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Fender American Ultra ii Precision Bass Query
- Thread starter Gully35
- Start date
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The switch obviously works fine when the bass is new, but this type of switch has a long, proven history of premature, mechanical failure. The switch basically gets stuck. The Ultra IIs haven't been out there long enough for this to be a problem yet, but there is a significant chance that it will be, unless the physical construction of these switches has been totally re-designed (which I strongly doubt). I'm not saying ALL these switches will fail, but there's a very high probability that they will fail within an unacceptably short period of time. The evidence is out there, Fender's S-1 switches of this type have a HUGE, unacceptable failure rate. When I get Fender's with S-1 swithces for repairs, I would estimate that maybe 30% of them still work. Of course, these are guitars and basses of extremely varying age/use, but the evidence clearly shows that this type of Fender S-1 switch is extremely prone to failure, and a weak link. I honestly don't understand why Fender has kept using them, when they have such a poor track record.
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Not a reason to not buy a bass, as it's easily replaced by a push/pull pot. $5 max plus labour.
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So you think it's ok that Fender use a part with a well documented, known issue of mechanical failure in their $2000+ basses?
Sorry, but that's just not acceptable in my world. In fact, I wouldn't find it acceptable on a $200 Harley Benton. When a part has developed a well documented history of failing prematurely, you stop using it. When they know about it and keep using it, it's basically planned obsolesence.
Also, replacing the S-1 switch with a push/pull pot might have been a quick&easy job if Fender had wired these basses the classic way instead of going cheap and using surface mount components and pots/switches directly soldered to a PCB. Just to be clear: I'm not saying SMT/PCB will affect the tone negatively in any way whatsoever, but when something fails it can be a lot more complicated to deal with, and Fender is obviously doing this because it's cheaper than wiring it the classic way.
Even if you're willing to deal with all the hassle, I'm not convinced that there's even enough vertical wiggle room to install a standard push/pull pot without bending and potentially breaking the PCB when re-fastening it to the pickguard. So no, the S-1 is definitely not EASILY replaced with a push/pull on these basses, if actually possible at all (within a reasonable amount of labor).
Of course the S-1 pot/switch can in theory be easily replaced with the same type of S-1 pot/switch when it fails. At least if you can find one that's made for PCB mounting. The S-1 switches/pots I've seen Fender selling separately have NOT been for PCB mounting though. If this part isn't readily available it means that after the warranty runs, out a broken S-1 switch might actually mean you're left with a broken preamp assembly that's no longer supported by Fender.
And in any case, a replacement S-1 won't be any better than the one it replaces, which means it will be a forever ticking bomb.
This is of course assuming Fender hasn't COMPLETELY redesigned and improved these S-1 switches/pots, but I haven't seen anything to suggest this.
By all means, buy this bass if you want to. They're generally very nice basses, but the well-documented issue with Fender's S-1 switches/pots should be mentioned when someone asks for advice on these basses. When soldered directly to a PCB it can potentially be an even bigger hassle to deal with.
That's a whole lot of words to write before admitting that you have no idea if Fender has fixed this issue but since it's obvious that "Fender sucks", you're confident enough to dump all over them one more time based only on your past. And now I've written more words about this than it deserved.
Funny enough, one of the things I had to fix on my very expensive EBMM Stingray Special was the volume pot, which was a 25k linear pot with a push pull function that my tech was only able to source directly from EB at a cost of $35+labour. Another tech had tried to take the pickguard off, and didn't realize the knobs had set screws so broke the pot trying to pull off the knob.
Nobody seems to be ranting about these very specialized rare pots, though it's true not many are likely breaking annually via this method - having said that, though, this was a trained tech, not just some bass owner. Anyway, the point is that it didn't occur to me to rant about it because it's overall an inexpensive part relative to the value of the instrument. Also, nobody gets "internet points" of valour for ranting about EBMM, that's exclusively reserved for Fender.
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I totally understand your frustration. It's always EXTREMELY annoying when manufacturers use hard to find parts like that. It doesn't matter what it says on the headstock, it's always extremely annoying. Having to source parts directly from the manufacturer can be a HUGE hassle. And even worse, if the manufacturer goes out of business, or if they stop supporting the model in question. Then you're REALLY in trouble, and might be looking at major modifications to fit a new, different preamp.
Unfortunately, with more and more guitars/basses having everything (including pots/switches) soldered directly to circuit boards rather than traditional wiring, we're often looking at repairs that would have taken 5 minutes "in the old days" but now need nearly all the electronics to be ripped out and sometimes even replaced. Even guitar electronics have now become planned obsolescence junk that isn't really designed to be repaired. Or at least not EASILY repaired, like traditionally wired guitars are. I feel sick every time I open the back panel on a new Gibson guitar. They look more like laptops than guitars inside. Repairs that used to be dead easy, like replacing a pot, can now be extremely time consuming. And the funny thing is, the "bigger" the brand, and the more expensive the model, the more the electronics look like planned obsolescence junk. Well, not always. But very often.
