Finding tabs, or improvising?

[Minotauros]

For guitar I use Ultimate Guitar, for the most part. Some chord sheets are really pretty good, others are "why did this person even bother?" quality.

I occasionally see bass tabs. And since I don't yet have or play bass, I haven't paid too much attention to what songs include the bass tabs.

For songs that you just can't find a tab, do you improvise a bassline to be as close to what you hear as possible?

For example, Leon Russell's Magic Mirror is out of print. Can't find any Leon Russell sheet music or books (just a chord sheet for Tightrope @ UG). My teacher and I have been listening to the recording and tabbing out the song as close as we can (it's piano I want to play on guitar).

And what if you can't yet play by ear, a beginner for example (like me! )? Someone told me that a bassline could be improvised ala a guitarist using a pentatonic scale over a chord progression for an improvised solo. I wonder what that would do to the song.

 

[klokker]

For songs that you just can't find a tab, do you improvise a bassline to be as close to what you hear as possible?

That's what I do, but I'm in a cover band of course. I'm not saying tabs are bad, but I just can't stand them. I've spent a lot of time in the beginning learning to hear, copy and memorize basslines to our cover songs as much as possible. Then, over time, I improvise on them a little to fit our band, create a groove because our instrumentation is often different from the original (we're just bass, guitar, drummer and singer). I think its a great skill, good for ear development. Sometimes I add, sometimes subtract.

Ear training has been the key for me in all my playing. Learning to listen to what other people do expands your ability to improvise and be creative. You can do tabs, nothing against them (I just can't stand them), but I think its much easier and more fun to just do it by ear. Plus, so many tabs, as you have discovered are terrible.

 

[Minotauros]

That's good to know. I know that it's very near impossible to play the way the original artists did, and I don't know that any serious musician wants to. I think a large part of the fun in playing is putting a lot or some of yourselves into the song.

Thanks.

 

[klokker]

Someone told me that a bassline could be improvised ala a guitarist using a pentatonic scale over a chord progression for an improvised solo. I wonder what that would do to the song.

Pentatonic scales are basic to bass playing, especially if you do rock, country stuff, and you can do tons of "filler" stuff with it. You'd really benefit from learning that scale, getting the sound in your head, and fiddling around with it in different positions on the fretboard. Good for your ear and technique.

 

[smeet]

For songs that you just can't find a tab, do you improvise a bassline to be as close to what you hear as possible?

That's a good start, and for many songs that will be good enough. As your ear gets better, your improvisations will start to get closer and closer to the actual line in the song. If you want them to, of course. I like to learn the original lines. Then I can change them as much as I want.

And what if you can't yet play by ear, a beginner for example (like me! )? Someone told me that a bassline could be improvised ala a guitarist using a pentatonic scale over a chord progression for an improvised solo. I wonder what that would do to the song.

That's quite a generalization... You have to use your ear to determine what works on a given song. It never hurts to know some theory either. Start out simple and start figuring out the bass lines to some easy songs you like. You will quickly get better. If possible, write down what you figure out in standard notation. The first couple will be hard. By the time you do a few songs, your ear will be vastly improved.

 

[klokker]

If possible, write down what you figure out in standard notation. The first couple will be hard. By the time you do a few songs, your ear will be vastly improved.

+1. I forgot that I actually did that a few times (write the part out in standard notation).

Your also right IME that if you can just hang in there with it, don't give up, after a few songs your ear and memory of what you hear WILL be much better.

 

[ThisisCraigP]

Bassmasta.net is a pretty good site for bass tabs. But be sure to listen to the song while looking at the tab to see if it's right.

 

[Minotauros]

Pentatonic scales are basic to bass playing, especially if you do rock, country stuff, and you can do tons of "filler" stuff with it. You'd really benefit from learning that scale, getting the sound in your head, and fiddling around with it in different positions on the fretboard. Good for your ear and technique.

