I'm not mistaking price: for feasibility, function, sound, playability, or quality overall.
Range in value from 200 through 4k.
OP your premise is flawed.
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I'm not mistaking price: for feasibility, function, sound, playability, or quality overall.
Range in value from 200 through 4k.
OP your premise is flawed.
I already replied much earlier, but after reading several of the replies I wanted to add a few things. Your premise is based on the bass alone, but without a good amplifier you can have the most expensive and sought after bass on the planet it it's only going to sound so good. You want a bass to "sing", but 80% of the "singing" aspect of the sound is in the amp. Of course you need a bass with good sustain and clarity, but beyond that and pickup style its all comes down to amp. I discovered that for myself as after getting one (or two) new basses and a pickup upgrade (to Aguilars) I purchased my first THREE amps and returned two. Not that they all weren't at least decent. But the amp will inject so much of its personality in to the sound that completely outlines the parameters of the sound of any bass guitar. So while each guitar has it's own personality, it can only do as much as the amp will let it do.
Appreciate this. Ultimately I want to build a home studio but all the records I listen to the bass is dominate 45 rpm analog sounds like those old reggae records from the 50's and 60's. Watched a Canadian film yesterday called "Paper Years" and one of the key songs is Phyllis Dillon's "One Life to Live." I was so blown away not only the song but how it was used in the film. It changed my game plan completely. I think your emphasis on amplification may be paramount to actual bass. One of these Scott's Bass Lessons on YouTube did a comparison between a $100 jazz style bass from Amazon and an $11,000 Fodera. Convinced me some of the cheap-o's for my intent might be the absolute best route and research recording techniques.
I saw Scott's video and believe he is right. The dollar differences are far greater than the differences in sound quality. In fact, [I'm a gonna take heat for this] I stopped by GC with some time to kill tonight before closing and played a bunch of basses because I was the only one left in the store. The biggest disappointment was the Fender Elite ($2149). The biggest surprise was the Squier Affinity 5 string @ $229. To me the Affinity played better than the Elite and was surprisingly set up well for GC. It could use some better pickups for sure and maybe an Audere preamp, but some skilled hands and $200 extra cash could make that an absolute sleeper. But there are a ton of good basses around $500 where the next step up in quality jumps significantly.
Amps? If you don't need LOUD $300 you can get a killer amp. You could get a TCE BG250-12 or for $10 or $15 more you could get a Gallien-Kruger MB110 which is smaller than and louder than a Fender Rumble 100. Then again you can record direct into computer via an inexpensive interface.
Okay, I gotta address a couple things here…
For any "Fender Licensed Dealer", the prices are set by Fender themselves. More often than not the only time the store can alter the sticker price of an instrument is if it's lightly damaged, open-box, used or when FMIC authorizes them to apply a limited-time sale price.
As far as "these disposable beginner's models which should have never existed to begin with" are concerned, why should anyone…be it "little Timmy/Tammy" or someone who's decided to act upon their decades-long dream…be denied the ability to learn how to play music because an instrument costs more than a months, or several months, rent and food bill?
Leo Fender didn't chose the woods he used for his instruments because of some quasi-mystical list of intangibles. They were chosen because they were relatively easy to source and work with. Alder and maple? At that time, easy to get in California…and still are, if I'm not mistaken. To paraphrase one fellow TB'er, "They're made of wood that were once trees. Squirrels used to poop in them."
And as to this lil' gem…
Speaking as someone who's worked for years among the lower-ranks of the retail and video industry, the quality of a store's employees is a very, very "regional" thing. There are plenty of Guitar Centers, like my local store, that has a great crew of musicians and technicians filling their ranks. As for Mom & Pop stores, there's no guarantee of any magic residing there. One could staff a whiz-bang employee just as easily as some jerk who turns his nose up at anyone he perceives as knowing less than they do, kinda like this guy…
…and I'll bet we've all run into "that guy".
For any "Fender Licensed Dealer", the prices are set by Fender themselves. More often than not the only time the store can alter the sticker price of an instrument is if it's lightly damaged, open-box, used or when FMIC authorizes them to apply a limited-time sale price.
As far as "these disposable beginner's models which should have never existed to begin with" are concerned, why should anyone…be it "little Timmy/Tammy" or someone who's decided to act upon their decades-long dream…be denied the ability to learn how to play music because an instrument costs more than a months, or several months, rent and food bill?
Leo Fender didn't chose the woods he used for his instruments because of some quasi-mystical list of intangibles. They were chosen because they were relatively easy to source and work with. Alder and maple? At that time, easy to get in California…and still are, if I'm not mistaken. To paraphrase one fellow TB'er, "They're made of wood that were once trees. Squirrels used to poop in them."
And as to this lil' gem…
Speaking as someone who's worked for years among the lower-ranks of the retail and video industry, the quality of a store's employees is a very, very "regional" thing. There are plenty of Guitar Centers, like my local store, that has a great crew of musicians and technicians filling their ranks. As for Mom & Pop stores, there's no guarantee of any magic residing there. One could staff a whiz-bang employee just as easily as some jerk who turns his nose up at anyone he perceives as knowing less than they do, kinda like this guy…
…and I'll bet we've all run into "that guy".
