Fodera and appreciation of value

[g4string]

A new Fodera is runiing between 7-10K these days. What will these basses be worth in 20-30 years. It seems like the only basses that seem to age well are vintage Fenders. What do you think - if someone was going to throw down almost 10K on a bass, what will the bass go for in 20-30 years - based on the current way Fodera runs their buisiness. Thanks!

 

[Baird6869]

Alembecs were hot 20 years ago as were other high end brands such as Pedulla. They are almost all worth much less than original release price.

I wouldn't say boutique basses are an investment in any case.

Even a 60's Fender didn't go up that much in 40-50 years when you factor in the future value of money.

If you want to invest in a bass, buy an original 60's Jazz for $8-15k and hope for the best. I think that is a much safer bet.

 

[motleystew]

I do not think Fodera's will appreciate in value like Fenders have in the long run. Other than maybe Wooten, I do not know of any other players that I like that play Foderas. I am not that big into them, and so I don't really keep up with who plays 'em. No offense, but Not that much ground-breaking music is being played on them..Maybe to jazz artists/fans, but certainly not mainstream-nothing changing the world on a large scale like say Motown or Punk did. But look at the history of Fender! Jamerson, Jaco, Sting, I can go for days on real history makers who emblazoned trails on Fender basses. Face it, people want to sound like their heroes buy basses that #1, they can afford, and #2, basses that thier idols play. I can ask 20 musicians to name a Fender player and get 20 different answers. I can ask the same question of Foderas and get a lot of ??? ...I'm not slamming Foderas or lifting up Fenders (I don't own either one). I do believe that Foderas will hold their value because of the name and build reputation. But In 20-30 years from now we will still be enthralled by the old school Fender sound. There will still be a handful who remembers Wooten but by and large Fender is nostalgia and always will be.

 

[g4string]

If you want to invest in a bass, buy an original 60's Jazz for $8-15k and hope for the best. I think that is a much safer bet.

I have been debating the above mentioned idea for a while. My deal is that I when I have kids, I would like something to pass on to them. Something that would mean something to them. Having an original 60's P or J would be cool to keep as an heirloom........but I wonder If passing down a bass that was built for me would be cooler? I know it seems weird, but I would feel more comfortable using a 10K Fodera on a gig than I would a 10K vintage Fender. I am not basing my decision on value appreciation. Nor am I looking to buy a bass as an investment.

 

[g4string]

I do not think Fodera's will appreciate in value like Fenders have in the long run. Other than maybe Wooten, I do not know of any other players that I like that play Foderas. I am not that big into them, and so I don't really keep up with who plays 'em. No offense, but Not that much ground-breaking music is being played on them..Maybe to jazz artists/fans, but certainly not mainstream-nothing changing the world on a large scale like say Motown or Punk did. But look at the history of Fender! Jamerson, Jaco, Sting, I can go for days on real history makers who emblazoned trails on Fender basses. Face it, people want to sound like their heroes buy basses that #1, they can afford, and #2, basses that thier idols play. I can ask 20 musicians to name a Fender player and get 20 different answers. I can ask the same question of Foderas and get a lot of ??? ...I'm not slamming Foderas or lifting up Fenders (I don't own either one). I do believe that Foderas will hold their value because of the name and build reputation. But In 20-30 years from now we will still be enthralled by the old school Fender sound. There will still be a handful who remembers Wooten but by and large Fender is nostalgia and always will be.

Good point and duely noted.............However, out of curiosity - how much do you think a 10K vintage Fender will appreciate over the next 30 years.

 

[Gegatso]

I don't think Fodera is going to be thought of in 30 years, honestly. I own one because I love the tone - as is the case with other owners I have spoken with. I have never and will never buy a bass because of what it might be worth in the future. The worth in the instrument is what it can do for me.

~Mark

 

[Snarf]

No offense, but Not that much ground-breaking music is being played on them..

?

 

[YCBass]

Call me cheesy but I tend to follow my heart, hands & ears when it comes to basses. It's not financially smart but I don't look at them as investments - as nice as it is to get good value for them I tend to not look that far ahead - not even 2 yrs ahead or so. I buy basses that work for me and if they hold their value well then that is simply a big plus.

