• TalkBass has been independent since 1998. Add your voice.
    Create a free account to reply to discussions, view embedded media, and browse with fewer display ads.
    Join free Log in
    Want zero display ads or expanded classifieds tools? Compare plans.

Coated Strings

#21
Rodger Bryan said:
The wrap wire is coated, but wouldn't the core wire be connected with the shield ground through the bridge via the...balls? Somebody please explain this.

Could it be that the wrap wire, independent (insulated) from the core is becoming the "antenna". If that is the case, then the outer coated wrap would need an uncoated temination point that could make contact with the core and balls. :eyebrow:
Click to expand...

According to the article, affected basses need to make a circuit from the bridge ground wire, to the strings, then to your hands. So whatever is touching the bridge needs to circuit to your hands.

IMO though, there is something wrong with affected basses or maybe the amp setup.I've got a Fender Jaguar (see: famous for being noisy) with no shielding improvements from stock and i dont have additional hum with coated strings. In fact, Elixirs have an extraordinary mid/high mid grind on this bass.

Right now my Ibanez SRT has some tester pickups in it with a rushed solder job and the back cover/shiled isn't on the bass. The bridge ground is connected. Currently strung with DR Dragon Skins. No hum.
 
#22
I am not saying that you will get "additional" hum with coated strings. I am saying that the hum that normally goes away when you touch the strings (with a bridge ground) will "not go away" with the mentioned coated strings.

If you get hum reduction when you touch the output jack --- that is the hum that should also go away when you touch the strings.

Roger
 
#23
Rodger Bryan said:
The wrap wire is coated, but wouldn't the core wire be connected with the shield ground through the bridge via the...balls? Somebody please explain this.

Could it be that the wrap wire, independent (insulated) from the core is becoming the "antenna". If that is the case, then the outer coated wrap would need an uncoated temination point that could make contact with the core and balls. :eyebrow:
Click to expand...

A true ground is achieved through your body.....it is only when you are touching something that is "grounded" on your bass that the "ground" is completed. If your body cannot make contact with something that is grounded, there can be no noise reduction.

Before I began shielding guitars in the late 70's, studio players would take a long wire with an alligator clip on one end and a bare wire on the other. They would attach the clip to the bridge and stick the wire down their underwear to make contact with their body!
 
#25
Yesterday I had practice and I used a Fender standard jazz(MIM)and I just put D'Adario tapes on it. During practice I had some serious "feedback/loud hum" issues. I used the same bass during my previous practice with EB Flats Group III on it and had no issues. I wonder if the tapes were causing the problem? I have a gig Saturday and won't have any live practices beforehand. I'm thinking of putting the flats back on and just hope no problems occur. I have a precision with nylons on it and I notice here at home that I'll get some buzzing if I roll the tone knob up. I don't play loud here at home so I don't know if I would get the loud hum or not.
My set up I was playing through yesterday was:
GK MB210
210MBE ext cab
Fender(MIM)Jazz
This is what I have used the last few practices with no problems. Like I stated the only change I made was swapping the EB Flats for the Tapes. Thanks for any help.
 
#27
mello_bedwetter said:
Yesterday I had practice and I used a Fender standard jazz(MIM)and I just put D'Adario tapes on it. During practice I had some serious "feedback/loud hum" issues. I used the same bass during my previous practice with EB Flats Group III on it and had no issues. I wonder if the tapes were causing the problem? I have a gig Saturday and won't have any live practices beforehand. I'm thinking of putting the flats back on and just hope no problems occur. I have a precision with nylons on it and I notice here at home that I'll get some buzzing if I roll the tone knob up. Like I stated the only change I made was swapping the EB Flats for the Tapes. Thanks for any help.
Click to expand...

No question about it. Tapewound strings are non-conductive too.

Roger
 
#28
Sadowsky said:
No question about it. Tapewound strings are non-conductive too.

Roger
Click to expand...
I tried to simulate it at home but I couldn't get the really loud hum like I did in practice. I held the bass and stood in front of the amp and the longer I held it there the hum seem to slowly build. I touched the plate where the volume/tone knobs are and then touched the strings and the hum decreased. Same thing happened if I touched the bridge and strings. I changed the tapes with some EB Flats and the feedback went away. I wish I could try it out at another practice before my gig but I won't have a chance cause we don't have a practice. Hopefully the problem is solved by changing the strings. Thanks for the reply.
 
#29
One of the problems is that the conditions under which you get hum are a function of the wiring and lighting where you are playing.

The naysayers in this conversation simply have not yet encountered a room where the hum is a problem.

Roger
 
#30
Sadowsky said:
One of the problems is that the conditions under which you get hum are a function of the wiring and lighting where you are playing.

The naysayers in this conversation simply have not yet encountered a room where the hum is a problem.

Roger
Click to expand...