I figured pentatonic scales were very much a part of bass playing.

When I first started taking guitar lessons, my teacher was leaning towards teaching pentatonic scales and soloing. But I prefer rhythm. I have no intention of lead or soloing. So I could never quite get my head wrapped around positions 2-5. I only ever memorized the first position. We did some improv, him doing a chord progression and me playing in the pentatonic box. It was fun.

Now, having become interested in bass I know that it will be important to know the pentatonic scales. And I know there is no trick or easy way to get to know the boxes except to simply memorize and practice them.

 

[Minotauros]

That's a good start, and for many songs that will be good enough. ...

Good. Then you realize you can do it a little better. I do that now with a song on the guitar. Start out simple and maybe crappy, and improve as you go along.

That's quite a generalization... You have to use your ear to determine what works on a given song. It never hurts to know some theory either. Start out simple and start figuring out the bass lines to some easy songs you like. You will quickly get better. If possible, write down what you figure out in standard notation. The first couple will be hard. By the time you do a few songs, your ear will be vastly improved.

Generalization, yes. The answer was in the context of a curiosity question, my knowing almost nothing about bass. I can see though, that you wouldn't just make something up as you go along. You might be using all the right notes, but so totally out of order and unlike the original as to really screw it up, I guess.

 

[Minotauros]

Bassmasta.net is a pretty good site for bass tabs. But be sure to listen to the song while looking at the tab to see if it's right.

Thanks. I'll check it out.

Now, unless I am totally whacked out, and I'm almost embarassed to show such newbieness is there any reason I couldn't play some bass riffs and do a little noodling around on the EADG strings of my 6-strings? I know it's an octave higher, but the notes are the same.

 

[smeet]

is there any reason I couldn't play some bass riffs and do a little noodling around on the EADG strings of my 6-strings?

Not at all. I believe a lot of well-known bass players started out that way. The technique will be a bit different, but you can start thinking and listening like a bass player.

 

[Minotauros]

That's great. It should be fun, and I'll learn something.

 

[MalcolmAmos]

For songs that you just can't find a tab, do you improvise a baseline to be as close to what you hear as possible?

Yes. I never mess with tab, instead ..........

The baseline is normally left up to you as to what will fit this specific song the best. Which begs the question how do you decide what the baseline will have in it. OK first things first - how about the good ole major scale on the bass fretboard -- yep, the bottom 4 strings of your 6 string are the same:

Root on the 4th string
G|---2---|-------|---3---|---4---| 1st string
D|---6---|-------|---7---|---8---|
A|---3---|---4---|-------|---5---|
E|-------|---1---|--------|---2---|4th string

Root on the 3rd string - notice where the 1-4-5 are. Is that convenient or what.
G|---6---|-------|---7---|---8---| 1st string
D|---3---|---4---|-------|---5---|
A|-------|---1----|-------|---2---|
E|-------|---5----|-------|---6---|4th string

Where is the 5th in relation to the root (1)? Up a string and over two. Where is the 3rd? Up a string and back one. Notice it's like that all over your fretboard. OK onward...

I've got 6 or 7 basic generic riffs in my bag of tricks - the pentatonic scale is one of them. Some of the others are:
Root nothing
R-5 --Up a string and over two
R-5-8 -- Up a string over two then up a string
R-4-5 --Up a string then over two -- or if the root is on the 3rd string - up a string then down two strings
R-3-5-3
R-3-5-7
R-R-3-3-5-5-6-5
OK you get the picture. I listen to the song and decide which riff will work best - it's a feel thing - you just have to work at it. Pick the riff you think will work best and then move it with the chord changes. If a Root nothing is not cutting it move to something else AND if you are having trouble picking up the chord changes THEN the pentatonic R-2-3-5-6 is a safe bet. Now just running the pentatonic note for note may not be the best thing to do, put some rhythm into it, repeat some notes, etc. It's a feel thing.

