Finally played a Fender Pino P.... That's it?

[sloppy_phil]

A friend's band has a weekly show that isn't exactly an open jam, but if some musician friends of theirs make it out, chances are they'll be able to sit in for a few tunes. So I brought my bass with me, and went to check it out. Spoke to them after the first set, and they had a few tracks in the third set that we thought would be a good spot for me to sit in. Bass player said I could play his bass if I wanted, but I had mine, so politely declined. Well, second sets gets underway, and about 3 songs in, they call me up! I was caught unawares, so not wanting to take any more time to get up there and plug in, I just grabbed the bass on stage. Which, as it turned out, was a Fender CS Pino (w/La Bella DT flats). Cool! Plus a vintage Fender Bassman head, into an Aguilar 2x12. Mojo city, here we go!!

Got to play it for a few tunes, and while I undoubtedly enjoyed it, afterwards I was left wondering "That's it?". The no-finish neck was lovely, but whilst playing it I couldn't tell any difference from a basic Strat neck that I removed the gloss finish from. Action was nice and buttery, but not any better than I have on my CV70's Jazz, or MIM P. And it was a lovely, round and thick tone in that bass, but, especially in a live context, absolutely no different than any thump-forward P Bass I've ever played.

So what exactly does one get for the $6400 (Canada Bucks)? Make no mistake, it was a beautiful bass, and I was very pleased to play one, but I daresay there was nothing truly *exceptional* about it. I recognize that's probably an unpopular opinion, and I'm really not trying to bash anybody who owns one! It just seemed, in the heat of the moment when I'm mostly focused on making good music, that there wasn't anything about it that couldn't (likely) be achieved on any decently-made P. What am I missing?

 

[SteveC]

I haven't played one. I have a Roscoe Classic P ($1,999) that is an amazing bass. Fiesta red, tort guard, etc. It's my "Pino" bass. I'm sure the Fender Pino is a fantastic bass. I personally don't think there's a P bass out there that's worth $6K+ to me. After $2,500 - $3,500 I think you're paying for things that maybe don't make a huge difference in sound or playability.

 

[alembicbones]

I kind of think it's like fine wine. When you compare the nice ones to the uber-fine ones, the differences can be very subtle. At the end of the day, a Pino is a P bass. It's not some super tricked out, multi eq, coffee table top bass. However, if you want an amazing P, and as many attest to, the Pino delivers.

Bones

 

[droo46]

That's diminishing returns in a nutshell. $1000 seems to be the sweet spot for the best bass for the least money these days. Personally, I'm happy with my Squier "Pino" and it only ran me $250 when I picked it up 10 years ago.

 

[TrevorG]

Had a similar disappointment with the Jacko signature. Then I thought "what was I expecting"? All these guys with their own basses started out with the same basses that we buy. So you're getting a copy of a regular bass. Their idiosyncrasies are tiny in their differences to each other. And if a signature bass is made really well it might be better than the original… not sure you can still call that an exact reproduction. The extra cost, as far as I'm concerned, is the price of hero worship which isn't a bad thing if you agree it's worth the price.

 

[A9X]

Make no mistake, it was a beautiful bass, and I was very pleased to play one, but I daresay there was nothing truly *exceptional* about it.

Be thankful you got the experience on someone else's bass before you can into some play money, ordered one for yourself and got the same feeling. Then had to spend a lot of effort justifying the purchase to yourself. And everyone else.

 

[Bass Viking]

Had a similar disappointment with the Jacko signature. Then I thought "what was I expecting"? All these guys with their own basses started out with the same basses that we buy. So you're getting a copy of a regular bass.

Exactly. Jaco didn't need no stinkin' Custom Shop!

At the end of the day the Pino is still a P Bass, a simple and basic design without bells and whistles.

 

[LadyLoveStingRay5]

That's diminishing returns in a nutshell. $1000 seems to be the sweet spot for the best bass for the least money these days. Personally, I'm happy with my Squier "Pino" and it only ran me $250 when I picked it up 10 years ago.
View attachment 4473353

Exactly !!

 

[Koshchei]

At those prices, "worth" has a wholly different meaning. It's not about the features or construction anymore, unless you're getting something like an Alembic (which arguably has the five figures worth of labour packed into the construction), but rather the exclusivity and "aura" of having a thing that's as close to a duplicate of the artist's that you can get, and that nobody else can afford. But it's still just a P Bass.

