Can anyone help identify a Tokai Hard Puncher?

[lofman]

Hi,

New on the forum, hope I'm not breaking any rules here. I'm looking at a bass for sale and it's an pretty nice Tokai Hard Puncher with serial number 103806. I don't know from which year and what base model it is and that's what I'd like to know. I do know it has new Seymour Duncan Quarter Pound SPB-3s, new electronics and a new pick guard, but I can't seem to place it even on a decade or a country.

The logo style indicates it's post-84. Since the serial number (if given correctly) doesn't have a CN or F to begin with I'd like to think it isn't a chinese or a korean instrument.

It doesn't have the wear and patina I'd expect from a 80s instrument, so gutfeel would say post 2000s, but I really don't know.

If the exact model, year and even country is hard to establish, what would you fellow bassists think it's worth? I'm desperately trying to come to terms whether or not the 550€ price tag with a hard case is on point or not.

 

[MotorCityMinion]

I'm desperately trying to come to terms whether or not the 550€ price tag with a hard case is on point or not.

Not sure what that price is in US dollars but Tokai Hard Puncher basses are nice.If everything works and it plays nice, I'd say under $1000 us. Should be esy enough to google some asking prices.

 

[Stinkoman20xx]

It looks pretty clean and could be a reissue. If its a MIJ one of any era the price is good. DId they ever make them outside of japan?

 

[devnulljp]

Can't tell from the pics if it has the original (i.e., same as Fender) headstock shape or the weird angular one they replaced it with to avoid the lawsuits.
The lower end models from the 80s had 3 screws in the machine heads, higher end had 4.
But I think your gut is right and I'd be surprised if that isn't post 2000.
In fact,I'm a little confused by the apparent lack of a truss rod -- I don't see one at the body end, and I don't see a plug at the headstock.
You can buy those decls on ebay for $10, so I'd tread carefully.

 

[fhtagn]

Looks like MIJ, 2010. The first two numbers of the serial reveal the year it was made in. Are you able to try it before buying?

 

[Pep]

Can't tell from the pics if it has the original (i.e., same as Fender) headstock shape or the weird angular one they replaced it with to avoid the lawsuits.
The lower end models from the 80s had 3 screws in the machine heads, higher end had 4.
But I think your gut is right and I'd be surprised if that isn't post 2000.
In fact,I'm a little confused by the apparent lack of a truss rod -- I don't see one at the body end, and I don't see a plug at the headstock.
You can buy those decls on ebay for $10, so I'd tread carefully.

The truss rod is in the heel of the neck. You can see the pickguard access slot in the first photo.

 

[Sharko]

I can identify them by how hard they punch. In a blind punch test, I could pick the hard puncher out of a line up of punchers. Once you’ve been punched by one you’ll never forget the feeling.

 

[FunkHead]

I would snag that in a heart beat. Looks MIJ. Fender shape Headstock etc... They are cool basses.

 

[lofman]

Not sure what that price is in US dollars but Tokai Hard Puncher basses are nice.If everything works and it plays nice, I'd say under $1000 us. Should be esy enough to google some asking prices.

I looked at a bunch on ebay and finnish sites and the spread is quite large depending on which era it is from. A new APB-58 retails for about 500 €. Then there's the APB52 (new for 400€), APB32, APB88, APB97 (730-1350 €)

There's the Pb-40/48/50/60, which go used for anything between 700 € - 1200 + €. There's the Tpb-45 in the same range. A new Tpb-55 retails for about a 1000 €.

Older basses seem to have a thumb rest, which newer ones don't.

When looking at used ones they seldom have the model announced, so it's quite hard to understand which model you're looking at.

The more I look into them, the more I'm confused

It looks pretty clean and could be a reissue. If its a MIJ one of any era the price is good. DId they ever make them outside of japan?

Looking into serial numbers there seems to be a Korea-model with serial numbers starting with F and a China-series with serial numbers starting with CN.

As this one doesn't seem to have any letters, it leads me to believe it's a MIJ. But I haven't found out reliable information on the serial number yet.

Can't tell from the pics if it has the original (i.e., same as Fender) headstock shape or the weird angular one they replaced it with to avoid the lawsuits.
The lower end models from the 80s had 3 screws in the machine heads, higher end had 4.
But I think your gut is right and I'd be surprised if that isn't post 2000.
In fact,I'm a little confused by the apparent lack of a truss rod -- I don't see one at the body end, and I don't see a plug at the headstock.
You can buy those decls on ebay for $10, so I'd tread carefully.

Thanks for the good info. I think it was the real deal, but it's hard to tell when this one had replacement parts on it as well.

Looks like MIJ, 2010. The first two numbers of the serial reveal the year it was made in. Are you able to try it before buying?

Naah, sadly I can't try it out. It's located about 200 km:s away, so no trying out this one.

Can you provide the source for the serial number info? I'd want to learn more about dating these ones, but haven't found reliable info. Found this on the Tokai forum: "There have been many different serial number schemes over the years. But from late 2009 to the present Japanese Tokai Fender copies used a 6 digit serial number that starts with the year made and are inked on the heel of the neck along with “Made In Japan”."

But from the picture provided I can't see whether the SN is on the plate or on the heel of the neck .

//

Well, as I've been typing this the seller has removed the ad, so I guess that's that then. Somebody probably got a decent bass. Thanks for the help everybody and on to the next adventure!