We practice at this guy's house most of the time. Whether playing at his house or playing a gig I've never had this problem before. This was the 1st time and it was my 1st time using the tapes.
Actually I did use the tapes one time at a gig and didn't have a problem. I used the on a Highway One Jazz...I may have just lucked out. My Fender (MIM) Jazz has DiMarzio pickups I had installed.
 
#31
Sadowsky said:
One of the problems is that the conditions under which you get hum are a function of the wiring and lighting where you are playing.

The naysayers in this conversation simply have not yet encountered a room where the hum is a problem.

Roger
Click to expand...

This naysayer has been playing bass for 30 years. Most of that time was spent playing in bars that were wired by morons that had no clue what an electrical code is. And yes, I have had guitars that would hum if you let go of the strings. And I fixed every one of them. Some of them needed better shielding. Some of them needed to be rewired. Some of them needed new pickups. But never did I blame the strings for the problem. Strings don't produce hum. Holding onto the strings to quiet the hum is curing the symptom. Not the problem.
 
#32
Jack Wren said:
This naysayer has been playing bass for 30 years. Most of that time was spent playing in bars that were wired by morons that had no clue what an electrical code is. And yes, I have had guitars that would hum if you let go of the strings. And I fixed every one of them. Some of them needed better shielding. Some of them needed to be rewired. Some of them needed new pickups. But never did I blame the strings for the problem. Strings don't make hum. Holding onto the strings is curing the symptom. Not the problem.
Click to expand...

I agree with you 100%. I never said the string causes the problem. But even with a well shielded instrument, you cannot achieve a complete ground without a functioning bridge ground and a conductive string. I am glad you have been able to deal with these issues on your own and you are obviously knowledgeable... The reality is that most players have never even thought about the issues we are discussing.
 
#33
Sadowsky said:
I agree with you 100%. I never said the string causes the problem. But even with a well shielded instrument, you cannot achieve a complete ground without a functioning bridge ground and a conductive string. I am glad you have been able to deal with these issues on your own and you are obviously knowledgeable... The reality is that most players have never even thought about the issues we are discussing.
Click to expand...

Maybe I read the wrong article because it sounded to me as If you had a pretty big beef with several string manufacturers. If their strings aren't the cause of the problem why should they change their product? I will let you have the last word on this one. I have said more than enough. Lots of respect here for your products and what you have done for the music world.
 
#34
So, are you saying that the player completes the circuit to ground via his hands to his feet? If so, wouldn't rubber soled shoes be a problem? And wouldn't the all-metal path through the ground wire, connected through the amp chassis and out the 3rd prong outlet and house wiring be more conductive than flesh and bone?

I understand the necessity of shielding to prevent EMF noise, but I've always been a bit fuzzy about grounding the strings. I understand that the phenomena exists and I have seen it in certain basses. But I don't get it.

Can you explain what exactly is going on with this and how exactly the player completes the circuit?
 
#35
Nev375 said:
So, are you saying that the player completes the circuit to ground via his hands to his feet? If so, wouldn't rubber soled shoes be a problem? And wouldn't the all-metal path through the ground wire, connected through the amp chassis and out the 3rd prong outlet and house wiring be more conductive than flesh and bone?

I understand the necessity of shielding to prevent EMF noise, but I've always been a bit fuzzy about grounding the strings. I understand that the phenomena exists and I have seen it in certain basses. But I don't get it.

Can you explain what exactly is going on with this and how exactly the player completes the circuit?
Click to expand...

The guitar strings are grounded in terms of dc potential but due to the length of the guitar cable, the power cord to your amp, whatever else you have between your guitar and amp, and the distance from the electrical outlet to wherever the electrical service ground is, you don't have a good ground for audio frequency circuits. It can actually act more like an antenna at times. Your body effectively dampens the electrical circuit. Similar to the way you dampen the sound when you touch the strings.
 
#38
Ibanezsr500 said:
Interesting article, I've never thought of coated strings causing grounding issues, but it makes sense. Thanks for the read.
Click to expand...

+1

Also, Cleartone and D'Addario should state/print that their coating is conductive and explain positivity of it on the backside of a package or something. (If they don't do that already? I have only used coated Elixirs and DR Dragons so I don't know...)

IMO this could increase their sales and most importantly want it or not 'force' other manufacturers to follow or even better, improve their coatings/strings.

Again, thanks for the read.
 
#39
Roger,
I have been playing a long time and since the development of coated strings I have experienced the phenomenon you are addressing to varying degrees with an array of different basses.
Flats seem to solve the problem for me, since my acid hands deaden non-coated strings in a matter of a couple hours.
Thanks for speaking out. And, might I add, a Sadowsky Ultra Vintage P is my goal one day - when the kids are raised and the bills are paid.

James
 
#40
Giving this thread the Lazarus treatment to say that I tried the D'Addario coated strings on my G&L SB-2 yesterday and the buzz phenomenon reared its ugly head. Consistent buzz whether my hands touched the strings or not.
Then I put regular D'Addario XLs on there and no buzz, no problem.
 

Latest posts

Top Bottom
Back