Finding motivation and practicing ideas

[Lobster11]

Hey guys!
My name is Justin, I'm pretty new to this site, but I thought I'd post about a predicament I've been in for quite a while now. I'm still in highschool in the Chicago area, and I've been playing electric and upright bass for about 7 years now. I've been naturally a pretty good musician for all of this time and I've never really had the drive or motivation to really practice. I made district for jazz without any preparation last year, and this year I went in with the same attitude and didn't make it at all. It really took a blow to my confidence in my playing and for some reason I can't find the drive to improve my playing still. I really care and love playing music, but I don't even really know where to start with practice especially for jazz stuff since I never really did. It sounds stupid but I really am lost and I'm looking for some guidance as to where to start. I'd greatly appreciate if anyone is able to talk to me about it, because I'm becoming tired of being complacent with my playing and I really want to take a step in the right direction!

I just want to congratulate you on the fact that recognizing your own natural talent seems to have made you humble rather than arrogant. I think that's awesome; it doesn't usually happen that way. Good luck!

 

[Wfrance3]

Maybe you are in a spot where you know what you know and don't see any depth or dimension to your current skill set and can't quite get your arms around what to do to get you to the next level. I don't know if this is too basic, and it's not free:
The Practice Accelerator
I sold an couple pedals and ponied up. For me it's gotten me off dead center. I taught myself and left lots of holes in my education. I can do some decently flashy stuff, but it's (very) limited. My foundation is bad. No way a video course will do what an actual live instructor will do, but for what it is, I've been pleased.

 

[Russell L]

Yeah I totally see what you mean. I think I really just need to find some serious motivation to get practicing. I get bummed out knowing that I'm not doing enough to improve myself, which inherently makes me not want to do anything, including playing in general. It's kind of a reoccurring cycle that I need to break soon. That's kinda the really big issue that I have now. I don't know if there is a way to really find that sort of drive to get better other than really pushing myself to do it even if I may not feel like it at that time. Thank you for your help!

Mental depression works like that, too.

If you want motivation, sometimes what is needed is to get your butt whupped good. If you plan on getting into jazz in college, it might just be the fertile battleground for such a whupping. The first thing you'll notice is how many players are better than you. Then comes assignments that are difficult. Then, when you either get a bad grade or don't get picked for something, your stunned arse will have an epiphany.

Or not, in which case you will likely remain just as you are.

 

[BassChuck]

......I've been naturally a pretty good musician for all of this time and I've never really had the drive or motivation to really practice.
......It really took a blow to my confidence in my playing and for some reason I can't find the drive to improve my playing still.
.......I really care and love playing music,

You may not like this response. (you don't have to read it)
I've taught music for over 40 years. Some of my students have gone on to have professional careers, many more continue to play music for their hobby and enjoyment. Frankly most have taken their talents to other fields.
I've outlined some of your comments as important and I would suggest you think them over carefully.
If you consider yourself a 'naturally pretty good musician' but 'never had the drive...to really practice' I would suppose that you are in a situation that makes you pretty much the best player in the room. This is often the case with high school. You've never had or needed to put yourself in a competitive place for attention to your talent. Then as you stepped out of the world and dealt with other players you lost, and this was a 'blow to your confidence' (which by the way was based on the way other people saw you, not from the hard work you had done).
Lastly, and this is the really important one, You claim to 'care and love playing music'. My question would be, then why aren't you working to be your best. (Chicago has a lot of great musicians, do you listen to them, when you do, do you plan how you can reach the same level?) Many of the high school students I taught were very successful in their HS years and so they planned to go into music. The question I would pose to them was, "is there any thing else you can do well?" If they answered that there was, I encouraged them to pursue that as a profession and use music as a hobby.
Things to think about.

 

[equill]

This reminds me when I was younger and I was also a very good student (not in music, but that's besides the point) without having to work at it at all. The first time this stops working (and it almost always will at some point) it was really surprising and disconcerting. Sort of an insult from the world. Until then I was sort of "gifted by nature" to be good at what I do, and suddenly I lost this... ***!

When I write "surprise" - this isn't a joke. This was the first time I actually became good at something by being diligent and persistent. It was a revelation.

Good to hear from somebody else with this experience.
Being naturally the brightest kid in the class turned out to be a curse and a handicap in the long term. It was a genuine shock to discover things that I couldn't understand and assimilate on contact.

 

[J_Bass]

There are no best at anything without some serious work or study, no matter the field.