With that said, I dream of owning a Fodera someday and need no justifications on their prices - if I'm able to afford one sometime then I get one.

 

[Jordan]

OP: it sounds like you want a Fodera as much as I do, and are trying as hard as you can to find a way to justify the outrageous price in your mind. I want one too. I've had the idea floating in my head for months. I even dreamed I found one in a dusty closet in the basement once. In my dream I was crying happy tears. (not really, but you get the idea)!

The thing is, I am so happy with my current bass that it seems rediculous to even consider paying that much money for an additional one. I just haven't been able to justify it thus far. And almost everyone I know says they agree that it is not justifyable. Even my "goto guy" piano buddy thought it was a bad idea, and he's the guy I "goto" for "advice" when I really want to be pushed over the gear-lust fence.

But I still want one.

Jordan

 

[Flintc]

Basses are probably no better an investment than baseball cards. And some shiny new baseball cards are damn expensive ($hundreds). But they only sell to people who have to have the latest and greatest *right now*, and have the money to do it.

I'm all in favor of buying very expensive instruments if they work for me. But not as an investment.

 

[ubado]

If you want a good investment... without spending thousands on a bass... try buying some old Fender Necks. Some of these necks go for crazy $$$.
I once had a 69' P body (PJ customized) with a 72' bound and blocked jazz neck.... nowadays the neck with original tuners sell for twice what I sold the bass for about 15yrs ago (before eBay came about).... but the body prices haven't changed that much in the past 10 years.

Who knows Fodera might go by the wayside in the next 20yrs... and their basses might fall out a favor.... just look at Alembic and their Epic series... $4,000+ for a new one, but a good used one goes for about a grand!

IMO... no matter what basses fall in or out of favor... Fender will be around, and the bodies will outlive the necks. There will always be a market for replacement Fender necks!

 

[IconBasser]

dude, if you're looking for an investment, get yourself a mutual fund. IMO much safer than a bass.

 

[motleystew]

To answer g2string, I'm not sure how much Fenders will appreciate over the next 30 years but as long as there are people who love popular music-music they grew up to or is simply legendary-there will be a market for the vintage Fender. To answer Snarf, a reletively VERY small pocket of music lovers know or care about jazz or the avant-garde players who generally play Foderas.( I have never seen these used in rock or country-but maybe that's just me) It's simply not mainstream. The music itself, Take a Wooten for example, in its own right might be groundbreaking, it is not going to live on in popular consious such as say.. Mingus or Davis. Except again by a very small handfull of fans. I believe in another 30 years, people will still be listening to the Funky Motown Sound and I'm afraid the Wootens of the world will be relegated to the Yngvies, Mcalpines, Sheehans, even the Hamms that are not even as poular now as they were 20 years ago. There have been "movements" in music that were truly globally groundbreaking take the Motown, the British Invasion, arena rock, punk, the 80's Michael Jakson sound, etc..modern Jazz just does not do this on the same scales (much to our chagrin!) . But, this matters nothing to me as I like all the afore-mentioned genres and then some!

 

[Brad Johnson]

A new Fodera is runiing between 7-10K these days. What will these basses be worth in 20-30 years. It seems like the only basses that seem to age well are vintage Fenders. What do you think - if someone was going to throw down almost 10K on a bass, what will the bass go for in 20-30 years - based on the current way Fodera runs their buisiness. Thanks!

There's no way to have anything approaching a realistic answer.

Look at this

If they're going to pay $10k for a bass, buy it knowing that it's resale value is a crapshoot. The way Fodera runs it's business has nothing to do with the used market. If resale is an issue, buy used, after the initial depreciation.

 

[spade2you]

dude, if you're looking for an investment, get yourself a mutual fund. IMO much safer than a bass.

Makes sense to me. Hard to say if a bass being worth more money is necessarily worth more after inflation has been factored in.

If you want to make money off a Fodera, buy a used one that has already depreciated and sell it a few years later when the percieved value is higher. You could also buy one and wait until the shop closes. That almost always boosts value.

