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Compressors

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#24
Dave Martin said:
I pointed at volume because volume is the problem. Compression won't help bring the vocals out if the band is too loud on stage, and for damn sure, I would NEVER EVER put a Berhinger compressor on any audio. Never.
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If the guy says they have no problem with volume, then who are you to say they have a problem with volume? The issue is the vocals getting lost in the mix. And yes, a compressor can fix that.

It fixes it in the studio, helps bring vocals up front, and also can fix it live.
 
#26
I pointed at volume because volume is the problem... Despite the fact that he doesn't want to hear it.
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I have stated multiple times that volume is NOT always the problem, yet you seem to have not noticed that. I've also stated that on occasions we ARE too loud, and that we turn down on occasions. Maybe I haven't been as clear I as I thought I was being, but, no, this is not a case where everything is just too loud. There are plenty of softer songs we do that pose no volume problems whatsoever. We have a few issues that we're trying to address individually. We have a very "live" room... Thus we stay conscious of our stage volume and are looking to prevent all that sound bouncing around in the room. However, we would also like for the vocals to cut through better. We have multiple singers, some more, some less proficient with a mic. Mics get dropped or bumped from time to time. One shy, timid person may get up to give a testimony and hold the mic far away. Another person with a confident voice may "eat the mic." Granted, the best way to fix that is to teach those people how to properly use a mic... We do that, too, but it takes time for it to become habit. No, we don't expect a compressor to fix any volume issues or room reverberation. We expect it to do what compressors do, compressing the dynamic range of a sound, allowing the mean volume to be turned up so those valleys can be heard better and those peaks don't start clipping the signal. So... If you strongly advise against the Behringer, is there a particular dbx (or other manufacturer) unit you would recommend?

Brian
 
#27
bluestarbass said:
oh by the way Dave's stuff is great. If im ever in Nashville Id love to see his studio if I could be that lucky. Thats the problem with websites like this, how to show crediablity. Somone running a REAL studio in nashville has credibility.
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By the way, someone who has invested thousands in expensive, name brand gear can be just as biased as the next guy. Problem is, they typically take a defensive attitude about their gear, mainly to defend the amount of money they've blown. Then they have to throw around big names to add more credibility.
 
#28
Dave Martin said:
Dude. Honestly. I mean, really. Do you actually pass audio through those things And you bought more after you bought the first one and heard it? Yikes! :crying:

Have you ever had the chance to hear a decent compressor? I'm sorry - what are you comparing your Behringer units to when you say that they're 'fantastic'? Jeez.
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I'll ask you the same question. Not to be argumentative, but simply because Behringer stuff is a popular target for people to criticize whether or not they may have actually used it.

So, have you actually used one of the compressors he mentioned and found it to be inadequate?
 
#29
It's sounding like the three guitars might be the biggest hurdle to get the vocals past. Yes, compression can help make the vocals punchier, but competing with three chordal instruments can prove extremely difficult for any instrument/singer. Further reason to put as much control as possible of their house volume in a 3rd party's hands.

The use of vocal (or any) compression also may or may not help depending on the style of singing. You may find that by the time you've compressed the vocals enough to cut through, that they don't sound right anymore, or that they have lost all dynamic nuance. Can you rent one easily to experiment with before you buy?

Concerning which compressor, I would have to agree with Dave Martin about not liking the Behringer. Almost every other compressor I've used sounds noticeably better, e.g. in the price range: dbx, Presonus, Symetrix. That said, when I've used Behringer's the only luck I've had with them is on vocals.

One other thing (at the risk of sounding ingenuine): I would spend $5 on the rental of Standing In The Shadows of Motown and get the whole band to watch. It wasn't until my second viewing that I fully took in how many people were playing at the same time on so many Motown recordings. Grapevine has 2 drummers. Most of the tunes have 3 guitarists AND a piano and/or Rhodes. Knowing this has been extremely inspirational/educational to me. Every time I play with multiple chordal instruments (or not, even) I think about how they made brilliant music with so many instruments.
 
#30
Standing in the Shadows of Motown is a great documentary; I own it... Perks of having worked at Blockbuster; we could get movies for cheap. To my knowledge, none of the rest of the band have seen it. I don't know that they'd take to it as well as I did, because none of them are as big of fans of Motown music as I am. That said, it's good advice; even if they don't care for the music that much, there's a lot of great stuff on that dvd!

Brian
 
#31
Thanks to all who contributed... good range of experiences here. Please refrain from attacking the other posters instead of debating the issue, it's a blurred line at best.

I'm closing this one as is... seems to be a "live sound" issue more than a recording one.

Feel free to reorganize the question for a new thread if the answers weren't met.

Thanks
 
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