 

[FunkHead]

I looked at a bunch on ebay and finnish sites and the spread is quite large depending on which era it is from. A new APB-58 retails for about 500 €. Then there's the APB52 (new for 400€), APB32, APB88, APB97 (730-1350 €)

There's the Pb-40/48/50/60, which go used for anything between 700 € - 1200 + €. There's the Tpb-45 in the same range. A new Tpb-55 retails for about a 1000 €.

Older basses seem to have a thumb rest, which newer ones don't.

When looking at used ones they seldom have the model announced, so it's quite hard to understand which model you're looking at.

The more I look into them, the more I'm confused



Looking into serial numbers there seems to be a Korea-model with serial numbers starting with F and a China-series with serial numbers starting with CN.

As this one doesn't seem to have any letters, it leads me to believe it's a MIJ. But I haven't found out reliable information on the serial number yet.


Thanks for the good info. I think it was the real deal, but it's hard to tell when this one had replacement parts on it as well.



Naah, sadly I can't try it out. It's located about 200 km:s away, so no trying out this one.

Can you provide the source for the serial number info? I'd want to learn more about dating these ones, but haven't found reliable info. Found this on the Tokai forum: "There have been many different serial number schemes over the years. But from late 2009 to the present Japanese Tokai Fender copies used a 6 digit serial number that starts with the year made and are inked on the heel of the neck along with “Made In Japan”."

But from the picture provided I can't see whether the SN is on the plate or on the heel of the neck .

//

Well, as I've been typing this the seller has removed the ad, so I guess that's that then. Somebody probably got a decent bass. Thanks for the help everybody and on to the next adventure!

I would ask them the questions: Where was it made, what year etc... Plus ask for more Pics. It's almost hard to tell if the Headstock is definitely Fender Shaped (Lawsuit years) or if if has the later ESP shape.
Please post more Pics if you get them.

 

[fhtagn]

I looked at a bunch on ebay and finnish sites and the spread is quite large depending on which era it is from. A new APB-58 retails for about 500 €. Then there's the APB52 (new for 400€), APB32, APB88, APB97 (730-1350 €)

There's the Pb-40/48/50/60, which go used for anything between 700 € - 1200 + €. There's the Tpb-45 in the same range. A new Tpb-55 retails for about a 1000 €.

Older basses seem to have a thumb rest, which newer ones don't.

When looking at used ones they seldom have the model announced, so it's quite hard to understand which model you're looking at.

The more I look into them, the more I'm confused



Looking into serial numbers there seems to be a Korea-model with serial numbers starting with F and a China-series with serial numbers starting with CN.

As this one doesn't seem to have any letters, it leads me to believe it's a MIJ. But I haven't found out reliable information on the serial number yet.


Thanks for the good info. I think it was the real deal, but it's hard to tell when this one had replacement parts on it as well.



Naah, sadly I can't try it out. It's located about 200 km:s away, so no trying out this one.

Can you provide the source for the serial number info? I'd want to learn more about dating these ones, but haven't found reliable info. Found this on the Tokai forum: "There have been many different serial number schemes over the years. But from late 2009 to the present Japanese Tokai Fender copies used a 6 digit serial number that starts with the year made and are inked on the heel of the neck along with “Made In Japan”."

But from the picture provided I can't see whether the SN is on the plate or on the heel of the neck .

//

Well, as I've been typing this the seller has removed the ad, so I guess that's that then. Somebody probably got a decent bass. Thanks for the help everybody and on to the next adventure!

Regarding the confusing model numbering – Tokai tends to name their models according to the original RRP in yen around the build time, eg. TPB-55 costs 55,000 yen locally. What makes this system interesting is that even though the model specs don't actually change, the numbering might change purely due to inflation. TPB-45 and TPB-55 are highly probably practically the same model, only a few years apart. Case in point, though in guitars, I've got an LC-85 made in 2008, that is specs-wise comparable to a more modern LC-107. Those cheaper APB's you mentioned are made in China, whereas higher priced TPB's are all MIJ. Some more expensive APB's are also MIJ, but I'm not absolutely certain where they draw the line.

I just realized that this particular bass has a 6-digit serial number, whereas all my Tokais have a 7-digit serial ... mine are all Gibson-styled and post-2000's though, so I assume this particular one might in fact be older?

These look rather similar

 

[devnulljp]

The truss rod is in the heel of the neck. You can see the pickguard access slot in the first photo.

yeah, I can see the access slot -- but not the actual nut in there. Also, an 80s Tokai pickguard wouldn't have the slot (same as the Fender it was a clone of) so at least the pickguard isn't from the 80s.

 

[-Asdfgh-]

Hi,

New on the forum, hope I'm not breaking any rules here. I'm looking at a bass for sale and it's an pretty nice Tokai Hard Puncher with serial number 103806. I don't know from which year and what base model it is and that's what I'd like to know. I do know it has new Seymour Duncan Quarter Pound SPB-3s, new electronics and a new pick guard, but I can't seem to place it even on a decade or a country.

The logo style indicates it's post-84. Since the serial number (if given correctly) doesn't have a CN or F to begin with I'd like to think it isn't a chinese or a korean instrument.

It doesn't have the wear and patina I'd expect from a 80s instrument, so gutfeel would say post 2000s, but I really don't know.

If the exact model, year and even country is hard to establish, what would you fellow bassists think it's worth? I'm desperately trying to come to terms whether or not the 550€ price tag with a hard case is on point or not.


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A better view of the headstock shape would help.