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DI or MIC it up

#21
TimmyP, I couldn't disagree with you more. Not because I don't think your way works, but because of the level of disregard that you treat other methods. I especially take exception to this:

"In short - how your bass rig sounds where you are is usually nothing like how it sounds where the crowd is - out there, it sucks."

Complete and utter nonsense. If it was true, nobody would ever use amps. YOU may not like them, but you are not everybody and you shouldn't speak for everybody. I spent the last 4 months using only a DI and ultimately I didn't like it. The mic'ed amp captures my sound way better than any DI ever did. I will use a DI if I'm given a crappy amp to play, but when I'm given a good amp, I'm going to insist on a mic from here on out. Superior sound is subjective, but on my gigs, my opinion is the only one that counts.

BigMac, I always use a speaker DI when I blend and I'm using a tube amp. If they give me an SS or hybrid, I will just use a separate DI but all my effects go directly into it. I don't use amp DI's anymore, but when I did, I usually went post.
 
#22
sonic assassin said:
i call shenanigans.

mics give too much HF content? really? cause a bass speaker will barely go over 6khz unless you mic the tweeter. the DI will give you bass up to 20khz untamed. do you plan on making a speaker like roll off to make it SOUND like a cab? doubt it. just going to let 10khz in your bass fly out of a full range system.

too little mid? with what mic? certainly not with a 421, or even the lowly 57.

below what a cab can do? good. because every show ive ever been to with a mediocre+ PA cranked a bunch of sub frequency that left my ears ringing. that stuff is dangerous, and its not fun to listen to. i dont want 30 hz ringing out of my amp at full blast. i cut that for a reason.

i havent met a sound guy yet that tried to emulate my sound. just scooped my mids, buried me in sub low end and made me completely worthless in the mix. had he listened, he'd know that i was a crucial part of the mid section. you wouldnt scoop and bury justin chancelor, would you?

and above all, theres that nasty DI rubber bandy sound. ew.
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Once I have the bass tone that I want (or the PM wants) for the bass (via DI), I usually end up cutting the top end off. I often wish I could also go up on stage to the bass rig and turn off that f***ing horn, which is doing nothing but making amusical noises.
 
#23
TimmyP said:
Once I have the bass tone that I want (or the PM wants) for the bass (via DI), I usually end up cutting the top end off. I often wish I could also go up on stage to the bass rig and turn off that f***ing horn, which is doing nothing but making amusical noises.
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Now THAT I will agree with. I like Johnny April's description of piezo tweeters...sounds like someone crinkling a potato chip bag.
 
#26
Geez, you all need to go to bed! Who do you think is going to be up after 2am reading this thread? Oh, wait...
:hiding:

I blend when at all possible. I love the character of my cab(s) miked more, but I want the thick bottom and crisp attack of the top from the DI. If I'm running my tube preamp, I'm much happier with the results if I must run direct only.
 
#28
JimmyM said:
TimmyP, I couldn't disagree with you more. Not because I don't think your way works, but because of the level of disregard that you treat other methods. I especially take exception to this:

"In short - how your bass rig sounds where you are is usually nothing like how it sounds where the crowd is - out there, it sucks."

Complete and utter nonsense. If it was true, nobody would ever use amps. YOU may not like them, but you are not everybody and you shouldn't speak for everybody. I spent the last 4 months using only a DI and ultimately I didn't like it. The mic'ed amp captures my sound way better than any DI ever did. I will use a DI if I'm given a crappy amp to play, but when I'm given a good amp, I'm going to insist on a mic from here on out. Superior sound is subjective, but on my gigs, my opinion is the only one that counts.

BigMac, I always use a speaker DI when I blend and I'm using a tube amp. If they give me an SS or hybrid, I will just use a separate DI but all my effects go directly into it. I don't use amp DI's anymore, but when I did, I usually went post.
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I'm not saying, for the sake of this argument, that the sound of the bass rig sucks. Even if it sounds great on stage, comparatively (if not generally) it sucks out there. In the crowd, it sounds nothing like the sound that bassist has, after much work, managed to craft for her/himself on stage. And IME, adding a DI's sound to it is much more likely to fill in the missing bits and work in the mix than adding a mic'd sound.
 
