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does a zero fret make the nut material unimportant?

#21
Without jumping into the fray too far (I hope)...

There are many other good reasons to use a zero fret beyond
the question of sound.

-The precision of the nut slots is less critical.
In fact, given the relative difficulties of installing a fret vs. properly cutting a nut,
I would consider a zero fret a good choice for a beginning builder.

-Bone, many brasses, most graphite, and *certainly* wood will
wear just as quickly as a zero fret, and that amount of wear
depends a great deal on frequency and technique of string
changes or tuning changes. If you're Michael Manring, maybe it
would be a serious issue - but for the average player, I think the
abrasive action on the fret will be relatively small.


-Changes in string gauge are easier, since the nut will not potentially be too low or too high for a different string.
As long as the slot is wide enough, it will play right.

Now, as for the sound question:

Probably not. However, if so, the differences here are going
to be IMO too subtle to make a practical difference.
I have used graphite, brass, wood, and plexiglas (yep!) nuts
on instruments with zero frets, and consider them functionally
interchangeable.

My position tends to correspond with Ken Parker's,
as presented in the recent New Yorker article:

"I told Parker about the walrus ivory the first time I visited him. He gave me a look of mild pity...
He’d done some nut experiments of his own, he said, in the early nineteen-eighties. “I thought, O.K., I’ll make one out of every conceivable material, then see if I can tell the difference. I tried wood, brass, nickel silver, elephant ivory—everything.”

“He thought it would make superior nut material, so I cut it up and made a couple of parts out of it,” he said. “And, you know, it’s just a bone. It barely makes a difference.”

“Changing this is like a girl thinking that if she changes her nail polish she’ll be beautiful.”
Click to expand...

and, later in the same article:

“If changing a guitar’s nut is like using pink nail polish,” Parker said, “then making the neck stiffer is like losing
forty-five pounds.”
Click to expand...

So, what I'm trying to say here is this:
The biggest percentage of the sound by far comes from
the wood, construction, pickups and electronics, and the player.
The "right" or "wrong" nut material will not make a good bass into
a dog, or vice versa. Just don't use balsa wood or cheddar cheese.

Many fine builders, including Veillete, MTD, Elrick, and others
have adopted the zero fret for their current lines of instruments.
It's worth asking why.
The setups are certainly quicker and more forgiving, I can promise.

Peace,
Martin Keith
 
#22
Interesting thread! I think about using a zero fret for my first build, but I wonder if you should incorporate it in the fret leveling & dressing process. To me it makes sense to do that, but I just want to know how everyone else thinks about it?
 
#23
This may make me sound slow but...if the zero fret is leveled at the same height as all the frets & the nut is set to standard height, how does a zero fret even effect the sound?
All strings are open notes until fingered onto a fret. If the zero fret is next to the nut, can the string even be fingered to touch the zero fret? Do you tune it as an open string or with the string pressed on the zero frett?
 
#24
endorphinman said:
This may make me sound slow but...if the zero fret is leveled at the same height as all the frets & the nut is set to standard height, how does a zero fret even effect the sound?
All strings are open notes until fingered onto a fret. If the zero fret is next to the nut, can the string even be fingered to touch the zero fret? Do you tune it as an open string or with the string pressed on the zero frett?
Click to expand...
On a zero-fret instrument, the "nut" is not a nut, it is a string separator, and it is slotted lower than fret level, so your concerns are no longer a concern.
 
#26
I have an acoustic guitar from the 60s that has a zero fret. It is a wonderful instrument. The zero fret makes playing chords easier. Some guitars that have the nut cut too high will actually go out of tune for certain chords that have a combination of fretted and unfretted strings in the same chord. My 60s acoustic guitar says Ensenada on the headstock. I have never seen another. But it is 40 years old and the neck is straight and it had never had a single truss rod adjustment. I have lived in dry and humid climates and it still keeps on working fine.
 
#27
A zero fret is really nice if you want to experiment with different string gauges. I've got string sets for my Steinberger that range from a .080 E string to a .110 E string, I can swap them out without any major setup issues.

I do wonder though, if it is absolutely necessary to use a slightly larger (taller) fret for the zero fret... ;o)
 
#30
F-Clef-Jef said:
A zero fret is really nice if you want to experiment with different string gauges. I've got string sets for my Steinberger that range from a .080 E string to a .110 E string, I can swap them out without any major setup issues.

I do wonder though, if it is absolutely necessary to use a slightly larger (taller) fret for the zero fret... ;o)
Click to expand...

No, the same size fret will work. Think of it as when your playing, as your playing on the fingerboard do your other frets need to be higher?

You can always use a stainless steel fret as the zero fret if your worried about it wearing out.

But as always I could be wrong.
 

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