B string sounds dead

[Acoustic356]

This is interesting...

When I play my May custom short scale bass through my Mesa Subway D800+ head and 2 Trickfish SM-112s, there is a noticeable dip in volume on the B string.

If I put my Warwick LWA 1000 or Taurus Quebec 450 on the same cabs the problem goes away.

When I play my May custom short scale bass through my Mesa Subway D800+ head and 2 Bergantino HDN112s, this doesn’t happen.

Any idea as to why his could happen?

 

[ThisBass]

What's your experience with this issue for note E1 on the B-string versus note E1 on the E-string?
You may also want check (and tell) the difference of F#1 on B-string versus F#1 on E-string.

 

[Acoustic356]

What's your experience with this issue for note E1 on the B-string versus note E1 on the E-string?
You may also want check (and tell) the difference of F#1 on B-string versus F#1 on E-string.

Using the Mesa/Trickfish combination, notes on the E string ring true. Not tes on the B string do not.

When I switch to the Mesa/Berg all notes ring true.

 

[ThisBass]

Using the Mesa/Trickfish combination, notes on the E string ring true. Not tes on the B string do not.

When I switch to the Mesa/Berg all notes ring true.

ok, so let me ask you the next question. What is your prefered sound and how do you adjust the EQ, respectively the EQ knobs?

 

[agedhorse]

I wonder if possibly the cabinet (or one of your speaker cables) is wired reverse polarity? Sometimes (not common), polarity can matter in that if the pickups are microphonic the sympathetic vibration at that note's frequency can subtract from the energy generated by the string.

Have you done the "battery test" with each cabinet?

 

[Acoustic356]

ok, so let me ask you the next question. What is your prefered sound and how do you adjust the EQ, respectively the EQ knobs?

Both the bass and the amp are set flat.

 

[Acoustic356]

I wonder if possibly the cabinet (or one of your speaker cables) is wired reverse polarity? Sometimes (not common), polarity can matter in that if the pickups are microphonic the sympathetic vibration at that note's frequency can subtract from the energy generated by the string.

Have you done the "battery test" with each cabinet?

The problem doesn’t happen when I use my Warwick LWA 1000 or Taurus Quine 450 head on the Trickfish cabs. Only with tha Mesa.

 

[Downunderwonder]

I wonder if possibly the cabinet (or one of your speaker cables) is wired reverse polarity? Sometimes (not common), polarity can matter in that if the pickups are microphonic the sympathetic vibration at that note's frequency can subtract from the energy generated by the string.

Have you done the "battery test" with each cabinet?

That is an intriguing possibility. I don't see that microphonic pickups would be a requirement though.

For simple system polarity fudge there would need to be a change in cabling to account for the various outcomes I think.

Amp A + Cabs A, no cigar.
Amp B or C + Cabs A, all good.
Amp A + Cabs B, all good.

One bad daisy link not used on the A cabs with B and C amps perhaps.

 

[Downunderwonder]

The problem doesn’t happen when I use my Warwick LWA 1000 or Taurus Quine 450 head on the Trickfish cabs. Only with tha Mesa.

See above. What connections are used in each case?

 

[mmbongo]

Try 1 cab at a time and see if the sound changes drastically when you add a 2nd cab. But try each cab individually first and see what happens.

 

[Acoustic356]

You may have solved the problem!

When I use one of the Neutrik connectors from the Mesa and daisy chain the cabs I hear the issue.

When I use both Neutrik connectors and connect one to each cab, the B string is present.

Thanks!

See above. What connections are used in each case?

Try 1 cab at a time and see if the sound changes drastically when you add a 2nd cab. But try each cab individually first and see what happens.

 

[ThisBass]

The problem doesn’t happen when I use my Warwick LWA 1000 or Taurus Quine 450 head on the Trickfish cabs. Only with tha Mesa.

So if I understand your words right you have turned all the EQ knobs at noon just to get a flat response no matter which amplifier you are playing?

 

[ThisBass]

View attachment 3194380
You may have solved the problem!

When I use one of the Neutrik connectors from the Mesa and daisy chain the cabs I hear the issue.

When I use both Neutrik connectors and connect one to each cab, the B string is present.

Thanks!

It Seems like the cable that you used for daisy chaining reverses polarity. Did you make the cable by DIY?

 

[Acoustic356]

So if I understand your words right you have turned all the EQ knobs at noon just to get a flat response no matter which amplifier you are playing?

That is correct. I always like to get a sense of what the basic tone is before turning knobs on the head or the bass.

 

[Acoustic356]

It Seems like the cable that you used for daisy chaining reverses polarity. Did you make the cable by DIY?

All cables purchased from Sweetwater.

I don’t think the polarity was reversed. Did not have the same problem with the other heads.

 

[mmbongo]

View attachment 3194380
You may have solved the problem!

When I use one of the Neutrik connectors from the Mesa and daisy chain the cabs I hear the issue.

When I use both Neutrik connectors and connect one to each cab, the B string is present.

Thanks!

Interesting! Has to be something weird with the 'out' jack of the first cab then.

 

[Downunderwonder]

It Seems like the cable that you used for daisy chaining reverses polarity. Did you make the cable by DIY?

Not the cable but the daisy connection panel. If it was the cable the problem would follow the cable everywhere.

 

[Aidenn7]

So just a bad jack?

 

[Acoustic356]

So just a bad jack?

I don't think the jack is bad.

The Mesa works fine with the daisy chained Bergantino cabs.
The Warwick works fine with the daisy chained Mesa cabs.

I found this in the Mesa manual:
The amplifier incorporates a pair of SpeakOnTM NL4FC connectors wired in parallel that mate with either NL-2MP or NL4-MP plugs. Cables using NL-2 plugs contain only 1+/1- terminals and will always be correctly wired for use with the amplifier, but cables using NL4 connectors come with different wiring configura- tions. If using cables with NL-4 connectors, they may be constructed with standard 2 wire cable and they must be wired 1+ to 1+ and 1- to 1-. 4 wire cables are fine as well, terminals 2+ and 2- are not used. The cables to avoid are what are called NL4 bridge mode cables, which are typically 2 wire, and wired 1+ to 1+ and 1- to 2+. These SHOULD be clearly marked but sometimes they are not, so be aware of the possibility.

 

[Downunderwonder]

I don't think the jack is bad.

The Mesa works fine with the daisy chained Bergantino cabs.
The Warwick works fine with the daisy chained Mesa cabs.

I found this in the Mesa manual:
The amplifier incorporates a pair of SpeakOnTM NL4FC connectors wired in parallel that mate with either NL-2MP or NL4-MP plugs. Cables using NL-2 plugs contain only 1+/1- terminals and will always be correctly wired for use with the amplifier, but cables using NL4 connectors come with different wiring configura- tions. If using cables with NL-4 connectors, they may be constructed with standard 2 wire cable and they must be wired 1+ to 1+ and 1- to 1-. 4 wire cables are fine as well, terminals 2+ and 2- are not used. The cables to avoid are what are called NL4 bridge mode cables, which are typically 2 wire, and wired 1+ to 1+ and 1- to 2+. These SHOULD be clearly marked but sometimes they are not, so be aware of the possibility.

not adding up with this...

View attachment 3194380
You may have solved the problem!

When I use one of the Neutrik connectors from the Mesa and daisy chain the cabs I hear the issue.

When I use both Neutrik connectors and connect one to each cab, the B string is present.

Thanks!

which is it?