 

[realdeal]

Well, you're realy talking about two different sets of monetary values here.

Foderas command high prices because they are limited production, hand-crafted instruments made by one of the premier builders. That doesn't necessarily mean that they will appreciate in value over the years; actually-just the opposite, because as well-made as they are, they'll still be "used."

Vintage Fenders- 50's P-Basses, early 60's/pre-CBS instruments as a whole have high market value because of their scarcity. They are collectibles, even (especially?) among non-players.
A mint, original condition Vintage Fender will always appreciate in value. It's a piece of musical instrument history, there aren't ever going to be any more made!

If you're considering the investment value only, Big $$ spent on a Vintage Fender will definitly increase, not so with Fodera, Alembic, etc.

 

[7string]

This is the first question my Grandfather asked me when I got my Sei 7 "How much will it be worth if you want to sell it".

But I wouldn't want to. Like others, I didn't enter into having a bass made with the thought of re-sale, as I will never sell it (and no-one would want it anyway as it has my signature on it).

If you're thinking of buying for investment, then it's a guessing game as to which basses will be popular in 20+ years time. Fodera's may be up there because the numbers are limited, but who knows, there may be other makers which will considered classics in years to come.

 

[flipper_gv]

wal basses are ****ing expensive now, and were less expensive 10 years ago. They age pretty well I think

 

[Halftooth]

A new Fodera is runiing between 7-10K these days. What will these basses be worth in 20-30 years. It seems like the only basses that seem to age well are vintage Fenders. What do you think - if someone was going to throw down almost 10K on a bass, what will the bass go for in 20-30 years - based on the current way Fodera runs their buisiness. Thanks!

I would not expect Fodera to continue to escalate in value as the years go.

At some point, things hit a saturation point in the market, and once the supply catches up with the demand, values drop.

The old Fenders continue to escalate in value because there's a low amount of supply and a relatively high demand or at least consistent demand. It sort of like buying housing in an area that can no longer be expanded and developed.

So, I'd say you're taking a total crap shoot with paying 10K on a Fodera and hoping it will fetch that or more years down the road. Buy the bass because you you like the tone, feel, craftsmanship, etc, but I think it's pretty much a low return investment.

 

[Belka]

http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/Cali...oryZ6212QQssPageNameZWDVWQQrdZ1QQcmdZViewItem

Now that's a pleasant dilemma for $21,000. Do I get two 10k Foderas or the one second hand Ferrari?

I agree that it's a crapshoot. For example: Wals may be commanding ridiculous prices now because it's at this moment that the rumours of them closing and there being no more Wals ever are flying around. If Wal close for good tomorrow, expect their prices to go even higher. But who's to say what the situation will be in 10-20 years, let alone 30-40.

I remember Britain in the 90s where every (I may be exaggerating slightly )pub band bass player had a Wal, they really were nothing unusual. I remember seeing second hand 5 or 6 string customs for sale for around 600 pounds (then about $900-1000) as late as '98 or '99. People were replacing them with Warwicks and StingRays because of the way trends come and go; perhaps they were considered too '80s back then. Who knows? Anyway, my point is, and this is no slight against Wals, which I think are great basses and I wish I had snapped up a custom back then, that certain brands may go through peaks and troughs, while others hold steady.

Fodera I think will hold their value better, partly because in my opinion the bassists that play them will still be revered 20 years down the line (at least among other bassists and musicians), and secondly, they don't seem so subject to the peaks and troughs which affect other high end brands. If they were to close, it would drive them higher, but I don't think they'll ever command vintage Fender territory. Imagine what a Fodera will be worth in 20 years and then step back and imagine what a 60s or 70s jazz will be worth in 20 years.

If you want one, buy it because they're a truly marvellous instrument. That's enough of an investment in my opinion.

Sometimes the second hand price of boutique instruments amazes me. When you think of what you can buy for $2000, certain brands do offer amazing value. I don't understand why basses such as pre-Gibson Tobiases don't command stupid money. Maybe because MTDs are so good? Or maybe it's that '80s thing again?