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Feelings of Inadequacy

P

poppinsmac

Aug 10, 2007
372
2
#1
Alright - a bit of background first.

The Sheepdogs (they play the Echoplex Nov 11th, and I highly recommend seeing them if you're free) are my favourite band out right now. I was working at a show they played last weekend, ran into them back stage and we started chatting. They asked if I played in a band, I told them I played in a cover band that actually covers a few of their songs, and it happened to work out that they were in town a few more days and we had a show so they said they would come down.

Three of the members (the singer was feeling sick and stayed back) came down to our show, played two of their songs with us and then hung out on stage singing backups for most of our last set and were just all around cool guys. Then at the end of the night the guitarist said 'Man,that was fun! Next time we're in town we should jam!" and gave me his phone number.

This was the coolest musical night of my life, hands down.

So long story short, my favourite band thinks we're cool. Wow.

Now, lets say by some freak chance their bassist breaks an arm right before they go on tour and they need a touring bassist for a while, so they give me a call and want me to fill in for some shows.
I could totally hold my own with this band - I can groove just as well as Ryan, their bassist, and I can easily play the lines. But at the same time I would be shocked and left with thinking "Really? You guys were just on the cover of Rolling Stone, you played Jimmy Fallon, Bonaroo, signed a deal with Atlantic, and above all you're my favourite band - surely you could find a better bassist!"

So, this is all a stupid hypothetical scenario, but for me it raises an interesting question. You are one my top bassists of all time, and surely at some point you've been asked to play or work with one of your heros.

How did you feel when asked to play with Beck or NIN, or work with any other the other countless amazing artists you've worked with? If you've ever felt inadequate how did you deal with it, or at a certain point does it just not matter?
 
#2
That was cool. As for me, I'd be in awe and excited out of my mind if it was Deep Purple, or Grand Funk, the Stones, the Who, or the Allman Brothers who I jammed with. We did open for Van Halen once (long time ago before they were super famous), but the Sheepdogs? I have to admit I never heard of them so I Youtubed them and listened to Who, and How Late How Long. I also have to admit I just don't get why they'd be your favorite band and why you would cover their tunes. Sorry. Just my opinion, and I know what you'll probably say I can do with my opinion. Btw, I don't see what people see in Greenday either. To me they sound like a teenage garage band (not to say there aren't some really good ones).
lol.
 
#3
martinmcfly said:
That was cool. As for me, I'd be in awe and excited out of my mind...
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Fixed! (the rest of this post was not necessary and showed lack of tact)




On topic, if I landed in a scenario where I was asked to play for a big act, I wouldn't even think twice about any other players that could've had the gig...there is always someone better out there somewhere. Everyone knows this. But I got the call right? So I would just make the best of it and play my ass off!
 
#4
I'd probably go crazy if Devin Townsend, ISIS, or some other band I love asked me to take over for a night. If it was a prog band with massively long songs, I'd probably turn my amp down to cover any mistakes. I would be nervous, but mainly excited to play with a band I enjoy.

Edit: Sorry, should've checked what forum it was first.
 
#5
Double E said:
Fixed! (the rest of this post was not necessary and showed lack of tact!
Click to expand...

U r right. I guess i would be excited too if some band with less than average talent, completely unoriginal songs with simple and amatuerish, even awkward, changes, asked me to be their new Bass player. Do I have an axe to grind about this band? No. I've never heard of them, but I listened to a couple of songs AND discovered they're comparing themselves to the Allman Bros. The OP says they were on the cover Of Rolling Stone. Man
Slow news month? Even gives me less respect for Rolling Stone than I had before. If these guys are held in musical high regard it really does shows the horrible state of Rock these days, and it's depressing.
 
#6
Yup. If some rad 80's band that I adore like New Order or Cocteau Twins reformed and needed me to be the guy in lieu of Hooky (how do you replace HIM?) or Simon Raymonde, I'd just die. Or if McCartney asked me to be in his band, or if some modern band that I really like such as Death Cab or Arcade fire had an opening, you get the idea. Whatever...there's just so many.

I might have feelings of inadequacy that pass over. They're there - everybody gets them. But once you dive in, those feelings in my experience dissolve into something milder...more akin to "nerves". It's just stuff you play through, and you certainly don't waste your time overanalyzing it. That's a rabbit hole you don't want to go down. It's solved only by mountains of hard work and fierce determination. NIN is a good example of this for me. I not only learned 65 + songs in a little over a month, I also helped put a whole show together (the "Lights In the Sky" tour). Suffice to say, I had no family life then and I ate and slept NIN. But it was exhilarating, and made me stronger.

