Fender Rumble Club

[Giffro]

If I were You, i'd start cranking master and lower the gain to match the volume.
I find the dynacomp circuit in the master "stage" very appealing with my r100c, so I almost always have my gain low, and master cranked. Note that I have ana active Yamaha bass, so YMMW.

Exactly how I ran my Peavey rig for 30 years and now my Rumble 500..about 9 oclock on the gain roughly but flat out on the master always..gives the best dynamics especially with my active basses.

 

[Kipp Harrington]

Slow at the draw here since I teach and it was the end of the semester.
Rehearsal room is about 12 x 20. No, I am not using any ear protection. We have rehearsal again today. Using the R500 head and both Rumble cabs (410 and 115)
This seems in-sainly loud to me. I have a Rumble 410v2 (4-ohm) which seems quite efficient and I have played small/small-medium outdoor shows pairing it with a Markbass Little Mark 250 (250w RMS/4-ohm) without PA support. How big is the rehearsal room? I hope you are wearing ear protection!

 

[Bottom Octave]

First couple of gigs with my Rumble 40. First one was in a fairly large mostly wood room with high ceilings and a larger room almost straight in the distance. Playing with a semi-acoustic trio (acoustic guitar, cajon, electric bass) Here is my Rumble 40 and Jazz bass after the first set.

View attachment 3631336

I started out with the EQ settings reflecting the "flat" settings posted in the Wiki. Playing fairly low volume and no real echo in the room. Generally a very good sounding room. However I did notice the bass dropped off a lot from low Gb and below. Jazz bass generally both pickups full with tone on 7-8. I started creeping the bass up a bit until it got a bit too muddy. I also increase the treble a bit to try to get a little snap to the notes. I tried various other settings with the low/high mids. Near the end of the 2nd set things got a little louder and I discovered just boosting the master volume a little bit really brought the low frequencies out so the bass control was turned down a bit. Anyway by the end of the night I got a reasonable sound but not quite want I wanted. I like to fit in the mix with a full-range sound but not come close to dominating. Anyway I would up with the EQ below.

View attachment 3631345

The next night played as a small restaurant with the same band. Much smaller space than the night before. Played around with the EQ quite a bit but nothing radical. Also tried having the EQ set to "flat" and using the contour and bright switch. This produced too much low-end so I switch off the contour switch but left the bright on for a short time. Sound got too thin so switched that off also. In the end I wound up very close to what I had at the end of the night before (above image).

So the R40 is more than capable for these types of shows. Note my Jazz has fairly low gain humbucking Bartolini pickups. I forget the model. I had them installed when I was having a hum problem in 1994. So the gain at 12 o'clock and the master at 9 o'clock indicates to me there was significant power to spare. However I have not really found the tone I am looking for when playing with a band. I will need to work on it some more. So far I like it and it fills the bill. Looking forward to tweaking it some more.

Keep in mind the psycho acoustic phenomenon reflected in the equal loudness contours, that our perception of bass frequencies (and to a lesser extent high frequencies) increases with amplitude: the louder it is, the more we hear the bass. As you turn up, the bass may need to be decreased, especially if you had boosted it in a lower volume situation. This is why film mixers, for example, never adjust the master level control on the mixing console once the levels in the room have been calibrated by the tech department to an appropriate reference level (e.g. 85 db(SPL) for a large room, 79 for a smaller "TV" mixing room). So there is no single EQ setting that will work well at all sound pressure levels.

Equal-loudness contour - Wikipedia

 

[bassdeal]

Yes very true. I believe this is what the loudness control on (at least old) stereos was designed for. I was just surprised by just a little volume increase affected the bass so much. In my head I mark the bass EQ control as "increase at your own risk".

 

[JakobT]

If I were You, i'd start cranking master and lower the gain to match the volume.
I find the dynacomp circuit in the master "stage" very appealing with my r100c, so I almost always have my gain low, and master cranked. Note that I have ana active Yamaha bass, so YMMW.

Seconded. The Delta-Comp limiter makes the Rumbles work differently than other amps, where you routinely boost the gain close to the clipping point before adjusting the master volume. With Rumbles the gain can be set at zero, and the amp will still work fine.

 

[Giffro]

Seconded. The Delta-Comp limiter makes the Rumbles work differently than other amps, where you routinely boost the gain close to the clipping point before adjusting the master volume. With Rumbles the gain can be set at zero, and the amp will still work fine.

My old Peavey rig had whats called DDT Compression..a form of clip limiting that worked very well to protect the speakers, but could drop your overhead back quite a bit sometimes when the DDT circuit cut in through high volume. Low gain to match bass input and master volume flat out..even the Peavey manual advised to run the amp that way for best results.
As you say Jakob the Fender Combos and heads work in a similar way and I find that if I run mine the same way as my old Peavey rig that gives the best dynamic sounding results.