Let Google call up some backing tracks and yes use your 6 string and work up some baseline riffs and play along.

C-F-G with a R-5 base line would be my choice. I had a little trouble picking out the chord changes on this one and tried the major pentatonic R-2-3-5-6 but felt it was in competition with the lead guitar so went back to a R-5. Like I said it's a feel thing.

Get your 5 or 6 favorite riffs into muscle memory experiment with different baselines - just listen to the song the baseline will fall into place - with practice.

Welcome to bass.

 

[Minotauros]

Yes. I never mess with tab, instead ..........

The baseline is normally left up to you as to what will fit this specific song the best. Which begs the question how do you decide what the baseline will have in it. OK first things first - how about the good ole major scale on the bass fretboard -- yep, the bottom 4 strings of your 6 string are the same:

Root on the 4th string
G|---2---|-------|---3---|---4---| 1st string
D|---6---|-------|---7---|---8---|
A|---3---|---4---|-------|---5---|
E|-------|---1---|--------|---2---|4th string

Root on the 3rd string - notice where the 1-4-5 are. Is that convenient or what.
G|---6---|-------|---7---|---8---| 1st string
D|---3---|---4---|-------|---5---|
A|-------|---1----|-------|---2---|
E|-------|---5----|-------|---6---|4th string

Where is the 5th in relation to the root (1)? Up a string and over two. Where is the 3rd? Up a string and back one. Notice it's like that all over your fretboard. OK onward...

I've got 6 or 7 basic generic riffs in my bag of tricks - the pentatonic scale is one of them. Some of the others are:
Root nothing
R-5 --Up a string and over two
R-5-8 -- Up a string over two then up a string

^^ R-5 and R-5-8: Power chords, aka "5" chords. I use them occasionally even on my acoustic guitar. I don't like distortion and even play my electric clean. I almost always play them R-5-8. The octave gives a little more "zing" to an otherwise sometimes dark chord. Power chords: Not Just For Distortion Anymore. They work nicely if given a chance.

I play this section of Come Together (one of theee most fun songs, imho) this way:

G5 (1x & rest)

One thing I can tell you is you got to be free

B5 (6x) A5 (3x)) G5 (4x) A5 (1x)

Come together...... right now………… over me

(sorry for the display size and poor alignment, but you get the idea)

R-4-5 --Up a string then over two -- or if the root is on the 3rd string - up a string then down two strings
R-3-5-3
R-3-5-7
R-R-3-3-5-5-6-5
OK you get the picture. I listen to the song and decide which riff will work best - it's a feel thing - you just have to work at it. Pick the riff you think will work best and then move it with the chord changes. If a Root nothing is not cutting it move to something else AND if you are having trouble picking up the chord changes THEN the pentatonic R-2-3-5-6 is a safe bet. Now just running the pentatonic note for note may not be the best thing to do, put some rhythm into it, repeat some notes, etc. It's a feel thing.

True, that's the sort of exercise I mentioned I did with my teacher when we dabbled in pentatonics. He'd play the chords in a key and I would improvise and bounce around inside the pentatonic box(es). Often we hit a nice bluesy or jazzy sound.

I figured that if you stayed within the notes of the chord(s) being played, and came up with a good rhythm and structure, you couldn't go wrong.

Let Google call up some backing tracks and yes use your 6 string and work up some baseline riffs and play along.

C-F-G with a R-5 base line would be my choice. I had a little trouble picking out the chord changes on this one and tried the major pentatonic R-2-3-5-6 but felt it was in competition with the lead guitar so went back to a R-5. Like I said it's a feel thing.

Get your 5 or 6 favorite riffs into muscle memory experiment with different baselines - just listen to the song the baseline will fall into place - with practice.

Welcome to bass.

^^ I'm sure I'll have fun with that. I'm psyched... I want my bass and I want it NOW!

This is a great write up. Thanks so much. Subscribed.