Control

[Depth_Charge]

Personally, I love this way of getting things done, so long as certain perameters are in place.

+1.

When my band was ready to seek work the guys were responsible for letting me know the dates they WEREN'T available, so I could arrange a fill in or renegotiate the date, or sack someone never available (which did happen). I maintained the calendar.

This was much more efficient than checking with the whole band on every gig enquiry. What a hassle!

Blue in your situation I'd just be emailing my non-available dates to THE WHOLE BAND including the leader, then if he books a gig on that date, you have some recourse to say you warned him. It won't help you keep your place in the band if your availability prevents gigs being booked, but you'll know you were trying to do the right thing, and so will your band mates.

Best of luck man. These issues always wear me down

 

[bluewine]

just curious, when you joined the band was booking discussed? did anyone at any time lay out some expectations?

No, I should have.

 

[ric stave]

No, I should have.

Then either have a meeting and lay this out, or live with it, or walk.

 

[the yeti]

No, I should have.

well, that's water under the bridge now. you've had a lot of positive things to say about the band and it sounds like you're pretty happy otherwise, is this really that big a deal to you? is it possible you're letting yourself get caught up in some anti-bandleader hysteria? just brainstorming here, not accusing at all.

i will say if this is how the guy has been doing business it's unlikely he'll change. not out of the question though.

 

[aztomr]

Just a thought.....You said the drummer and guitarist quit in the last two weeks, it sounds like you know a drummer and guitarist looking for a band. I recall from past posts that you don't like the idea of a start up band, but now might be thetime to rethink that. If I were in your shoes, I'd call up the drummer and guitarist and see if they're interested. The three of you seemingly enjoy the same music, you could structure leadership better this time around, change other things you didn't like. Again, just a thought....

 

[bluewine]

Just a thought.....You said the drummer and guitarist quit in the last two weeks, it sounds like you know a drummer and guitarist looking for a band. I recall from past posts that you don't like the idea of a start up band, but now might be thetime to rethink that. If I were in your shoes, I'd call up the drummer and guitarist and see if they're interested. The three of you seemingly enjoy the same music, you could structure leadership better this time around, change other things you didn't like. Again, just a thought....

Good idea, however, there were other issues.The 3 of us would not be a match.

 

[bassbully]

I couldnt and wouldnt work with a band leader like this. To me a band has to be a team. Nobody will tell me I have to play a gig or when or where I will play a gig. I would never do this myself and I book 75% of my bands shows.
Nobody in my band is in a contract and we come and go as we feel. We play for the enjoyment of it but take it serious, but not so that we would disrespect or make demands on each other.

 

[Spinal Tapper]

Get a shared calendar. End of story. Until that happens, he's just going to keep (over)booking gigs unless someone says something.

My band has a Google Calendar AND we discuss ALL gigs, and often pass on a few if we don't feel like it'll be beneficial for us from a marketing standpoint...a single gig is an important thing to my band...here's my take on it (sorry if it's kinda winded):

Playing tons of local gigs isn't always a good thing (exceptions for touring, obviously).

Sure, it'll make you better at performing, but it will thin out your local draw, especially if you guys have regulars or friends who love to come out and see your band.

You said you're an original band, right? Cover bands, I think, could get away with playing every night of the week because it's a live show of music people already love. It's MUCH harder for original bands. You have to be smart about the gigs you choose.

We play about once every month or 2 (we try to keep it to weekend nights) so our draw is always outstanding and it keeps people wanting more - we do rehearse twice a week though, to stay on top of things.

Playing 3 times a week in the same town on weeknights in front of 10 people at the bar is no way to do it...I'm not saying that's you guys, but I've been down that road...

never again...

 

[the yeti]

I couldnt and wouldnt work with a band leader like this. To me a band has to be a team. Nobody will tell me I have to play a gig or when or where I will play a gig. I would never do this myself and I book 75% of my bands shows.
Nobody in my band is in a contract and we come and go as we feel. We play for the enjoyment of it but take it serious, but not so that we would disrespect or make demands on each other.

that's cool for you, it may not be for others. it depends on what your goals are. some situations require demands be made of the participants. only blue can decide if this is one of them.

 

[Marko 1]

Just curious… did you have an actual problem, or is it just a matter of principle?

Not that “principle” is wrong, I’m just curious…

 

[Medford Bassman]

+1 for this. Everyone in my band puts their unavailable dates in the calendar. Then, we can each book gigs based on an open date in the calendar. Once the gig is booked, it goes into the calendar so there's no chance of double booking a given date.

+1

 

[bassbully]

that's cool for you, it may not be for others. it depends on what your goals are. some situations require demands be made of the participants. only blue can decide if this is one of them.

Of course its IMO and personal experience. I will say anytime that you make demands on a weekend warrior/working man type band you will have major issues. I've seen that all to many times before...take Blue's band for example.

 

[QORC]

shared calendars are a good idea -- you can show "black-out" dates for members -- no bookings.

but they aren't enough. Just because there is an open date, one person should not just book whatever they wish.

We get gig offers from our agent via our Lead Singers. He sends an email around to ask if everyone is ok with the booking. And that's it. If someone says no, then, usually, the gig isn't taken (unless there is a viable sub).

If you have someone who's booking without your consent, then why do the gigs? You have to speak up and get him to stop...allow it to happen...or quit.

those are your options

 

[the yeti]

Of course its IMO and personal experience. I will say anytime that you make demands on a weekend warrior/working man type band you will have major issues. I've seen that all to many times before...take Blue's band for example.

i thought blue's band was a rising star in the upper midwest original music scene? regardless, the demands depend on the goals. if the goal is to play a once or twice a month maybe there's no real demands or at least minimal, if the goal is to work regularly/make some profit there's a higher level of demand on the participants. if you are or are striving to be "rock stars" (i know blue has used that term himself recently) the demands are higher yet. same principle applies to anything you may want to undertake. maybe it's possible to get the payoff without meeting the demands. if you know how to do that i'd love it if you'd share with me.

that said, my 1st response in this thread was "get a shared calendar". i wouldn't want to be blindsided by gigs any more than most people. even in achieving that goal there's a minimum effort "demanded".