Shifting the topic slightly but still in there: putting yourself forward enthusiastically for a gig, albeit with a fair measure of tact and reality, never hurt anyone. Get the gigs you WANT whenever possible. Being overmodest never ultimately helps...that's just an extension of insecurity. I told M83 I was going to be their producer, and they were not incredulous, to my surprise. They were stoked. And here I am, on the cusp of the release of what I feel is my finest work.

All I'm really trying to say is pushing yourself just a bit too hard is really the only way to excellence. Feelings of inadequacy just fade into nerves, which then ultimately fade into nothing.

Work hard, don't suck, surround yourself with people that are likewise not afraid of work and who love to strive for more, articulate your dream scenarios (as far-fetched as they might be), and just find a way.

Best,
Justin
 
#7
martinmcfly said:
U r right. I guess i would be excited too if some band with less than average talent, completely unoriginal songs with simple and amatuerish, even awkward, changes, asked me to be their new Bass player. Do I have an axe to grind about this band? No. I've never heard of them, but I listened to a couple of songs AND discovered they're comparing themselves to the Allman Bros. The OP says they were on the cover Of Rolling Stone. Man
Slow news month? Even gives me less respect for Rolling Stone than I had before. If these guys are held in musical high regard it really does shows the horrible state of Rock these days, and it's depressing.
Click to expand...

"My favorite bands are cooler than your favorite bands."

wank.gif
 
#8
martinmcfly said:
U r right. I guess i would be excited too if some band with less than average talent, completely unoriginal songs with simple and amatuerish, even awkward, changes, asked me to be their new Bass player. Do I have an axe to grind about this band? No. I've never heard of them, but I listened to a couple of songs AND discovered they're comparing themselves to the Allman Bros. The OP says they were on the cover Of Rolling Stone. Man
Slow news month? Even gives me less respect for Rolling Stone than I had before. If these guys are held in musical high regard it really does shows the horrible state of Rock these days, and it's depressing.
Click to expand...
Do you even realize that you are butting-in in a specific subforum where your jaded opinion is not asked for? Heck, even in an open forum your commentary would have a very douchebaggery ring to it.

Learn some manners, sheesh.
 
#9
Micah, doing what you're doing is how you get yourself into that world, and if it ever happens and they offer you the gig, you take it and worry about your silly feelings of inadequacy later ;) We all get them, but always remember that if they didn't think you could cut the gig, they wouldn't ask you.
 
#10
jmjbassplayer said:
All I'm really trying to say is pushing yourself just a bit too hard is really the only way to excellence. Feelings of inadequacy just fade into nerves, which then ultimately fade into nothing.

Work hard, don't suck, surround yourself with people that are likewise not afraid of work and who love to strive for more, articulate your dream scenarios (as far-fetched as they might be), and just find a way.
Click to expand...
Thanks a lot! Lots of wisdom in that post and things to think about, but the quoted bits are great advice.

To the rest of the guys regarding the Sheepdogs (and music in general) - I think they are an excellent band. They write great songs that have solid melodies, great harmonies, tasty guitar solos, are really fun to watch live, their albums are all solid start to finish with no real 'filler' and all in all are really cool down to earth people. In my mind you can't really ask for more out of a band.

But it's music. Taste is subjective and none of it should be taken too seriously. It's fun - enjoy it or don't, but most importantly "Don't Be a Dick!'
 
#11
JimmyM said:
Micah, doing what you're doing is how you get yourself into that world, and if it ever happens and they offer you the gig, you take it and worry about your silly feelings of inadequacy later ;) We all get them, but always remember that if they didn't think you could cut the gig, they wouldn't ask you.
Click to expand...

Thanks Jimmy, that is very true.
The post was mostly for my keyboardist specifically. They don't have a touring keyboard player and they could really benefit from one, in my mind. We are going to be seeing them again next weekend so I was telling my keyboard player I think he should suggest it to them and he doesn't feel up to it (despite being a really good fit I think) - if nothing else it doesn't hurt to put the idea out there, right?

But as we were talking he asked me if they asked me to play with them if I would be up for it... hence, this post.
 
