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Chord Tones (Help)

#21
You mentioned you wanted to learn your fretboard better.

Give this some thought.

Have you meet the major scale box yet?
Code: 
Major Scale Box. 

G|---2---|-------|---3---|---4---| 1st string
D|---6---|-------|---7---|---8---|
A|---3---|---4---|-------|---5---|
E|-------|---R---|-------|---2---|4th string

This song is in the key of C. Place the R on a C note (on your fretboard) how about 4th string 8th fret.

Chords in the key of C are:
R...2....3....4...5..6.....7
C, Dm, Em, F, G, Am, Bdim

In the following song ---- Playing roots, the Am is the 6.
The F is the 4. The G is the 5 and the C is the R or 1.
If you like, nothing stopping you, put a 6 over the Am and a 4 over the F...........


....Am.............F..............G............... .C
A sign shall be given, a virgin will conceive.

Want to play this in the key of D. Place the root over a D note on your fretboard - how about the 4th string 10th fret. Play the box. Now that will get you to knowing your fretboard.

I know you will have questions, ask.

Have fun.
 
#22
Thanks for everyone who has chimed in so far, no I cannot read however I know I need to learn and I quess now is as good as any. Know any good sites to go to for beginning to read. Unfortunately I can't afford lessons at the moment so I'm using what is availabe.
 
#25
MalcolmAmos said:
[Major Scale Box.

G|---2---|-------|---3---|---4---| 1st string
D|---6---|---p---|---7---|---8---|
A|---3---|---4---|---p---|---5---|
E|-------|---R---|-------|---2---|4th string
Click to expand...

You asked also how to use chord tones in bass lines. I guess my question is "what sort of gospel music are you playing?" Some upbeat gospel tunes have a lot in common with blues and funk. In cases like that you can add in pretty much any note after the 3rd to add flavor. The key is to use non-chord tones as passing notes only.

So I stole the chord box above and put in p's as passing tones (unless you want to avoid the diabolus en musica in church in which case remove the one between 4 and 5 ;) )

Here's how I would recommend putting this to practical use: If there's a drummer, listen to him. Say he is playing a rhythm that sounds like 1 - 2 - 3- 4& | 1 - 2 -3 -4& (trying represent 3 quarter notes and 2 8ths)... You could then play a bass line that matches those 5 beats. Play the root note on beat one, and then chord tones on each of the other beats. When you get to the "&" after beat 4, use one of the passing tones or the 7, whichever is closer to the root note of the next bar.
 
#27
Bass-4-God said:
So many lessons I've seen will show how a line is derived from a scale, so is this the same thing.
Click to expand...

No you are thinking of '' scale over this chord'' or ''notes of the scale'' learn how chords are built off each degree of the scale.. getting a grounding with chordal theory will help you hear and identify that you are playing the notes with in the chord for your target notes that form good strong bass lines.
 
#29
Bass-4-God said:
I think you just confused me.
Click to expand...

The "secret" to learning music theory is simply this: Whenever you get confused, find actual songs that demonstrate the concept, listen to them, and study how the technique is applied. :)

I've given specific examples that I think help illustrate chord tones theory. Do you have an example from the gospel genre that we can talk about? For example, "I'm learning the song '_______' and trying to find some non-chord tones to connect from G Major to the 'bridge' section in E Minor."
 
#30
Maybe I just need to go back to the beginnig to see where I got off at. By beginning I mean triads, major and minor 7ths. Do think this will help. When I get home I'll see if I can get a song that I can work with. Yes it's time for me to learn how to read, I can't put it off any longer.
 
#33
Bass-4-God said:
Maybe I just need to go back to the beginnig to see where I got off at. By beginning I mean triads, major and minor 7ths. Do think this will help. When I get home I'll see if I can get a song that I can work with. Yes it's time for me to learn how to read, I can't put it off any longer.
Click to expand...

I'm the kind of person who finds music theory more difficult (and dull) when it's not applied directly to something practical. The most important thing is to have good ears. If you've been getting by playing by ear then you're off to a good start. The next thing I would suggest is that you develop an understanding of diatonic harmony (what is meant by a I chord, ii chord, V chord, etc.). This will provide you with a basic and essential reference point when it comes to your analysing songs/chord progressions. A great book for getting a better handle on theory is this one: [Invalid or Expired Link Removed]

Also, start working on playing chords on your bass. Choose some easy jazz standards ("All Of Me", "Autumn Leaves", "Blue Bossa", etc.) and play the chords. Look at the chords and see how they "flow" into each other (voice leading). Look at the common functions of the chords (the V chord setting up the I) and the use of ii-V-I turnarounds. But really, all of this stuff will be much easier to digest if you have a good book to guide you. And ask around your church - there might be someone who is willing to take you on as a student even though you can't afford to pay him or her.
 
