Computer Folks.. Need Suggestions..

[bobbykokinos]

I'm looking at building a small computer for use as a gaming/media center PC.. It'll probably be based off a MiniATX setup and run WinXP Pro. I dont want something that is ridiculously expensive or ridiculously fast, but dont want something that I'll want to upgrade in the next month.. I'm trying to not spend more than $600 since I wont need a monitor, speakers, etc... Its system that'll be plugged into my TV. Here are a few questions:

1. Intel or AMD?
2. Should I buy local or online? Online is about $100-$150 cheaper but I dont know if I want to deal with the mail stuff for returning if need be. Plus, I would have to buy from more than one online distributor or get the best price.
3. Are most MiniATX cases big enough to handle a PCI video card like the 8600GTS?

Here are the two systems I've designed.. One is an AMD, one is an intel:

AMD
----
Graphics Card - MSI NX8600GTS
Hard Drive - Western Digital 320GB 7200 16MB CACHE
Motherboard - Biostar K8M800MAM
Processor - AMD 64 X2 5600+
Memory - Hynix 2GB DDR2 667MHz PC5400
Case - Ultra Micro Fly mATX Case ULT33116
CD/DVD - Memorex 1650S
**Price Online thru Various Distributors (w/shipping): $556.91
**Price Locally After Rebates for comparable (w/tax): $648.16

Intel
----
Graphics Card - MSI NX8600GTS
Hard Drive - Western Digital 320GB 7200 16MB CACHE
Motherboard - ASRock CONROE 1333mhz FSB
Processor - E6550 Core 2 Duo
Memory - PC6400 800MHz DDR2
Case - Ultra Micro Fly mATX Case ULT33116
CD/DVD - Memorex 1650S
**Price Online thru Various Distributors (w/shipping): $585.83
**Price Locally After Rebates for comparable (w/tax): $722.96

Having a big problem finding a mATX motherboard locally that'll support the 1333mhz FSB of the E6550 so the price locally is for a regular ATX mobo.

Anyway, which route would you guys suggest??

 

[DigMe]

I would go Intel. They've really got some outstanding value processors out there right now.

If it were me on a budget build I'd go with this processor:
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16819116052&Tpk=E2180

Overclocks very easily and it's awesome bang-for-buck. This is NOT the old Pentium D. It's an all new line of processors that Intel released in the last few months.

Check out Tom's monthly roundup for the graphics card:
http://www.tomshardware.com/2007/10/01/the_best_gaming_graphics_cards_for_the_money/page3.html

Also, here's an article that is VERY relevant to your build:
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Good choice on the HD although if you're using this as a DVR you MAY end up wanting to go with the 500GB 5000AAKS. Just depends on how much you want to keep recorded on there at a time and if it's HD or SD. The microfly is a pretty cool case.

Good news for builders is that memory and hard drives are dirt cheap right now.

best of luck.

bc

 

[bobbykokinos]

I would go Intel. They've really got some outstanding value processors out there right now.

If it were me on a budget build I'd go with this processor:
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16819116052&Tpk=E2180

Overclocks very easily and it's awesome bang-for-buck. This is NOT the old Pentium D. It's an all new line of processors that Intel released in the last few months.

Check out Tom's monthly roundup for the graphics card:
http://www.tomshardware.com/2007/10/01/the_best_gaming_graphics_cards_for_the_money/page3.html

Also, here's an article that is VERY relevant to your build:
Invalid Link Removed

Thanks for the info.. Tomshardware.com has been like a bible as of lately.. I was looking at video cards and they suggest the ATI X1950 and has better performance than the card I'm looking at.. But the X1950 is DirectX 9 versus the 8600GTS I'm looking at which is DirectX 10. Should I be going for a DirectX 10 card???

As far as CPU, I'm trying to get something as fast as I can afford. I dont plan on overclocking because I'd rather it run cool and stable. I'm not too familiar with overclocking and rather just stay away from it.

 

[DigMe]

Thanks for the info.. Tomshardware.com has been like a bible as of lately.. I was looking at video cards and they suggest the ATI X1950 and has better performance than the card I'm looking at.. But the X1950 is DirectX 9 versus the 8600GTS I'm looking at which is DirectX 10. Should I be going for a DirectX 10 card???

If you're going to be running Vista then go with the best DX10 you can afford. Otherwise go with that DX9.

bc

 

[bassplayer57]

Definitly go with Intel. They have really great processors.

 

[Chunk-O-Funk]

Here's another +1 for Intel.

