Conflicting advice on walking bass

[Papageno]

This is the first time I've heard that about the 2. R-5-8-5 will play a lot of bass and they are all chord tones.

The thing about walking (like almost anything else in music) is that what is appropriate entirely depends on context.

For rockabilly or bluegrass, the R-5-8-5 would work perfectly for most of your bassline, whereas for post-bebop jazz it would sound corny before you've played 2 bars.

Conversely, playing a Gary Peacock walking bassline on a bluegrass tune would get you fired before the end of the first chorus.

You have to understand what best serves the music in your case. Listening to what the great players in your genre play will help you sorting this out.

 

[Dirk Diggler]

I had a teacher at Berklee many years ago that had great walking advice.
John Neeves (rip) was my favorite private lesson teacher.

"Root note on the 1, the rest are your choice".

However it's good to use chord tones for the others, but almost anything can become a passing tone.
And as usual there are no rules, other than root on the 1.
Dirk

 

[SLO Surfer]

Beat 2 almost always sounds better as the 3 or 7 of the chord. IMO.

But it all depends on context, where you’re coming from, and where you’re headed.

 

[ugly_bassplayer]

Given that it's almost certainly easier to get a consensus on what the Ten Most Influential Jazz Recordings Of The 20th Century are than it is to get a consensus on What Notes To Play On What Beat When Walking, I would strongly urge you to transcribe the bass lines from this hypothetical list of Ten Influential Jazz Recordings, and then analyze them to see how often the bassists adhere to a rule of thumb such as the one you were taught.

Pretty sure the answer will be: Not Very.

This x18234618925617942
Transcribe some lines ASAP.
Then analyze the chord tones. You will learn ALOT from this,
Wait till you get a LaFaro line where he plays Gb-G-Ab-A over an F7 chord leading up to a Bb7.
Ahhhh, beautiful whole tone and altered scales on dominant chords. Gotta love em.

Rules of walking bass, yeah.....they all look pretty good in books. You’ll be surprised at what is played on recordings. Even straight ahead players like Ray Brown will stray pretty far from the initial chord sometimes.

The note choices will also vary greatly depending on the piano voicings.

My 2 cents.

 

[MikeDavis]

I agree with much of the advice here and recommend transcribing and working through Ed Fuqua’s book for a deep dive into the topic. I would also suggest that its easy to get caught up in the nuts and bolts.

As I transcribed lines I was more struck by how most of the note choices of the great bassists were straightforward and ‘obvious’ but swung like hell. Ultimately, what makes a great line is one that’s swinging, supportive, and interactive and sensitive to what the other players in the group are playing in the moment. To that end, I think time spent really internalizing and hearing the harmony and melody of a tune is more productive than focusing on strong beat/weak beat or patterns. I’ve never had a band mate comment on how hip the it was to start a chord in the 7th, but I definitely would hear about it if I wasn’t swinging or making the changes and form clear.

 

[Papageno]

If your problem is having 2 different people giving you 2 different advices, then asking on TB is the surest way to making it worse: you will get 20 people giving you 20 different advices (and many of them will be good advices, but not all...)!

The responses given so far perfectly illustrate what I wrote above: they are mostly very relevant, and yet, the OP may perceive them as contradicting each other, whereas there merely reflect the almost infinite diversity of walking bass.

To understand this, and sort out what is appropriate in a given context, it is important to get the "big picture" which why I have suggested Chris Fitzgerald's videos or Mike Downes' book.

 

[Steadfast]

I walk my bass twice a day unless it drank a whole lot of water on a hot day— on those days it may require an additional walk.

 

[Cutter8]

There are three ways to walk:

1. Like a scale
2. Like an arpeggio
3. Chromatically
4. A hybrid of the above

That sure seems like four ways to walk.

 

[sedan_dad]

Duck Dunn

 

[lfmn16]

These are only general guidelines, and I get that.

Then you answered your own question.

 

[lfmn16]

That sure seems like four ways to walk.

I guess there are FIVE ways to walk.