Researchers, doctors, musicians, athletes, etc.. You see in all those cases there is some natural talent, but there is a lot more work and a lot of sacrifice.

You have reached your natural limit. And know it's time to study, to really work to be better. Because there are thousands of talented guys like you. The ones who want it more and work for that are going to be the top guys. Happens to all of us.

As we say in my country, "Em terra de cegos, quem tem um olho é Rei." In a land of blind people, he who has one eye is King.

 

[Douhboi]

I just wanted to thank you all for the advice and perspectives that you have shared with me. I really appreciate it and all of you guys gave me truly great comments. I didn't think I'd get nearly this much support for just one post here, but you all proved me wrong! Everyone has given me a whole bunch to think about now both playing wise and mentality wise, and I sincerely can't thank you all enough for that. I hope to see you all around soon on this site!

 

[Douhboi]

You may not like this response. (you don't have to read it)
I've taught music for over 40 years. Some of my students have gone on to have professional careers, many more continue to play music for their hobby and enjoyment. Frankly most have taken their talents to other fields.
I've outlined some of your comments as important and I would suggest you think them over carefully.
If you consider yourself a 'naturally pretty good musician' but 'never had the drive...to really practice' I would suppose that you are in a situation that makes you pretty much the best player in the room. This is often the case with high school. You've never had or needed to put yourself in a competitive place for attention to your talent. Then as you stepped out of the world and dealt with other players you lost, and this was a 'blow to your confidence' (which by the way was based on the way other people saw you, not from the hard work you had done).
Lastly, and this is the really important one, You claim to 'care and love playing music'. My question would be, then why aren't you working to be your best. (Chicago has a lot of great musicians, do you listen to them, when you do, do you plan how you can reach the same level?) Many of the high school students I taught were very successful in their HS years and so they planned to go into music. The question I would pose to them was, "is there any thing else you can do well?" If they answered that there was, I encouraged them to pursue that as a profession and use music as a hobby.
Things to think about.

I read your comment (obviously), I think you honestly hit the nail on the head here for my situation. I'm definitely at a point on whether or not to decide on if it's really a hobby or my passion, and obviously I still have time. I know I will play in college for sure, so like some other people said, with the level of competition at college it might be the thing that pushes me the most. You were right that I never really had to deal with competitiveness, but I think that may be a good thing for me soon. Thanks for your insight, it was extremely helpful!

 

[Douhboi]

Mental depression works like that, too.

If you want motivation, sometimes what is needed is to get your butt whupped good. If you plan on getting into jazz in college, it might just be the fertile battleground for such a whupping. The first thing you'll notice is how many players are better than you. Then comes assignments that are difficult. Then, when you either get a bad grade or don't get picked for something, your stunned arse will have an epiphany.

Or not, in which case you will likely remain just as you are.

After reading these comments, I think competition might really be a good wake up call. College will definitely make that a reality! I've struggled with depression for a long time, and that is definitely a contributor in my lack of motivation. Thanks for the insight!

 

[Douhboi]

Maybe you are in a spot where you know what you know and don't see any depth or dimension to your current skill set and can't quite get your arms around what to do to get you to the next level. I don't know if this is too basic, and it's not free:
The Practice Accelerator
I sold an couple pedals and ponied up. For me it's gotten me off dead center. I taught myself and left lots of holes in my education. I can do some decently flashy stuff, but it's (very) limited. My foundation is bad. No way a video course will do what an actual live instructor will do, but for what it is, I've been pleased.

I'll definitely consider it, but being a highschooler I might be out of luck in the money department. I watch Scott's bass lessons on YouTube so I know it's a good resource to take advantage of. When I get some money I'll definitely try checking it out, and thanks for the recommendation!

 

[Michael Case]

Have you done any transcription? What do you work on with your teacher? If it's classical then don't switch teachers, keep studying legit and study jazz through transcription and listening. How often do you go to jam sessions? How many standards do you know both the melody and changes to? How is your reading? There is a lot you can do to improve. Here is a link from the DB side of Talkbass. REALLY Learning a tune

 

[Douhboi]

I just want to congratulate you on the fact that recognizing your own natural talent seems to have made you humble rather than arrogant. I think that's awesome; it doesn't usually happen that way. Good luck!

Thank you for the compliment! Being cocky won't get me anything and I by no means have mastered bass yet. I've been around some friends who were kind of arrogant and saw it didn't do anything, and being in the position I'm in now, I need some advice. Thankfully this site gave me that opportunity to me. And thanks for the encouragement!