Oh I wasn't implying anything specific necessarily, just sharing my story which is clearly not something that should have happened and that is why "QC" exists. In this case, they failed in a very basic way, detecting warped necks and manufacturing issues is one thing and is more difficult than just making sure every screw is in it's place. This was something very basic that was wrong on a $2K+ instrument and THAT is what people are talking about, THAT kinda QC issue shouldn't be something a company like fender has a problem with, but after I noticed this issue on mine, I looked at more on Sweetwater that are the same model as mine and occasionally you'll see one with the same issue, a missing screw in the key tuner mounts. This was not that unique of an issue and it really should have been just an off day for both departments even though it is QC's job to see stuff like this. It's just basic manufacturing, make sure every screw is in place.... and FENDER fails at that in the $2k range. Thank goodness this type of instrument construction isn't that complicated with these types of basic instruments or Fender would have a major problem with their garbage QC.
EDIT: Just checked sweetwater, Fender American Vintage II 1960 Precision Bass - 3-tone Sunburst missing TWO screws.
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Regarding the S-1 switch, I'm generally a Fender fan, but during the "American Series" period, I played at least three NEW Fender basses off the wall at music stores with broken S-1s. It was one of the reasons I never bought an American Series bass.
So nothing specific, just sharing your own unique one-of story and then expanding to broad generalities, that is what *I* am talking about.
Sample bias.
Maybe you've got too much time on your hands.
I shared a story of my bass not having the proper QC for a $2k+ bass and told you of how there have been many others I've spotted since, of the exact same model, that have the same issue and worse in fact AT THIS VERY MOMENT and you say "Maybe you've got too much time on your hands."? Wow, way to double down after being proven way wrong. Oh and it wasn't too hard to check sweetwater.com and riffle through the pics a bit, doesn't take that much time, maybe it does for you, I dunno.
Toodalooo...
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I tried a couple of Ultra 5 string basses. The design of the bridge causes the B string to bind ant the saddle and creates a muffled sound. A four sting might have this issue,
I have a 90's passive PBj with VVT controls and frankly it's the best Fender bass I've ever played.
Dude, you're combing through sweetwater pics counting screws. If you're having a good time doing it, knock yourself out, but it doesn't seem like it.I shared a story of my bass not having the proper QC for a $2k+ bass and told you of how there have been many others I've spotted since, of the exact same model, that have the same issue and worse in fact AT THIS VERY MOMENT and you say "Maybe you've got too much time on your hands."? Wow, way to double down after being proven way wrong. Oh and it wasn't too hard to check sweetwater.com and riffle through the pics a bit, doesn't take that much time, maybe it does for you, I dunno.
LOL, I love the projection dude, you were trolling from the jump and still are, I explained there were more than two examples and I also explained that it was my particular model I was looking up, not the entire catalog of fenders at Sweetwater. You belittled my experiences from the jump just like a troll so please don't project what you were doing on to me and then cry victim. Ignore away, I'll do the same.
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I don't care about your method or motivation. The evidence you uncovered is useful and helps this audience make informed decisions. Is it enough evidence to be considered statistically significant? Probably not. But it adds to the available data points, and that should be welcomed.How am I "combing through sweetwater..." when I just go to the search bar up top, type in the model I bought and click through the various colors and serial numbers looking at the pic with the headstock showing it's backside? I don't even have to click on it to see if it's missing screws or not. Is that tough for you, you don't know how to use search on a webpage? Well, bless your heart. Look, we get it, you are a Fender fanboy and their QC department still sucks, get over it.
FWIW my Ultra II seems like a good specimen. No QC issues at all from what I can tell. Just another data point.
I look at my model of P bass on sweetwater from time to time just to look at where the weights of the basses are going and to see if they've gotten better at putting all the screws into those $2k+ models and it's hilarious how often I find them lacking screws, there have been easily 10 or so I've seen over the past year easily. I think anyone that isn't a fanboy would admit forgetting the screws in your tuning key mounts amount to more than just a small little oopsie. I mean you can clearly see when you turn the bass around, I just had no idea it would be a problem on basses a few steps away from custom shop level production. It kinda disheartened me a bit but still I gotta admit, it's the best P bass I've ever picked up anywhere, I love it. QC and production aren't the same departments though obviously, will still buy Fender products, just gonna try them in the store first.
reopening to most, post cleanup. Disagreements are okay, insults aren't. Thanks.
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