Right now they have the performance edge over AMD. Also, as far back as I can remember Intel always seems to do better in the multi media department.


I always shop online when putting together a new system. I would have to say about 99%. It's where the deals are. I have a number of large retail stores in my area, but they don't seem to have much, if anything of what I'm looking for, plus the prices just aren't comparable.

I've built four complete systems for myself and friends and have done a number of upgrades and so far have not had one defective part or had to ship anything back. Never had a lost package either. Maybe I'm just lucky. (Probably just cursed myself by typing that.)

I've used www.newegg.com for a number of years. Great prices, quick shipping (usually have my stuff the next business day) and heard their customer service is top notch)

www.zipzoomfly.com has got some great deals as well. They seem to give away a lot of free shipping.

Of course, check out www.bizrate.com I've found a couple of great deals using that site.

Video cards. Definitely go with something that supports DX10 if you are going to use Visa as your OS. The DX10 games are just starting to come out.

 

[DigMe]

I've used www.newegg.com for a number of years. Great prices, quick shipping (usually have my stuff the next business day) and heard their customer service is top notch)

www.zipzoomfly.com has got some great deals as well. They seem to give away a lot of free shipping.

Of course, check out www.bizrate.com I've found a couple of great deals using that site.

Also have had good service from Newegg. Zipzoomfly.com is good for large items such as cases because of the free shipping. I just got a great deal on a case from them but when it got here it must have taken a big bash during shipping because one corner was squashed. I emailed them with pics and they were very quick to send me the form to take to FedEx in order to ship it back on their dime. So up to this point I give good marks to ZZF for handling problems.

bc

 

[bobbykokinos]

Here's another +1 for Intel.
Video cards. Definitely go with something that supports DX10 if you are going to use Visa as your OS. The DX10 games are just starting to come out.

Yeah, I'm pretty sure I'm going with Intel. In all the benchmarks Ive looked at, the Intel scored slightly higher than the AMD setup for just a bit more money.

I was planning on using WinXP Pro on the system. But, my question is, will the newer games that are coming out that are "Vista Compatible" work on WinXP? I'm trying to avoid having to buy a Vista license because I already have a couple copies of XP. But, I do want to run some of the newer games.

So, even though the 8600GTS doesnt have as good performance as the X1950, I'm better off going with it because its DX10 compatible?

 

[Chunk-O-Funk]

Also have had good service from Newegg. Zipzoomfly.com is good for large items such as cases because of the free shipping. I just got a great deal on a case from them but when it got here it must have taken a big bash during shipping because one corner was squashed. I emailed them with pics and they were very quick to send me the form to take to FedEx in order to ship it back on their dime. So up to this point I give good marks to ZZF for handling problems.

bc

Ohhhh, boy. That's where my case is coming from too.
I got a little concerned when the FedEx tracking stated "in transit" from Sacramento to Reno and it stayed that way all week. Then it just showed up in Connecticut on Friday. I should have it on Monday.

At least it's good to know it will only be an inconvenience if it comes in all smashed.

 

[DigMe]

Yeah, I'm pretty sure I'm going with Intel. In all the benchmarks Ive looked at, the Intel scored slightly higher than the AMD setup for just a bit more money.

I was planning on using WinXP Pro on the system. But, my question is, will the newer games that are coming out that are "Vista Compatible" work on WinXP? I'm trying to avoid having to buy a Vista license because I already have a couple copies of XP. But, I do want to run some of the newer games.

So, even though the 8600GTS doesnt have as good performance as the X1950, I'm better off going with it because its DX10 compatible?

It doesn't look like there is going to be any DX10 patches or offerings for XP. If you're using XP and not planning on moving to Vista then get one of the DX9 cards that is faster. There is no reason to go with a DX10 card just because it's DX10 when you're going to be running DX9.

bc

 

[DigMe]

Ohhhh, boy. That's where my case is coming from too.
I got a little concerned when the FedEx tracking stated "in transit" from Sacramento to Reno and it stayed that way all week. Then it just showed up in Connecticut on Friday. I should have it on Monday.

At least it's good to know it will only be an inconvenience if it comes in all smashed.

Don't worry. FedEX is just really bad about updating their shipping status. Not sure why it would end up in Connecticut though!

bc

 

[bobbykokinos]

It doesn't look like there is going to be any DX10 patches or offerings for XP. If you're using XP and not planning on moving to Vista then get one of the DX9 cards that is faster. There is no reason to go with a DX10 card just because it's DX10 when you're going to be running DX9.

bc

I guess my question is, if I go with a DX9 setup, that'll limit what games I can play because all of the newer games will be DX10 only, right?

