thing), shows get taped all the time either by the band, local archivists, some blogger or press, or all of those at the same time, and nobody gives a sh*t.
I can see the issue if it potentially puts someone in danger. I did avoid capturing a friend who is a female musician from a country ruled by orthodox clergy, (she often gets sent on foreign tours with a religious chaperone). Being filmed without veil and appearing on FB could have gotten her into serious trouble.
But the way I understand the OPs situation, I just don't see how audience members with camera phone in hand can have a reasonable objection against you filming your own band (assuming that is what you are doing-trailing the camera on the crowd may be another matter).
I suppose local habits differ widely.
I can see the issue if it potentially puts someone in danger. I did avoid capturing a friend who is a female musician from a country ruled by orthodox clergy, (she often gets sent on foreign tours with a religious chaperone). Being filmed without veil and appearing on FB could have gotten her into serious trouble.
But the way I understand the OPs situation, I just don't see how audience members with camera phone in hand can have a reasonable objection against you filming your own band (assuming that is what you are doing-trailing the camera on the crowd may be another matter).
I suppose local habits differ widely.
This thread is more interesting than I thought it would be.
You could always make it into a bit of theater.
"Hey, we might be filming a little bit of our show tonight. If you are out with someone you shouldn't be with, or you called in sick to work today, maybe stay away from the very front of the stage and hang out in the back by the bar. Or, if you are really concerned, please see us for a pair of dark sunglasses and/or band hat to help hide your identity. They are available for a small fee."
*proceed to sell band branded dark sunglasses and trucker hats emblazoned with I WENT TO SEE BAND X WHEN I SHOULDN'T HAVE AND ALL I GOT WAS THIS INCOGNITO HAT*
You could always make it into a bit of theater.
"Hey, we might be filming a little bit of our show tonight. If you are out with someone you shouldn't be with, or you called in sick to work today, maybe stay away from the very front of the stage and hang out in the back by the bar. Or, if you are really concerned, please see us for a pair of dark sunglasses and/or band hat to help hide your identity. They are available for a small fee."
*proceed to sell band branded dark sunglasses and trucker hats emblazoned with I WENT TO SEE BAND X WHEN I SHOULDN'T HAVE AND ALL I GOT WAS THIS INCOGNITO HAT*
From what I have read, "right to privacy" is not enshrined in either the US or Canadian constitutions. Not sure about other countries. Case law is complex in this area. "Expectation of privacy" is a whole other concept, some of which might be enshrined in legislation, but much is not. And even then, the notion of privacy has more to do with governments prying into peoples lives.
I'd like to think that anything I do is "private", but the reality is that as soon as I leave my house, nothing is truly private anymore. But yeah, I wouldn't care to have a camera on me all night if I was at a gig, but I also have a reasonable expectation that I *could* be photographed or videotaped - and (usually) act accordingly.
I'd like to think that anything I do is "private", but the reality is that as soon as I leave my house, nothing is truly private anymore. But yeah, I wouldn't care to have a camera on me all night if I was at a gig, but I also have a reasonable expectation that I *could* be photographed or videotaped - and (usually) act accordingly.