Currently using a 2012 MIJ Fender Jazz Bass '62RI. My primary player, it's the best-sounding of all the basses I've owned so far.
Bought it new in 2013; it was my first Fender instrument at that point, and somewhat of an impulse purchase at my guitarist's insistence - I wasn't aware of tone at that point, merely got it for vintage vibes (and because my previous bass, an entry-level model, sucked big time). Used the Jazz regularly until 2015, when I foolishly sold it to fund the purchasing of another bass that I didn't exactly need (I was an indecisive idiot back then) and eventually started feeling the need for another 'standard' bass (i.e. 4 strings, passive).
I went around looking for a new Jazz Bass, tried a few - Mexican, Japanese, American, Squier, you name it - and the tones never really felt the same, so I didn't buy any of those. Needless to say, earlier this year I got the chance to recover the exact same bass I had before (and at half the price, luckily), and ultimately did so since the tone was practically calling out to me.
It's seriously all in the tone; try as many basses as possible, your ears will tell you when you've found the right one for you.
Bought it new in 2013; it was my first Fender instrument at that point, and somewhat of an impulse purchase at my guitarist's insistence - I wasn't aware of tone at that point, merely got it for vintage vibes (and because my previous bass, an entry-level model, sucked big time). Used the Jazz regularly until 2015, when I foolishly sold it to fund the purchasing of another bass that I didn't exactly need (I was an indecisive idiot back then) and eventually started feeling the need for another 'standard' bass (i.e. 4 strings, passive).
I went around looking for a new Jazz Bass, tried a few - Mexican, Japanese, American, Squier, you name it - and the tones never really felt the same, so I didn't buy any of those. Needless to say, earlier this year I got the chance to recover the exact same bass I had before (and at half the price, luckily), and ultimately did so since the tone was practically calling out to me.
It's seriously all in the tone; try as many basses as possible, your ears will tell you when you've found the right one for you.
You used to "dabble", "many years ago" and you want to get back into it. That's good but while you've been gone the world has changed.
From reading your post you seems to have a lot of "old" and now inaccurate ideas about bass guitars. Cheap basses are not bad basses anymore and I haven't seen a bass that's only good for "firewood" since I can't remember when.
You can spend from $200 to $20000 on a bass. You just have to try enough basses to decide where on that line you want to be. Going along that line I'd recommend you look at Sire, Fender, Lakland Skyline and the Sadowsky Metros.
Thank you for saying this. My thoughts exactly only I didn't feel like addressing it.Okay, I gotta address a couple things here…
For any "Fender Licensed Dealer", the prices are set by Fender themselves. More often than not the only time the store can alter the sticker price of an instrument is if it's lightly damaged, open-box, used or when FMIC authorizes them to apply a limited-time sale price.
As far as "these disposable beginner's models which should have never existed to begin with" are concerned, why should anyone…be it "little Timmy/Tammy" or someone who's decided to act upon their decades-long dream…be denied the ability to learn how to play music because an instrument costs more than a months, or several months, rent and food bill?
Leo Fender didn't chose the woods he used for his instruments because of some quasi-mystical list of intangibles. They were chosen because they were relatively easy to source and work with. Alder and maple? At that time, easy to get in California…and still are, if I'm not mistaken. To paraphrase one fellow TB'er, "They're made of wood that were once trees. Squirrels used to poop in them."
And as to this lil' gem…
Speaking as someone who's worked for years among the lower-ranks of the retail and video industry, the quality of a store's employees is a very, very "regional" thing. There are plenty of Guitar Centers, like my local store, that has a great crew of musicians and technicians filling their ranks. As for Mom & Pop stores, there's no guarantee of any magic residing there. One could staff a whiz-bang employee just as easily as some jerk who turns his nose up at anyone he perceives as knowing less than they do, kinda like this guy…
View attachment 3070460
…and I'll bet we've all run into "that guy".
Everything you said is true.
Budget basses used to only be good for firewood like 30 years ago, however quality have improved gradually throughout the years and budget basses today are actually of generally amazingly high quality considering the prices asked.
There are even some professionals that uses basses made in Mexico or Squier models.
The main problem with budget basses is not that they are of consistently bad quality, cause they are not, the problem is rather bad quality control, meaning that while quality is relatively consistently high with higher end basses, the quality of budget basses are all over the place ranging from crappy to amazing quality, although most budget basses will land in the decent quality category.
Budget basses however still usually uses cheap hardware and electronics, but that can be improved on, so if you have the chance of trying out basses before you buy you can pick out one of the gems among the budget basses, swap out the electronics and perhaps the hardware and get a bass that is fully on par with a higher end bass but considerably cheaper.
And no matter if you end up choosing a high end bass or a budget one I would personally get an Ibanez over a Fender any time.
Also are you buying a bass to play it or to resell it and earn money?
Cause I am sure there are better ways to make money.
And you must be delusional.
The prices on old Fenders does not reflect their actual level of quality in any way, it reflects that Fender is a popular brand with a lot of history that is interesting to collectors.
