Facebook's decline as a useful band tool...

[stagebanter]

Facts talk, BS walks, IMHO, FB is lame, and my band only has it so we can show owners, yeah we have it.

We use a Piwik stats package on our website to track who visits it and what they do their. There's a direct correlation between our average daily visitors and our Facebook likes. What's more, there's a direct correlation between website hits/song plays on our site and "big" Facebook posts (ones that are SEEN BY SEVERAL THOUSAND PEOPLE, I might add).

No, I can't say that - in my band's case - our success is due entirely to Facebook. Why? Because that would mean I was putting all my eggs in the Facebook basket and that's stupid - you have to diversify your promotional avenues. But I will say this...we have completely stopped using fliers (which cost 7-8 cents a page, which is actually MORE expensive than Facebook promotion in terms of "hits" per dollar) and we've seen MORE people at our shows than ever before. We announce them on the website and we contact our mailing list once every 2-4 weeks with a list of gigs. MailChimp lets us track how successful our mailing list is - the "read rate" is under 30%. As for Facebook, we get huge responses - likes/comments/shares - for every gig announcement.

To be sure, it's not for everyone. But to say that it is useless is just silly. Like I said previously, web advertising is part of my day gig, and businesses I work for see results in terms of increased sales when I start doing Facebook campaigns for them.

 

[bassman314]

Screw facebook! all you folks who claim its wild success- SHOW us FACTS that you actually increased the amount of people coming to your gigs by any significant number BECAUSE of Facebook. Are you really sure they only came because of your facebook promotion? you didn't send out EMAILS to them, or call them or put up flyers, or something else?
Facts talk, BS walks, IMHO, FB is lame, and my band only has it so we can show owners, yeah we have it.
I mean you can't even post MP3's on it!! For real, how friendly for a band is that??!?

You've never been able to rely on any one single method of communication. It used to be street teams who would stick up flyers, make calls, and generally harass their friends.

Now, you need to promote yourself by more than just one social media outlet. You need some compbination of FB, Twitter, Band Camp, Reverb Nation, MySpace, your own page, and you probably need a band newsletter to send to a mailing list.

You have to network with other show biz contacts. This has never changed.

This is why managers are so important, even in today's Digital world. I'm not saying all of us should hire managers, but someone has to do all of that. Either the band, a trusted friend/fan, or someone you pay to do it.

 

[lustersilk]

I feel like I'm pestering everyone, constantly.

Me too

 

[Factor88]

. But to say that it is useless is just silly. Like I said previously, web advertising is part of my day gig, and businesses I work for see results in terms of increased sales when I start doing Facebook campaigns for them.

I'm very interested in this remark, and how internet "advertising" applies to the average band. I know that if a person wants mechanic to work on their volkswagen, or a plumber with 24 hour service, or a tax attorney, they may turn to the internet much like they used yellowpages years ago. But when a Dayton Ohio bar owner is looking to upgrade the quality of bands in their club, are they googling "cover bands Dayton"? When a bunch of 40 somethings are looking to go hear a blue band in Sedona on a Satuday night, are they putting "blues band Sedona" into a search engine? I'm not trying to be sarcastic, I'm actually asking.

I hear quite a few people saying they noticed better gig attendence after well planned internet/FB advertising; but I always wonder how they disentangled that attendence bump from the normal evolution of a band's attendence: bands tend to get tighter over time, and also build attendence just via being a good band, then plateau at some point, and usually eventually decline. To really know if it was the internet advertising that got you the increase you would have to have stats showing that you had reached a plateau and had been on it for some time, before the introduction of the advertising. I doubt very many bands are sophisticated enough to do that......

 

[obimark]

Sorry, but from my 20 years of experience with marketing "professionals" in the "real day job world" you guys can find results in anything. Prove causality. You can't. In any market there are natural changes in sales, and seasonal shifts. Even in the "weekend warrior" band market.

The only solid proof you might be able to do, and I say MIGHT, is if you sent a survey to people who attended your show, and specifically asked, would you have attended this show without the FB advert?
Even then, guess what, people LIE on surveys all the time, so you would need a HUGE population to even get somewhat good data.
I am not saying FB can't work sometimes for some bands, but in general, I am saying it doesn't work.
IME< you tweeners, and 20s may see better results because of how connected your age group is. For 40s like myself, no way, it is ignored 95% of the time.

 

[powerdimer]

Forget Facebook. It's for kids nowadays.

Invest in a proper band website and use FB to promote that...

Yeah. No kids listens to music or goes to conserts any more...

Facebook is where people is at. Kids, adults, teens, elders, the lot. This is bad for a marketing tool?

(Yeah, myspace was much better. Proper musicians and internet nerds posting stuff to each other and no one else really cared)

 

[stagebanter]

I am not saying FB can't work sometimes for some bands, but in general, I am saying it doesn't work.
IME< you tweeners, and 20s may see better results because of how connected your age group is. For 40s like myself, no way, it is ignored 95% of the time.

You are incorrect about "in general it doesn't work" because the 18-35 demographic is also a HUGE part of annual entertainment spending in the world. However you are correct that for the 40+ demographic it is not nearly as useful. Also keep in mind that you are trying to tell someone who makes lots of money for people with Facebook advertising that "Facebook doesn't work", which would be kind of like telling Carol Kaye that "real" bass players don't use a pick.