#12
Double E said:
Do you even realize that you are butting-in in a specific subforum where your jaded opinion is not asked for? Heck, even in an open forum your commentary would have a very douchebaggery ring to it. Learn some manners, sheesh.
Click to expand...

I don't agree. The OP asked a question but didn't provide a relevant example for the question. Have you listened to The Sheepdogs. They aren't a relevant example for his hypothesis. It's like asking if I'd be excited to join William Hung's Band. No, I'd be embarrassed.
 
#13
martinmcfly said:
I don't agree. The OP asked a question but didn't provide a relevant example for the question. Have you listened to The Sheepdogs. They aren't a relevant example for his hypothesis. It's like asking if I'd be excited to join William Hung's Band. No, I'd be embarrassed.
Click to expand...
Well that's your opinion but it obviously isn't Micah's, and it's really not relevant to the question.

BTW, if William Hung can beat what Bowzer pays and has a decent amount of work, I'm there ;)
 
#15
martinmcfly said:
Wow Jimmy, and I had respect for you. :( I've turned down 3 bands with paying gigs because I didn't have any enthusiasm for the music. I guess it'd be different if I needed the money.
Click to expand...

What you don't seem to understand is this isn't about you. It isn't about what you "think" is good music or what you like as music. It isn't about what you "think" is good or bad about OP's band. It has NOTHING to do with the topic in this thread.
 
#16
martinmcfly said:
Wow Jimmy, and I had respect for you. :( I've turned down 3 bands with paying gigs because I didn't have any enthusiasm for the music. I guess it'd be different if I needed the money.
Click to expand...
Yeah, well I'm 50 with a mortgage, two kids, a grandson, and a seeming inability to make a good living any other way. Of course I could if I had to, but it would involve retraining and starting out at the bottom again. Since the William Hung thing is over, it's not going to be an issue in my life, but any time you're playing music, I consider that a good thing, even if it's music I wouldn't listen to in my off time. Sorry if that loses me artistic integrity points with you, but after I type this I will file your comments in the "irrelevant to my life" folder and forget completely about them, so it's all good.
 
#17
martinmcfly said:
I don't agree. The OP asked a question but didn't provide a relevant example for the question. Have you listened to The Sheepdogs. They aren't a relevant example for his hypothesis. It's like asking if I'd be excited to join William Hung's Band. No, I'd be embarrassed.
Click to expand...
The question was asked in an "ask-the-artist" subforum. It was not intended for critique by the masses. While it's not necessarily totally out of line to offer a contribution, you really should not have come out with guns blazing slagging on a band that the OP happens to admire.

You are extremely dense if you don't understand what I am trying to say...believe me, someone out there certainly has the same disdain for the music you like.
 
#18
Well, we won't be seeing mcfly anymore. Here's the back story: http://www.talkbass.com/forum/f8/latest-mf-mid-blue-ric-sale-799402/index10.html#post11400616

My story pales in significance, but it's somewhat along these lines. In 1987 in Florida, through connections, me and my roommate/guitarist auditioned to be in the backup band for Moe Tucker of the Velvet Underground. The Velvets were seeing a resurgence in popularity thanks to REM and others. This wasn't the same as playing with Lou, Cale and Moe all together by any means, but we were big fans and this was still intimidating.

But we just studied up on the songs (Velvets as well as Moe solo material) and basically said "Screw this, we can handle it." It helped that Moe herself wasn't at the audition, we hadn't met her yet. (She turned out to be a really cool lady, though.)

I'm so glad we went through with it. We passed. It only resulted in a few gigs, but it gave me some really memorable moments. We played 3 dates in Florida, then later I went up north for an NYC gig one night (first time in the city) and Boston the next. (My guitarist couldn't make it.) I played CBGB's one night (a total hole, but a legendary one of course) and the next at TT the Bear's om Cambridge. The opening band was the then-unknown Pixies. I actually missed most of their set since I was having dinner next door with the guys in the band (which included Jad Fair of Half Japanese) and watching a belly dancer. I borrowed Kim Deal's bass amp; she was pretty quiet. Slept on the floor in an office upstairs, then hopped on a plane and went back to real life. But it was a blast.

Sorry for the rambling and name-dropping. Bottom line, just prepare as hard as you can when the opportunity arises and the doubts should recede.
 

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