 

[luciens]

Had a similar disappointment with the Jacko signature. Then I thought "what was I expecting"? All these guys with their own basses started out with the same basses that we buy. So you're getting a copy of a regular bass. Their idiosyncrasies are tiny in their differences to each other. And if a signature bass is made really well it might be better than the original… not sure you can still call that an exact reproduction. The extra cost, as far as I'm concerned, is the price of hero worship which isn't a bad thing if you agree it's worth the price.

Exactly. You get a P bass for the $6400. Or a Jazz bass without the frets on it in the case of the Jaco for about $2000....

You have to manage your expectations accordingly. They are what they are, and that's a good thing.

Speaking of the Jaco Artist, I have two of them. When I first got the first one, the honeymoon lasted about 2 minutes. After that I realized that it was, well, it was a Jazz bass. With a nicely done FL fingerboard and P bass knobs on it, but it was more or less a 1962 Jazz bass, with the sticky/sieze-ey reverse tuners and everything... .

Course, the more I play it, the more I love it for a totally inappropriate specialty - P bass imitation on the neck PU. With the Fender flats on it and the neck PU soloed, it gives a very nice, papery, grunty funk machine kind of tone that I'm enjoying more and more as I play with it. To sound like Jaco is nominally the reason for this bass, but I've been pleasantly surprised that it does other Jazz bass-ey things with a surprising kind of twist to them.

Speaking of P basses, I have the Tony Franklin, which is the first P/J I've ever actually owned. It's the freak nastiest, YOLO!, rope-slappin-on-a-table sounding P bass ever made, but at the end of the day, it's a P bass. And when I'm not specifically trying to pump the skank out of it, it will settle down and sound like a regular old ordinary P bass.

As for CS Fenders, they're P and J basses too, so one should expect a P or J bass experience with one of those as well, I would imagine (never had the pleasure of trying a CS so...).

L

 

[sotua]

Same experience here with USA MM Stringray5 HH. It felt nice, and was obviously better finished than the Sterling one, but it didn't feel two thousand dollars better than the Sterling 5 HH that was hanging just beside it.

 

[rojo412]

This is the majority of the expense:

 

[Killing Floor]

It's a classic color and Pino is famous amongst bass players. Just like a Jaco bass is the same as a regular Jazz bass fretless. Are you asking why it costs more? Same reason a Lebron James jersey costs more than a Wayne Ellington jersey.

 

[smtp4me]

A friend's band has a weekly show that isn't exactly an open jam, but if some musician friends of theirs make it out, chances are they'll be able to sit in for a few tunes. So I brought my bass with me, and went to check it out. Spoke to them after the first set, and they had a few tracks in the third set that we thought would be a good spot for me to sit in. Bass player said I could play his bass if I wanted, but I had mine, so politely declined. Well, second sets gets underway, and about 3 songs in, they call me up! I was caught unawares, so not wanting to take any more time to get up there and plug in, I just grabbed the bass on stage. Which, as it turned out, was a Fender CS Pino (w/La Bella DT flats). Cool! Plus a vintage Fender Bassman head, into an Aguilar 2x12. Mojo city, here we go!!

Got to play it for a few tunes, and while I undoubtedly enjoyed it, afterwards I was left wondering "That's it?". The no-finish neck was lovely, but whilst playing it I couldn't tell any difference from a basic Strat neck that I removed the gloss finish from. Action was nice and buttery, but not any better than I have on my CV70's Jazz, or MIM P. And it was a lovely, round and thick tone in that bass, but, especially in a live context, absolutely no different than any thump-forward P Bass I've ever played.

So what exactly does one get for the $6400 (Canada Bucks)? Make no mistake, it was a beautiful bass, and I was very pleased to play one, but I daresay there was nothing truly *exceptional* about it. I recognize that's probably an unpopular opinion, and I'm really not trying to bash anybody who owns one! It just seemed, in the heat of the moment when I'm mostly focused on making good music, that there wasn't anything about it that couldn't (likely) be achieved on any decently-made P. What am I missing?

I've never owned a CS bass or guitar, nor a master-built CS. So based on my opinion only without any experience, I would guess the difference is in the quality of components, the attention to detail, and the high level of craftsmanship. There may or may not be a notable difference in sound.