 

[G-Dog]

.
Attention: Rumble Club Wiki Edit Alert!

Thank you, TalkBass Community, for your helpful threads. TB, your discussion of the proper volume potentiometer replacement on a newby's Rumble 500 combo has been linked on the Rumble Club Wiki page near the bottom of the Rumble Modifications section. This follows the current trend of the kind of valuable technical information we strive to capture on The Wiki for the benefit of all Rumblers.

I don't know if it's my own R500c warranty running out that makes me notice these topics more, or the over 5-year run of the original Rumble V3s that is bringing them out. For that matter, I wonder what the upcoming Winter NAMM show may bring from Fender Bass Amplification? The V1 Rumbles lasted 7 years. The much improved V2 Rumbles lasted just 4 years. January 2020 the V3 Rumbles will be 6 years old! Hmmm, . . . .

Thank you, TB, for your helpfulness!

Rumble On!​

.

 

[Bottom Octave]

My old Peavey rig had whats called DDT Compression..a form of clip limiting that worked very well to protect the speakers, but could drop your overhead back quite a bit sometimes when the DDT circuit cut in through high volume. Low gain to match bass input and master volume flat out..even the Peavey manual advised to run the amp that way for best results.
As you say Jakob the Fender Combos and heads work in a similar way and I find that if I run mine the same way as my old Peavey rig that gives the best dynamic sounding results.

By "overhead" do you mean dynamic headroom?

 

[Giffro]

By "overhead" do you mean dynamic headroom?

I couldnt "push" the amplifier (Peavey MKIV) any harder when DDT compression cut in...in other words up to the point of DDT activating, I had full control, and any increase of the bass guitar volume had an effect, but once DDT cut in any further volume increase of the bass was useless...the amp simply wouldnt go any louder due to this limiting feature protecting the speakers...its what I meant by headroom..there was none as such once the amp used its protection circuit. The amp was a very loud one as it was, but a lot of the time when I ran the old Peavey rig the DDT LED was on constantly. I never really complained about lack of volume but a tad more would have been comforting to know it was on hand if needed. DDT compression didnt allow any further volume increases. It was the whole purpose of the circuit. I usually compensated for volume with tone using the parametric tone mid controls and the 6 band graphic EQ to project the mids more which cut through the mix very well. I mainly ran a Peavey active Dynabass 5 string through it, but at times I also ran a passive Rickenbacker 4003 and a passive Fretless Maton JB4. All basses were at the "mercy" of the amp's DDT limiting circuit. I still own that rig and consider it one of the best "old school" amps I have ever used.

 

[Kipp Harrington]

Rehearsal report. Used my 500 head with both the 410 and 115. Gain was set around 2 o'clock and master at about 10-11.

EQ to taste and no Vintage button. It sounded absolutely awesome! Very happy now that I can keep up with these guys now. In fact, there were a couple of times I even had to back off a tad.

 

[CallMeAl]

Rehearsal report. Used my 500 head with both the 410 and 115. Gain was set around 2 o'clock and master at about 10-11.

EQ to taste and no Vintage button. It sounded absolutely awesome! Very happy now that I can keep up with these guys now. In fact, there were a couple of times I even had to back off a tad.

Nice! So what was different, adding the 15?

 

[bassdeal]

I couldnt "push" the amplifier (Peavey MKIV) any harder when DDT compression cut in...in other words up to the point of DDT activating, I had full control, and any increase of the bass guitar volume had an effect, but once DDT cut in any further volume increase of the bass was useless...the amp simply wouldnt go any louder due to this limiting feature protecting the speakers...its what I meant by headroom..there was none as such once the amp used its protection circuit. ...

Somewhat unrelated to this group but I had a very small business doing sound for bands (anyone remember the classic 4-rack space 60+ lbs CS800s?) and DDT was fantastic. I used a CS800 on my subs and I never had to worry about clipping the amp. Now back to our regularly scheduled program...

 

[Kipp Harrington]

Nice! So what was different, adding the 15?

Yep. I was using my Squier PJ (with SD QPs) for most of the songs. It sounded fat and punchy! I used my Squier FSR CV Precision for the few songs we do that are tuned down a half-step. There was a noticeable difference in "power" between the Precision (w/stock pups) and the PJ with the Duncans. Pretty sure Santa may bring me the Aguilar AG 4P HOT pups. Going to also get an orange drop cap, a couple CTS pots (what do you recommend for a P bass... 250k or 500k?), and a Switchcraft jack. Also getting a Tech 21 VT Bass Deluxe DI/preamp... love the tones this box has to offer, along with the availability to run to FOH.