#29
TimmyP said:
I'm not saying, for the sake of this argument, that the sound of the bass rig sucks. Even if it sounds great on stage, comparatively (if not generally) it sucks out there. In the crowd, it sounds nothing like the sound that bassist has, after much work, managed to craft for her/himself on stage. And IME, adding a DI's sound to it is much more likely to fill in the missing bits and work in the mix than adding a mic'd sound.
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Don't need the missing bits (EDIT: eh, sometimes I do I guess but not often), and my rigs always sound awesome in the crowd because I know what I'm doing and I go listen to it on soundcheck when I'm using stage volume.
 
#30
TimmyP said:
Even if it sounds great on stage, comparatively (if not generally) it sucks out there. In the crowd, it sounds nothing like the sound that bassist has, after much work, managed to craft for her/himself on stage.
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+1

Bass amp gear , are designed as "Short throw" , or in other terms "near field". Your super thousands $$$ bass amp sound is gonna sound **** at 100 feet. We have to understand that a bass a amp is simply a monitor for the bass player , it's not designed or sold to cover all the show room.

A PA is.
 
#33
BigMac5 said:
Exactly, the PA amplifies the sound of your amp onstage.
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Yeah. When you have a PA that's bass-capable it's usually best to use it. I still want my amp sound in the PA, though. And when I don't have a PA, my amp will still fill a room just fine. Just have to have good stuff and go out in the audience during soundcheck.
 
#35
TimmyP said:
adding a DI's sound to it is much more likely to fill in the missing bits and work in the mix than adding a mic'd sound.
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i want parts missing... what i DONT want is some ape scooping my mids and turning me into a rattling license plate on a hoop-d.

i want to be mid-fi with an accentuated high midrange. no one has ever, and like will ever take that into consideration, or at least ask me.
 
#36
fokof said:
+1

Bass amp gear , are designed as "Short throw" , or in other terms "near field". Your super thousands $$$ bass amp sound is gonna sound **** at 100 feet. We have to understand that a bass a amp is simply a monitor for the bass player , it's not designed or sold to cover all the show room.

A PA is.
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thats the most narrow minded thing ive ever heard. we can spend thousands on an amp so that WE can hear it? dont think so.

300 watt tube amps/1000 watt solid state amps because WE like it that loud? hell no. so it will blow the pants off of people in the back of the room.

a properly sized bass rig will carry a normal sized club if it has to. the PA support is so WE dont go deaf filling the room. we get a normal mix, they pick up the slack.

of course my amp is my monitor.. its what i want to hear. thats why i bought it and set it to my liking. if bass amps were monitors, there would be far fewer options and they wouldnt be so damn strong.
 
#38
sonic assassin said:
i want parts missing... what i DONT want is some ape scooping my mids and turning me into a rattling license plate on a hoop-d.

i want to be mid-fi with an accentuated high midrange. no one has ever, and like will ever take that into consideration, or at least ask me.
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Sounds like you've only used instrument signal DIs. Try a speaker DI, you get all the convenience of a DI along with the sound of your amp. Great with a tube amp, as you get power amp compression in the FOH.
 
#40
SpamBot said:
Sounds like you've only used instrument signal DIs. Try a speaker DI, you get all the convenience of a DI along with the sound of your amp. Great with a tube amp, as you get power amp compression in the FOH.
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no club ive ever been to has had one. doubt any of them have heard of it. id still know the difference. the limitations of the driver are part of my sound.

better, yes, but i dont see whats so hard about throwing up a mic. why do we need shortcuts? they dont DI guitars (often enough to matter), why does EVERYONE want to DI bass? is an extra stand on the stage so hard? they complain of a lack of low end.. get a proper mic. my 421 will give me boom for days.
 

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