I can't "prove" that Facebook advertising is what works for the businesses I work for because induction is impossible and deduction is too time-consuming when there are literally thousands of ways to advertise. What I can tell you is that there's an across-the-board correlation: I start a Facebook campaign, and business starts picking up. Even if they don't change any of their other methods of advertising. It doesn't imply causation but it does wiggle its eyebrows suggestively while pointing and mouthing "look over there!"

 

[P-oddz]

To be sure, it's not for everyone. But to say that it is useless is just silly. Like I said previously, web advertising is part of my day gig, and businesses I work for see results in terms of increased sales when I start doing Facebook campaigns for them.

I agree with this wholeheartedly, and unfortunately it seems like you're fighting an uphill battle here, stagebanter.

It seems to me that some replies on here are based on nothing more than a sour attitude towards social media, or not understanding its utilization and effectiveness in marketing (I'm a graphic designer and work hand in hand with the marketing department), but also not recognizing their own key demographic. The responses that are trying to tell you that you are wrong, despite the fact that you do this for a living (which in my mind is pretty disrespectful to you), seem to be coming from a place of purely not understanding new media, and a subsequent knee-jerk reaction to dismiss something as useless, that they may not have a full grasp on.

I don't understand sports. Are they useless? A lot of people would disagree with me.

As mentioned before (by you....multiple times.... ) FB is one tool of many for people to utilize to reach your market. It's not going to solve all of your problems. It's not going to make people like your music. But it is a valid option (again, of many) to help promote, share info and news and stay in touch with an audience.

Not every post on FB is going to be seen. Not everyone is going to pay attention to it. But some do. And sometimes those people share with others. Sure, there is a lot of advertising noise that goes on, on FB - but there are ways to be successful with promotion on it. And just because it didn't work for your band, it doesn't mean that is the case with everyone else.

 

[DwaynieAD]

You are incorrect about "in general it doesn't work" because the 18-35 demographic is also a HUGE part of annual entertainment spending in the world. However you are correct that for the 40+ demographic it is not nearly as useful. Also keep in mind that you are trying to tell someone who makes lots of money for people with Facebook advertising that "Facebook doesn't work", which would be kind of like telling Carol Kaye that "real" bass players don't use a pick.

I can't "prove" that Facebook advertising is what works for the businesses I work for because induction is impossible and deduction is too time-consuming when there are literally thousands of ways to advertise. What I can tell you is that there's an across-the-board correlation: I start a Facebook campaign, and business starts picking up. Even if they don't change any of their other methods of advertising. It doesn't imply causation but it does wiggle its eyebrows suggestively while pointing and mouthing "look over there!"

you're comments on this thread have me looking into and talking to my band about possibly using facebook's pay advertising services.

the "promote" option still leaves a bad taste in my mouth as you are giving them money to show your posts to people who have already liked your page. however the sponsored posts and the advertisements are legitimate advertising avenues and should not be discounted (from the little bit of research i've done so far)

thanks for the push in the right direction. hope something comes of it.

 

[Session1969]

We get much better attendance when we run a $5 FB ad. So much so that the last couple of gigs where we utilized that strategy the venues had to turn people away due to capacity. $5 well spent in our case.

How do you do that ?

 

[Runnerman]

We won't go the way of FB ads I don't think but there are two things i've heard here that I have already taken to heart....

Posting more media....soundfiles and pics....already started doing that and seeing some buzz.

Second one is using the "share" function from each of the band members personal pages for any post on the band page.....and encouraging the fans to do the same.

I still feel the "event" stuff is hugely misleading on FB's part as it does not work as most of us would assume it should.....reaching all our band page likes. That still really bothers me. But I will find a way to cope with that before resorting to ads.

 

[DwaynieAD]

How do you do that ?

https://www.facebook.com/help/promote

the promote button under your post. you're basically paying fb to show your post to the people that already like your page..

 

[stagebanter]

The "Promote" feature is relatively new. I have not tried any sort of paid advertising with my band. I believe FB released the "promote" feature in response to the widespread prevalence of AdBlock and similar plugins that prevent them from showing paid ads - and no show means no money.

I have used the promote feature for businesses that I work for - to make sure that their sale next week appears on everyone's news feeds, for example. AND IT WORKS. The sponsored ads work too, this is just another form of marketing that's a little more "viral" (you can't share a sponsored ad, so there is no "viral reach" - in fact, FB's insights package is INCREDIBLY helpful and will break down which posts have the widest viral spread as opposed to just news feed visibility, etc. etc., and it can tell you which demographics are getting down with your page)

 

[BWB]

But is there evidence that shows such reach translates into people actually showing up at the gig? Not just yours, I'm curious in general...

Personally, I tend to completely gloss over such ads....

It's about name recognition - people have to see advertising again and again before it sinks in. If they've never heard OF you, that's one step down band-wise from having never HEARD you. If they know the name and keep seeing it around, some independent investigation may (should) result. Maybe then they'll show up at a gig. I'm not thinking in terms of any one gig when we put our ads up.

And believe me, the email I got last year from a club owner that said "My wife saw an ad for your band at my club - you guys did that??" didn't hurt our bookability ONE BIT.

 

[BWB]

PEOPLE - stop focusing on the PROMOTE tab for your posts.

Go to Facebook and figure out and understand how the bidding process works for ads that appear ON THE RIGHT. We are paying, average, $0.05 per 1000 views for our ads. 200,000 shows to 30,000 different people is TEN BUCKS at that rate and it didn't even end up that high - we ended up at just under $7 for that much advertising.