 

[CallMeAl]

Yep. I was using my Squier PJ (with SD QPs) for most of the songs. It sounded fat and punchy! I used my Squier FSR CV Precision for the few songs we do that are tuned down a half-step. There was a noticeable difference in "power" between the Precision (w/stock pups) and the PJ with the Duncans. Pretty sure Santa may bring me the Aguilar AG 4P HOT pups. Going to also get an orange drop cap, a couple CTS pots (what do you recommend for a P bass... 250k or 500k?), and a Switchcraft jack. Also getting a Tech 21 VT Bass Deluxe DI/preamp... love the tones this box has to offer, along with the availability to run to FOH.

Nice! Glad to hear it’s working, and you have headroom to spare. Sounds like a pretty sweet setup coming your way...

people say use 500k, you can always cut treble but not add it. But all my Asian Basses came stock with 500k, and I like em better with 250s. It’s all personal, I guess if you're often turning your tone knob up, and treble EQ up past noon, you’d like 500s. (I’m willing to wager stock in both your Squiers is 500)

I also like to crank the gain (like 3:00) when vintage is off. Adds a little depth, fatness, without the tubby mud that vintage sometimes brings. Just out of curiosity, where did you set your EQ?

 

[Kipp Harrington]

Nice! Glad to hear it’s working, and you have headroom to spare. Sounds like a pretty sweet setup coming your way...

people say use 500k, you can always cut treble but not add it. But all my Asian Basses came stock with 500k, and I like em better with 250s. It’s all personal, I guess if you're often turning your tone knob up, and treble EQ up past noon, you’d like 500s. (I’m willing to wager stock in both your Squiers is 500)

I also like to crank the gain (like 3:00) when vintage is off. Adds a little depth, fatness, without the tubby mud that vintage sometimes brings. Just out of curiosity, where did you set your EQ?

I honestly don't remember! LOL. I think bass @ noon, low and high mids @ 2:30, treble @ 1, Vintage off and both horns on. My PJ is wearing flats so I thought the horns would "clear it up" a little... they did.

EDIT:

BTW, Alan... thanks for the info regarding the tone/volume pots. I wiil keep this in mind.

 

[Kipp Harrington]

all my Asian Basses came stock with 500k

Hey Alan... were those pots "mini" pots or standard size?

 

[evlwevl]

The very reason I was a bit worried upon ordering my Rumble 500C was the fact the drivers were only 2x10" so I also ordered an ext 115 cab on the same day...both units were delivered a week later and i am very glad I added the extra ext 15" cab...it really adds to the tone that I am used to...that extra bottom end I need for my 5 string basses. I ran my Peavey 1820 cab for 30+ years and know what 2x10" drivers are like alone without that 18" driver putting out the lower frequencies. In my opinion with the old Peavey rig the 2x10's sounded quite anemic without the 18" supplementing the sound...sooooo I was a bit worried when I ordered the 500 Combo that the 2x10" wouldnt give me a full sound for my 5 string basses and i was right in ordering the extra extension 15" cab..I am convinced the rig sounds full and there is no anemic tone coming from the rig combination of 2x10" + 1x15" cabs. Im very happy with my Rumble setup this way.
View attachment 3630906

I like that setup. I started with the rumble 100 which was great for practicing at home and at the rehearsal space which is small. It was perfect for our V-drum setup that we could control the Volume. Now that we we’ve transitioned to acoustic drums and the entire band raised its volumn, the R-100 wa being pushed to its upper limits and losing it’s low end. My R-800 head and R-4X10 cab arrived just before practice yesterday and at sounded amazing in that small space even at lower volume. Well soon be going outdoors to see what she can do. I may pair it with a 1X15 later for deeper bass. It’s not as heavy as I thought it would be compare to my small 15 watt bassbreaker amp with a single 12”

 

[GonePlaid]

Received the latest addition to my Rumble"collection"today. Now I gots a 100 to go with my 40, 200c, and 112 cab-and, of course, my B25. Pic of garage door and amps when it's daylight. I might sell the R40/custom cover* but there ain't no rush-'less somebody needs a Christmas present.
*not currently listed-thinking about it.

 

[GonePlaid]

Sometime tomorrow, in addition to a new 'amps@garage door' pic*, I'm gonna hook 'em all up:200c>112 + 200c efx send >100 efx return. Should sound rather amazing.

*pic weather permitting-it's raining here. This is our "dry" season.

 

[Giffro]

Received the latest addition to my Rumble"collection"today. Now I gots a 100 to go with my 40, 200c, and 112 cab-and, of course, my B25. Pic of garage door and amps when it's daylight. I might sell the R40/custom cover* but there ain't no rush-'less somebody needs a Christmas present.
*not currently listed-thinking about it.

You aught to take a nice midnight pic too GP of the collection in front of the garage door with the silvery sheen of a full moon shining its luna glow on that beloved backdrop of yours lol.