 

[Douhboi]

Have you done any transcription? What do you work on with your teacher? If it's classical then don't switch teachers, keep studying legit and study jazz through transcription and listening. How often do you go to jam sessions? How many standards do you know both the melody and changes to? How is your reading? There is a lot you can do to improve. Here is a link from the DB side of Talkbass. REALLY Learning a tune

I can say I've done very little with transcription, however I know I can do it well so I definitely should start. Fortunately I have a pretty good ear! I think this thread will be a great reference for me to guide me in doing it properly. Thanks for the advice, I would not have thought about doing transcription on my own anytime soon!

 

[Douhboi]

forget a teacher , actually.

Honestly I see you are listing reasons NOT to do the work.
Progress doesn't happen when you are mentally distracted by past failure or paralyzed by future choices
It happens when you stop mental chatter and actually do something
It doesn't matter what the first step is, it only matters that you take the step

Pick a song and learn it. Repeat.

Perhaps consult Jocko.

Great advice, and I definitely should consult more Jaco as everyone else should. Thanks!

 

[Douhboi]

were you given reasons or feedback ?

The reason people say "get a teacher" is because observation and conversation is needed to assess where you are actually at with your playing. Without that all we can say is stuff like:
play lots of jazz
play lots of jazz with others
Use Ed Friedland's book
practice
etc...

all 100% true but how applicable to your current needs is hard to evaluate
so, get a teacher.

Unfortunately I wasn't given any feedback, since it's district auditions they are totally blind. I was feeling pretty nervous in there for some reason (probably because I was expecting too much from myself) which didn't help my case. Many people have said stuff about Ed Friedland's book, so I'll definitely be checking that out. Thank you so much!

 

[Douhboi]

+1 to the 'get a teacher' backers.

as I said in another recent reply to thread. "If I had it to do over (and I Dont, so..) I would vicariously tell my high school self -now you- to" ...

Do the Grunt work. its worth it.

Learn your Fret board and Maj/Min, Pentatonic and Blues scales.
Spend time learning to read music (at this tender age you don't realize the foundation it can provide for you in the future if you keep at it). if someone calls out a key center you need to know where it is on the bass.

Do some ear training
get yourself a small keyboard. even basic keyboard knowledge (again reading will help with this) has a way of laying out scales that stringed instruments cant replicate. plus you get a bounty of ear training on interval and chord qualities, etc, the like.
and join a jam/garage band and play. playing should be fun, so find fun songs and play them even if its not your primary instrument.

a condensed story;
I had joined a band in High School. I put in a ton of practice time, but I was not 'play out' ready yet. (did not have my own instrument yet, and the one I was borrowing the kid wanted back) So they had a girl who played bass fill in for that gig. It burned me to my core that I wasn't 'good enough' to play the songs that I had worked so hard to get the chance to play! So, I made a vow that I would never let anyone else get the chance to 'sit in' for me unless I was injured or something along those lines. I saved my cash and bought a Fender P and a small amp so the -no bass thing- was no longer a hindrance either. It was a small event that was a few hours long, but it resonated in my motivational engine. It kinda still does after writing this, lol. but I am glad I had to endure that growth process. I don't think I would be as good as I am now if I wasn't 'benched' that first gig.

hopefully all of that babbling makes some sense. and more importantly helps you (as well as a few others) out.

All of your thoughts were very helpful! I think that having some sort of competition might be a factor in really pushing me, like how it was for you. I think I just got too depressed after failure, and it still lingers a bit, but time will tell. The rest of the tips on what to start grinding out were very helpful as well, thank you!

 

[Douhboi]

Welcome to TalkBass!!!!!


You're a somewhat educated musician. You clearly have a good ear and some chops.


What you need is PASSION for what you're playing. Learn some music YOU love, not music you're "SUPPOSED" to learn.

There will be techniques in this new music you haven't used up until now. When you hit a wall, research it, study it, and practice THAT skill that will help you learn YOUR favorite music.

Your interest in, and passion for, the music will drive you to keep going.

Once you get some time in learning your favorite music, find some like-minded people and MAKE that music. If the urge strikes you guys, WRITE some music in the same vein with your own spin on it.

Fun and passion have to come into play at some point. Otherwise, why bother.

Glad you found us. Best of luck with it.

I'm glad I found you guys too! I think you're right that I really need to get more fun and passion to improve. I've definitely have been kinda depressed recently (for other reasons) which does hinder me a little. However, I think the music can help me manage this more, I just need to push myself to do it. Thanks for your insight!