It's about nostalgia, history and value as a collectors item not about the actual value they got as instruments.
Just like people pay enormous prices for veteran cars that doesn't match their actual quality as cars.
As someone who used to be in the marketing business it surprises me that you fall flat for marketing hype yourself.
There are even some professionals that uses basses made in Mexico or Squier models.
The main problem with budget basses is not that they are of consistently bad quality, cause they are not, the problem is rather bad quality control, meaning that while quality is relatively consistently high with higher end basses, the quality of budget basses are all over the place ranging from crappy to amazing quality, although most budget basses will land in the decent quality category.
Budget basses however still usually uses cheap hardware and electronics, but that can be improved on, so if you have the chance of trying out basses before you buy you can pick out one of the gems among the budget basses, swap out the electronics and perhaps the hardware and get a bass that is fully on par with a higher end bass but considerably cheaper.
And no matter if you end up choosing a high end bass or a budget one I would personally get an Ibanez over a Fender any time.
Also are you buying a bass to play it or to resell it and earn money?
Cause I am sure there are better ways to make money.
And you must be delusional.
The prices on old Fenders does not reflect their actual level of quality in any way, it reflects that Fender is a popular brand with a lot of history that is interesting to collectors.
It's about nostalgia, history and value as a collectors item not about the actual value they got as instruments.
Just like people pay enormous prices for veteran cars that doesn't match their actual quality as cars.
As someone who used to be in the marketing business it surprises me that you fall flat for marketing hype yourself.
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Getting access to all these instruments for a hands-on experience is next to impossible. I won't purchase something I can't get my hands around and that's probably going to lead me to the Guitar Center/Sam Ash or classified route. I tried those routes before and they all led to huge disappointments. Not the prices so much but for lack of inspiration. Would I need to spend $20K on a fine instrument? No. I'd spend $20 if something felt good in my hands and had some sound to work with or I it.
OK. I mentioned a G&L JB. Might cover all bases, no pun intended -- price, sound, accuracy, electronics, craftsmanship. Maybe I'll find something far out at the local pawn shop but where I am the stuff is virtually all disposable junk. I want pride of ownership as well. When I whip it out ... and the bass, too, I want some sparkle in that shine.
If you can't try many basses are there bands playing locally who you can check out? What are their bassists are using? Maybe ask questions and start to build up a picture of current bass offerings.
There isn't one local player around here who can play the instrument to sell it, if you catch my meaning. I mean there are no bass artists here. The guys on all those records I grew up listening to -- how do I get close to a one to get to the hard stuff? How many great soul bassists are there? Dunn is dead. Rainey is an old man. Will Lee's off playing around the world. If I'm going to do this my goal is to play as good as these guys. Why compromise? This is discipline I'm after. A lifestyle. I need that kind or order and aesthetics in my life now while I still believe I can. Hard work ahead in a very deteriorated and disconnected America.
You need neither be surrounded by great players to be a great player yourself nor be in possession of a great instrument to sound great; any musician worth his salt will practice every single day of the week, regardless of who he's got around him or what instrument he has.
Relax!! IMO you're over thinking this. Every one compromises especially at the start of the long journey that is becoming a bass player. You don't need great gear to be a great player, you just need to put in the hours and develop a good technique. That's the one thing your shouldn't compromise on. For everything else you can build up to the "best". Anyway, you're idea of what is "best" will certainly change over time.
At the start of their careers, the guys you mention didn't worry about their gear. They just bought what they could afford, worked out how to get a good sound out of it, then played their butts off. Many people start on a Fender and nearly as many end on one. Very few players only play one bass their whole lives. I started on a used Framus Star Bass. That was all I could afford. After 2 years I bought a new Fender P bass. After another 25 years I bought a used Musicman SR5, now (after 50 years) I have my "best" a Sadowsky J5. I'm old now but I know most of my best playing was done on that "ordinary" P bass.
Gear is just stuff. I'd say that a Fender is a good starting point. If, after a few years, you think you've out grown it, that will be the time to decide what the next bass should be.
Anyway, be happy and enjoy your playing and you'll be a better player.
If I owned a vintage Fender, cir. 1962 - 3, I don't think I would grow out of it. My research into guys like Jamerson and Rainey they are synonymous with Leo's Fenders. Top of the line from the get-go because there were no slick Guitar Centers there to sell financed junk one would grow out of.
That being said if I could afford the all new EB MM Stingrays re-engineered from the ground up, weighing around 8.5 lbs, I could go for that. They're probably now the best production basses on the market. That would be an investment for life and that is what I want personally. Unfortunately I have a rich man's taste and a poor man's pocket. Maybe I'll just order some MIDI controller and and have some sequencer do all my playing....
That being said if I could afford the all new EB MM Stingrays re-engineered from the ground up, weighing around 8.5 lbs, I could go for that. They're probably now the best production basses on the market. That would be an investment for life and that is what I want personally. Unfortunately I have a rich man's taste and a poor man's pocket. Maybe I'll just order some MIDI controller and and have some sequencer do all my playing....
If it were made of Artisanal Firewood things would be very different on the used market.