 

[JRA]

Bob_Ross and https://www.talkbass.com/members/papageno.285700/ pretty much covered it for you, OP.

don't get too stuck on what you think (or have heard) are 'the rules' lest you forget the time signatures, per your example: that miles reference is in 3, not 4. good luck with your walking!

 

[elberon]

Some of my better walking bass lines occur when I get lost in the chord changes and I'm hanging on for dear life. I wouldn't recommend that as a "method" though.

 

[Ed Fuqua]

I had a teacher at Berklee many years ago that had great walking advice.
John Neeves (rip) was my favorite private lesson teacher.

"Root note on the 1, the rest are your choice".

However it's good to use chord tones for the others, but almost anything can become a passing tone.
And as usual there are no rules, other than root on the 1.
Dirk

Neves...

 

[Dr Zee]

Maybe somebody here will remember who said this, but it was a well known bebop Bass player,
"Just play any old damn thing"

 

[Ed Fuqua]

The other thing I would say is - the players whose lines and feel affect you most viscerally do not hew to some "formula" when creating a walking bass line. They are responding to an aural "picture"; what they hear as the arc of their line through a tune. And that arc supplies the foundation that carries the harmony forward. My initial forays into this music were as confused as yours seem to be, one of the things that helped was taking off the intro choruses that Doug Watkins plays on BLUES 7 so I'd be able to play something cogent over a blues progression. As Mike says above, the ability to hear (and understand what you're hearing in terms of function and movement) where the harmony is going and letting your ear guide your note choices is what creates a compelling walking line that moves the harmony forward. And being able to actively guide your line in response to hearing where you want it to go puts you in the driver's seat, as it were. You are playing with the other musicians rather than trying to do math while they're playing music...

 

[pappabass]

Listen to black gospel music. Best walking bass around!

 

[dbsfgyd1]

So I was taught the 1 and 3 beats are the strong beats, and they should be chord tones. The 2 beat should usually be a non-chord tone that is typically in the scale, and the 4 beat should be the leading tone.
,
These are only general guidelines, and I get that. Once in a while, it's good to mix it by playing a straight arpeggio for three or four beats, or even playing the root for all four beats, like in the opening of Miles' Someday My Prince Will Come. Still, most of the time one should follow the general guidelines approach for the best result.

Here's where it gets confusing: in many instructional tutorials on Youtube -- some by big names we all recognize -- they instruct to simply arpeggiate all four beats (or arpeggiate the first three beats and make the 4 beat a leading tone). So I'm starting wonder: how necessary is it to make the 2 beat a non-chord tone?

Any insight into these two separate schools of thought would be appreciated.

As a bassist that primarily been a “walking” bassist (not in a jazz sense), there are a lot of possibilities on how and where you play your dominant notes/beats on an arpeggio. I wouldn’t get too hung up on those basic rules, just make sure you are making the chord changes sound logical, and you (and the drummer) are sympathetic to the rhythmic cadence of the melody. I’ll probably get blasted for my post from the experts

 

[Koshchei]

So I was taught the 1 and 3 beats are the strong beats, and they should be chord tones. The 2 beat should usually be a non-chord tone that is typically in the scale, and the 4 beat should be the leading tone.
,
These are only general guidelines, and I get that. Once in a while, it's good to mix it by playing a straight arpeggio for three or four beats, or even playing the root for all four beats, like in the opening of Miles' Someday My Prince Will Come. Still, most of the time one should follow the general guidelines approach for the best result.

Here's where it gets confusing: in many instructional tutorials on Youtube -- some by big names we all recognize -- they instruct to simply arpeggiate all four beats (or arpeggiate the first three beats and make the 4 beat a leading tone). So I'm starting wonder: how necessary is it to make the 2 beat a non-chord tone?

Any insight into these two separate schools of thought would be appreciated.

What genre are you playing? If jazz, you might play the head more straight (i.e. root-3-7-walk) but after that, you can start to go nuts on the implied harmony. Listen to some of NHOP’s bass lines with Joe Pass or Oscar Peterson for example.

 

[jthisdell]

BTW "Someday my Prince will Come" is a waltz, it's in 3/4... Just saying... ;-)

So you would not necessarily emphasize the 4