 

[MatticusMania]

shared calendars are a good idea -- you can show "black-out" dates for members -- no bookings.

but they aren't enough. Just because there is an open date, one person should not just book whatever they wish.

This is where I disagree. I think the point of having a shared calander is just for this reason. All band members have the opportunity to let everyone else know which dates they cannot play. As soon as someone has another commitment, whatever it may be, they should put it on the calander, as that date doesnt work for them. I like this approach because it eliminates this:

He sends an email around to ask if everyone is ok with the booking. And that's it. If someone says no, then, usually, the gig isn't taken (unless there is a viable sub).

where it can sometimes take a member two or three days to reply to the email, in which case the gig could have gone to someone else.

This approach may not work for everyone, but if youre in a band where everyone is willing to play so long as other engagements are booked it really streamlines the booking process. Rather than wait two or three days for an email reply saying yes or no, they'll just have a message in their inbox saying "we play this date, at this time, at this location" and theres no need to reply.

 

[mottshoople]

Bluewine,

I was in a very similar situation. I joined a band thru bandmix. They asked me to audition, I did and got the gig. The first few practices were cool. All of a sudden the one guitarist sends out an email that we had a gig the following week and we need to rehearse the night before. I should point out that when I joined, we discussed how we all had full time jobs and families, and my goal was to have a few laughs, a few beers and if things went well, play out once a month or so. When I talked to the other guys, they were as upset as I was about the booking without asking. We had a band meeting and told him so. Two weeks later he did the same thing. Also, he made a deal with the bar owner that we'd get paid in free beer. I actually didn't mind this, haha, but I made a point of telling him that he needs to consult the rest of the band. He did it a third time and tired to have us pay a new cover song that we only practiced once. I told him I wasn't ready, as did the drummer/singer. He told us that we were doing it, end of story. i explained that if he started to play the song (Layla-and it was our keyboardists third time playing with us), I was going to go for one of my free beers. Well, he started the riff, the drummer/singer gave me this horrified look. I started to take off my bass and walk to the bar. He stopped and we played Low Spark instead, which went over very well. In between sets he asked me if I was on my second or third beer. i asked him if he thought he was my mother or father. He told the lead guitarist/singer (the self appointed BL was a rhythm player) that he can't have beers anymore (which was our pay!) because it made him "too animated".
That was his last gig with us. I have set up a google calendar, based on suggestions from people here. We have a new guitarist and are having a blast. Hopefully we will be playing out again soon.
Good luck with your situation.

 

[electracoyote]

Our band leader continues to acept booking without consulting band members. We have told him that has to stop. He's still doing it.

Suggestions

We've lost many gigs dragging our feet with an answer to the client, and that was just checking everyone's schedule to see if we were all available that day.

Booking entity can't be shackled without risk of losing gig opportunities, or you're gonna lose gigs.

We use a Yahoo band calendar, bandleader or I (the two "closers") check Yahoo calendar. If we're all clear, we jump on the booking. To do otherwise is to give the client a chance to move on to another band.

 

[bluewine]

i thought blue's band was a rising star in the upper midwest original music scene? regardless, the demands depend on the goals. if the goal is to play a once or twice a month maybe there's no real demands or at least minimal, if the goal is to work regularly/make some profit there's a higher level of demand on the participants. if you are or are striving to be "rock stars" (i know blue has used that term himself recently) the demands are higher yet. same principle applies to anything you may want to undertake. maybe it's possible to get the payoff without meeting the demands. if you know how to do that i'd love it if you'd share wi

Yeah, I am a self proclaimed Rock Star, that's as close as I can get at my age.

Thing is, the calander is a good idea. I wish the Guy could just ask our opinions at rehearsal. "We have this opportunity, date/time, venue details, pay, extra... What do you guys think, should we do it?"

Maybe that's to simple or to demanding.

Understand that this Guy doesn't like us asking questions or giving opinions on anything

 

[electracoyote]

Thing is, the calander is a good idea. I wish the Guy could just ask our opinions at rehearsal. "We have this opportunity, date/time, venue details, pay, extra... What do you guys think, should we do it?"

Yep, we used to do that, and lost gigs waiting to get together and a clear answer from everyone. Meanwhile, client moved on to another band, and we lost the booking.

Now, we all have strict instructions that if something comes up and you are not available on a certain date, put it in the calendar with a little blurb about what you're doing that day.

Then, booking entity can immediately look at the calendar and tell the client if the band is available or not.

EDIT: From a band leader perspective, sometimes being in a band is like being on a roadtrip with a car full of people who all want to go somewhere different, eat somewhere different, some have to go to the bathroom every three miles, some are complaining the music is too loud, too soft, change the station, etc., you get the point. Band leaders cannot cater to every whim and they need to have the ability to make good command decisions, sometimes on the spot without the democratic process.

 

[the yeti]

Yeah, I am a self proclaimed Rock Star, that's as close as I can get at my age.

Thing is, the calander is a good idea. I wish the Guy could just ask our opinions at rehearsal. "We have this opportunity, date/time, venue details, pay, extra... What do you guys think, should we do it?"

Maybe that's to simple or to demanding.

Understand that this Guy doesn't like us asking questions or giving opinions on anything

so are you guys (as a group) trying to make a big deal of yourselves? was that the intent when you signed on? also, when you auditioned was the guy presented as the person to answer to?