#34
Bass-For-God, the youtube video that Steve posted for you in post #2 is based around the G major scale like the scale box that Malcolm posted for you in post #21 - learn it along with stacking 3rd’s, and etc. Also learn how to read music - start with learning the bass clef (F) staff note names - spaces A, C, E, G, lines G, B, D, F, A. and etc And above all - have fun and enjoy learning.
 
#36
Mushroo said:
I have learned a lot about bass lines from the music of J.S. Bach.... I know that he wrote a lot of music for the church, and scores of his work are easy to find... Bach might be a good resource to improve your knowledge of harmony from beginner/intermediate to intermediate/advanced. His Cello Suites are fun to play on bass (if they're too difficult at first, then just play the bass/root note in each measure). Or for a great "intro to Bach" lesson, study Prelude 1 in C Major from Well Tempered Clavier and analyze the use of chord tones. :)

That's assuming you like Bach, of course. If you hate his music and play a completely different style, then choose something more relevant. ;)
Click to expand...
So did Jack Bruce.
 
#37
Some may think it strange how some threads on different subjects develp the same answers ( one is already running about what chords to play over keys/scales)
You can learn chord tones or learn to harmonise scales.
If you learn to harmonise scales you will create chords, then from those chords toy will have the notes that are called chord tones.

It is a simple process, it is a logical process as the information appears as you work it out. Because the information is fuller and deeper it relates to more than just Chord Tones.
If you learn to create scales, you can learn to create chords, then you create harmony and melody within tempo and you have music. It will support other ideas within music because you are using the building blocks of music.

If you just learn chord tones all you have are notes, if you work on remembering them by using patterns, or shapes then you still only have notes, because you cannot backtrack the info on where they came from, you cannot prove how you worked it out.....so maybe it was luck you ended up with some of your tones rather than by design?:)

Steve's post is great, as are Malcolms, they give you the info you need, but learn to go deeper and understand why it is so what they say......learn to construct and learn, not see/hear and remember.;)
 
#39
Bass-4-God said:
Would I be correct in thinking of the 1-3-5-7 as the meat and potatoes of a scale in genaeral and then to work on expanding from there. I also can begin learning how to read using this in the circle of 4ths. Help me out if I'm of track.
Click to expand...

Yes, you can, but see past that, extend the sequence and see 1-3-5-7-9-11-13.

Apply that to the to the C scales and the notes you get are every other one. So look at this Scale and see what that means.

C D E F G A B C D E F G A B C

You get C E G B D F A

C = root
E = 3rd
G = 5th
B = 7th
D = 9th
F = 11th
A = 13th

So why stop at 13th? Because the next alternate note is a C.....and you are back to the start again.

But look at those tones the first four used are C E G B then the next three used are....well.... They are the notes in-between C E G B but an octave up.

But also for movement, they can be used and seen in there lower positions, so consider a 2nd as the same note as a 9th, a 4th as the same note as an 11th, and a 6th as the same note as an 13th.

So you have in fact used every note of the scale, every note of a scale is a potential chord or chord extension.

See scales over two octaves minimum, and you will see chords and there extensions clear as day.
Practice any scale at least over two octaves, and if possible practice from the lowest available note, not from the root note.

So on a standard bass your C scales starts on low open E and proceeds F G A B C

Now you are at the root note of the scale and you continue D E F G A B C

You have now reached the octave of C, so continue on up the fretboard D E F G A B C

You are now two octaves above the root C, so continue on up the fretboard, depending on your bass you may have one - three more notes available so they would be D E F .....then play it all the way back down to that low E.

It will dawn on you that you have many different note options on how to play the scale up this high and back down again.
You have options to "fret map" that means choose how you get around to these notes and what notes you choose, that is part of the exercise.

So your first A....is it an open A, or is it on the 5th fret...is the next note, B played at the second fret on the A string, or is it played on the 8th fret of the E string..and so on.

The more you move up the fretboard a fourth, the more options you will open up till you reach the maximum for your instrument. (tunings and multi-stringed instruments will have more variations)

Try it and have a look and listen to what you are playing, then apply it again to any scale you practice and apply those intervals (1-3-5-7-9-11-13) to them and the construction of minor, Augmented and Diminished chords, triads etc. :)
 
#40
Just got through with practice, I focused on the Major triad and the Major 7th in 2 octaves. I saw the shapes of the 1-3-5-7 chord tones, I saw the Major, Dorian, and the Mixolydian modes. I also saw the 1st inversion of the Major scale in 2 octaves. Tomorrow I will begin focusing on the notes.
 

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