Bass cab with frontward AND backward facing speakers?

[rockdoc11]

So what I don't know about bass amp and cab design would fill several books.

But I found myself idly wondering about the possibility of a bass cabinet that would have both forward AND backward facing speakers.

Imagine, say, a small cab with a 15" speaker facing forward that had a second identical speaker mounted on the "rear" of the cabinet, facing 180 degrees opposite.

Might that work? Advantages/disadvantages?

I got no idea whatsoever on how such a thing would sound. I'm guessing terrible, since I've never heard of such a thing.

But I would love to hear from the knowledgeable amps and cabs folks on this forum.

Thanks!

 

[abarson]

The Acme Low B-212 has opposing but offset speakers. Supposedly goes lower than a B-2, which I have a hard time fathoming. I've not seen one in the wild.
The Low B-212 IMPULSE COMPENSATED – ACME SOUND | Bass, Guitar, Keyboards, PA Cabinets (acmebass.com)
ACME SOUND | Bass, Guitar, Keyboards, PA Cabinets – Full-range, uncolored loudspeakers for musicians. (acmebass.com)
Acme Low B-212 | TalkBass.com

Bergantino released the HG410X, which has 3 forward and 1 rear-facing speakers. Again, I've never heard one.
HG410X = 3D Loudspeaker | Bergantino Audio Systems

 

[walterw]

not sure why anybody would want that, bass amps are not subs

there's no good reason for any speakers in the amp to be pointed anywhere but at the player

 

[Wasnex]

The Acoustic Image Double Shot had woofers that fired in opposite direction (left and right). The mid driver shot forward.


AFAIK it can be both an advantage and a disadvantage. One advantage is it can help band members hear the bass better. A disadvantage is it may not work well in the poorest acoustic environments. I have seen quite a few comments that suggest the Double Shot tends to get lost in overly live rooms.

 

[Clark Westfield]

Bergantino makes a 410 that has one facing rear.

If the idea and concept was far fetched and ludicrous, this guy wouldn’t make or sell it.

I do now that it is one hell of a cabinet, as my old bass teacher has one.

HG410X = 3D Loudspeaker | Bergantino Audio Systems

 

[brianrost]

Ampeg made the DD-12 and DD-15 cabs with front and back firing woofers. The 2-12 model was over 80 pounds, the 2-15 even heavier.

They usually go for peanuts because of the weight. I bought a DD12 in the late 90s for $200 and sold it because it was too heavy to move around, I can’t imagine moving a DD15.

 

[mambo4]

If the idea and concept was far fetched and ludicrous, this guy wouldn’t make or sell it.

I'm sure Jim &co know what they are doing, but it does seem a bit gimmicky to me.

According to the Bergantino marketing copy:

a rear firing woofer to create a 3-dimensional sound field which creates a whole new experience in bass amplification. By loading the room with a more even bass response, it creates multiple pathways of tone to your ears so you no longer have to worry about hearing your bass on those cramped stages. And the rest of the band will hear you equally as well.

So maybe the idea is to compensate for sub optimal cab placement, as in : you are forced to stand behind your cab?

 

[DaveParker39]

I'm sure Jim &co know what they are doing, but it does seem a bit gimmicky to me.
So maybe the idea is to compensate for sub optimal cab placement, as in : you are forced to stand behind your cab?

I could see the potential if you are putting your cab in front of someone (drummer?) but I would think multiple cabs would be more practical because very rarely are two stage layouts absolutely identical?

 

[Killing Floor]

One of my cabs has a speaker facing down with the other in a forward position.

 

[silky smoove]

You’re describing one variant of an isobaric cab design. This is a time tested design that, for my money, isn’t very popular for good reason.

 

[LHbassist]

This. An MB12. When Carvin made bass amps. It's not quite opposing, it's a downfiring 12 and a smaller driver and HF horn for the upper frequencies.

 

[Bar Band Bassman]

My Acoustic Image Coda has two forward firing smaller speakers and a down firing 12. It works very well, IME.

BBB

 

[mborn]

Bergantino also makes the HG310 cabinets, two 10” forward and one in back. They are six ohms. I have two cabinets and typically use one or both for upright as well as Fender style bass. Placing the cabinet a few feet from a wall does fill the room more fully compared to a front firing cabinet. Stacking both cabinets is very useful when playing gigs such as square dances and line dances that have much more floor space than typical club gigs.

The HG310s work fine for upright.

 

[s_wood]

Acoustic made a cab in the 70’s called the 408. 2 front facing 15s and 2 rear facing 15s. that were mounted coaxially. Sounded huge. https://www.talkbass.com/threads/for-sale-vintage-acoustic-408-4x15s-cabinet.940227/

 

[rapidfirerob]

I feel so old fashioned with cabinets that have speakers that only face forward.

 

[SemiDriven]

So what I don't know about bass amp and cab design would fill several books.

But I found myself idly wondering about the possibility of a bass cabinet that would have both forward AND backward facing speakers.

Imagine, say, a small cab with a 15" speaker facing forward that had a second identical speaker mounted on the "rear" of the cabinet, facing 180 degrees opposite.

Might that work? Advantages/disadvantages?

I got no idea whatsoever on how such a thing would sound. I'm guessing terrible, since I've never heard of such a thing.

But I would love to hear from the knowledgeable amps and cabs folks on this forum.

Thanks!

Not exactly what you're thinking, but the AK C115 might fit the bill (if you can find one).

I've got two AK C112's and they do fit the bill.

 

[Ludwig]

Keeping speakers firing in different directions having same phase at point of listener is not easy. Much easier to have them and the reflection outlet (if you have one) all pointed in same direction. If you have a speaker facing to the front and another facing to the back, the sound can be diminished depending of distance to wall and to listener for some frequency ranges. If the sound wave reflected is not in phase with direct sound wave, that reduces loudness for that frequency instead of adding to it. That is what happens in a room with "difficult dimensions" as well with the sound waves reflected by the walls out of phase with sound waves reaching the listener directly.

 

[DWBass]

BoomBass and Orange make similar style cabs but not rear facing. I believe both are down firing.

 

[sugarsand]

I have a Ampeg SVR212 cabinet. Looks exactly the same front and back, 12" speaker in both directions. I used it for upright bass where I could play with the amp in front of me and still hear my notes so I could play in-tune with a loud live band in a small f-cked up venue, and they all were, too small for an upright player to get the amp far enough away so you do not feedback... Also it worked great with a p bass or j bass putting it up against a wall in a small venue. It would make a nice warm envelope for me with the bounce, standing right next to it, while the front speaker could sound barky and gritty. It's built like a tank. Mines still sitting in storage here in socal. I will sell it if anyone is interested. I have an svt 3 tube hybrid head that fits in the slot, also i could let go of. I have a ton of gear I sort of forgot about this setup, it's cool as hell, everyone sort of freaks out over the rig, it sounds good, it's Ampeg don't over think why. I would think old guys like me probably have already had their share of nutty huge reflex cabinets. Here's a small one that fits in the back seat of a regular car. 8ohm so you can pair with any other 8ohm cab of your choice and still have ton of juice with an svt head... Maybe I should relive my youth and take it out for a spin this week at the next gig?

 

[tb-player]

@Jim Bergantino might be able to shed some light on this question.