Another benefit would be to get exactly what you want, if you do a custom order.

If I were a professional musician making enough to justify the extra $$$, I would probably get one.

 

[JeezyMcNuggles]

A friend's band has a weekly show that isn't exactly an open jam, but if some musician friends of theirs make it out, chances are they'll be able to sit in for a few tunes. So I brought my bass with me, and went to check it out. Spoke to them after the first set, and they had a few tracks in the third set that we thought would be a good spot for me to sit in. Bass player said I could play his bass if I wanted, but I had mine, so politely declined. Well, second sets gets underway, and about 3 songs in, they call me up! I was caught unawares, so not wanting to take any more time to get up there and plug in, I just grabbed the bass on stage. Which, as it turned out, was a Fender CS Pino (w/La Bella DT flats). Cool! Plus a vintage Fender Bassman head, into an Aguilar 2x12. Mojo city, here we go!!

Got to play it for a few tunes, and while I undoubtedly enjoyed it, afterwards I was left wondering "That's it?". The no-finish neck was lovely, but whilst playing it I couldn't tell any difference from a basic Strat neck that I removed the gloss finish from. Action was nice and buttery, but not any better than I have on my CV70's Jazz, or MIM P. And it was a lovely, round and thick tone in that bass, but, especially in a live context, absolutely no different than any thump-forward P Bass I've ever played.

So what exactly does one get for the $6400 (Canada Bucks)? Make no mistake, it was a beautiful bass, and I was very pleased to play one, but I daresay there was nothing truly *exceptional* about it. I recognize that's probably an unpopular opinion, and I'm really not trying to bash anybody who owns one! It just seemed, in the heat of the moment when I'm mostly focused on making good music, that there wasn't anything about it that couldn't (likely) be achieved on any decently-made P. What am I missing?

It's a bass bro. Body, neck, pickups, strings. Bass.
Was it nice?
Did it do the job?
Did it sound like a bass?
...yes

Do you want to buy one?
Will one make you play better?

...no

 

[shojii]

So much collective wisdom and truth in this thread. The bones of the corporate marketing model are laid bare....Thank you TB'ers

 

[Pings Bass]

Law of diminishing returns. Every dollar you spend above, say $1-2k is going to produce a smaller return in intrinsic value.

The problem isn't that CS instruments aren't good enough, but that mid- high-end production instruments are too good to justify the price difference. For me anyway. YMMV.

 

[GreyBeard]

You have discovered the law of diminishing returns. Once you hit a certain price point say $1,000 American, the increase in tone, fit/finish, and playability becomes minimal and the buyer is paying for maybe country of origin, hand made vs mass produced or even something intangible that is personal to the them. I would be willing to bet that no one would notice or care if you showed up at a band audition with a Player p-bass vs a Pino p-bass. But, believe me when I say that the person that thoughtfully plunks down $6K+ for a Pino knows exactly why they paid that much and should not have to justify it to anyone. Well maybe the wife...........lol

 

[_godspeed_]

You have discovered the law of diminishing returns. Once you hit a certain price point say $1,000 American, the increase in tone, fit/finish, and playability becomes minimal and the buyer is paying for maybe country of origin, hand made vs mass produced or even something intangible that is personal to the them. I would be willing to bet that no one would notice or care if you showed up at a band audition with a Player p-bass vs a Pino p-bass.

Big Pino fan here. Got a Squier Classic Vide in 2011, played it for a while. Fantastic bass for the money! In 2015 I've got my first nitro-finished bass and I absolutely fell in love with that "feel". I knew that it had pretty much no effect on the tone, but it felt more "natural" to me. Since then I went on a hunt to get a Pino-like P that won't cost me an arm & a leg, so 62' AVRI in Fiesta Red was THE BASS. Took me quite a while to find one, but I managed to grab one from Classifieds a few years ago. Definitely the next level from Classic Vibe. I have no doubt Pino CS is better, but the difference in this case won't be significant

 

[GeneralElectric]

Its good because its the closest you can really get to a 60s P-bass without actually having a 60s P-bass.

Personally I like vintage styled instruments, but don't exactly like vintage instruments. I would feel more comfortable playing a Pino than a real 63 P-bass.