Dont want to build a system that wont be compatible with newer games..

Edit: I think I answered my own question. I play Microsoft Flight Sim and want to get Flight Sim X.. I saw screen shots of FSX in DX9 and DX10. DX10 are amazingly better!

 

[Chunk-O-Funk]

I guess my question is, if I go with a DX9 setup, that'll limit what games I can play because all of the newer games will be DX10 only, right?

Dont want to build a system that wont be compatible with newer games..

Not necessarily.

The games will be backward compatible with DX9, but you're system will not show all the features DX10 supports.

So, in a nutshell, if you are going to use VISTA as your OS, not getting a DX10 card doesn't make much sense. For future games anyway.

 

[bobbykokinos]

Not necessarily.

The games will be backward compatible with DX9, but you're system will not show all the features DX10 supports.

So, in a nutshell, if you are going to use VISTA as your OS, not getting a DX10 card doesn't make much sense. For future games anyway.

Hmm.. I may go with vista then.. I'm not sure.. I just heard its a tremendously huge resource hog.

 

[Chunk-O-Funk]

Edit: I think I answered my own question. I play Microsoft Flight Sim and want to get Flight Sim X.. I saw screen shots of FSX in DX9 and DX10. DX10 are amazingly better!

Yeah, there is one game review out with a lot of screen shots comparing DX9 to DX10. I was impressed with what I saw too. If you're interested in games Vista looks like the OS of choice, seeing how XP will not get a DX10 upgrade.

Vista is also supposed to have a lot more to offer in the way multimedia.

 

[Chunk-O-Funk]

Hmm.. I may go with vista then.. I'm not sure.. I just heard its a tremendously huge resource hog.

Yeah, I believe it is too. That's why they recommend so much memory in order for Vista to perform. At least 1 gig is recommended. 2 gigs, and it will perform much better. 4 gig's if you are running some memory hungry programmes. If you go with Vista Ultimate, it will support up to 8 gigs.

Being a resource hog is just part of windows.

You could stick with XP and wait until the next version of Windows to come out. Should be out sometime in 2008. It's supposed to be what XP64 should have been. You know how that goes though. Delay after delay and it's still not ready.

 

[bobbykokinos]

Yeah, I believe it is too. That's why they recommend so much memory in order for Vista to perform. At least 1 gig is recommended. 2 gigs, and it will perform much better. 4 gig's if you are running some memory hungry programmes. If you go with Vista Ultimate, it will support up to 8 gigs.

Being a resource hog is just part of windows.

You could stick with XP and wait until the next version of Windows to come out. Should be out sometime in 2008. It's supposed to be what XP64 should have been. You know how that goes though. Delay after delay and it's still not ready.

Cool.. Thanks for all of the info.. I think I'll get Vista.. I forgot I can get Vista Ultimate fairly cheap through a college affiliation. Then I'll get something like TweakVista and turn off all of the un-needed processes and stuff..

 

[Chunk-O-Funk]

A great website called PCstats is good for tweaks for XP, although I haven't seen anything for Vista just yet.

Here is a couple of tweak guides they put of for XP I found to work awesome.

http://www.pcstats.com/articleview.cfm?articleID=1590

http://www.pcstats.com/articleview.cfm?articleID=1681

After doing a lot of those changes my system ran a bit faster and I also turned off a few of the systems that slows down and clutters your hard drive.


I really, really hope they do the same with Vista.

 

[DigMe]

Yeah, DX10 is looking good but so far it's at the expense of framerate. I suspect that future patches and updates will help. Maybe there is something in the upcoming SP1 but I don't know.

You should be OK with 2 gigs of memory.

BTW, currently posting from Ubuntu. When I finish my next PC build the project after that is turning this computer into a linux based DVR/entertainment center (hopefully).

bc

 

[bobbykokinos]

Yeah, DX10 is looking good but so far it's at the expense of framerate. I suspect that future patches and updates will help. Maybe there is something in the upcoming SP1 but I don't know.

You should be OK with 2 gigs of memory.

BTW, currently posting from Ubuntu. When I finish my next PC build the project after that is turning this computer into a linux based DVR/entertainment center (hopefully).

bc

Yeah, thats one thing I'm afraid of.. Things will look great on DX10 but the framerate will go down the tubes.

But, with most games, you can turn down the quality to increase the frame rate, right??

It would be great to have awesome graphics going all the time, but I'm not THAT picky.. Heck, the first game I bought in ages was Call of Duty 2 and the graphics had me in awe, so it wont take much to please me.