I'm still going back and forth between a painted finish and a nice wood top.
Can you post a picture of your gloss black Monarch?
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Can you post a picture of your gloss black Monarch?
Fodera is correct, as I wrote earlier this month. Your other basses are not particularly instructive comparanda because they employ different (probably thicker) finishes and may be older. No matter how seasoned the wood, it undergoes the most movement in its first few years as it settles into its new shape, a shape in which it is under serious tension. (Depending on string gauge, a 4-string bass guitar with a 34-inch scale length places a total string tension of 150 to 200 pounds on the neck; this increases if you go up to 5 strings and/or 35" scale.) Put colloquially, the wood is still learning that is it now a bass guitar. Yes, older wood is still impacted by environmental changes, but a new bass is all the more so as the wood adjusts to its new form. If your Foderas were new or near-new when you acquired them (I seem to recall you received a custom a couple years back), it makes sense they were particularly prone to checking.
Plus you are in western Texas, more precisely El Paso. That is literally the Chihuahuan Desert!!! As you surely know, this means a dry, desert climate with low humidity year-round. That's extraordinarily different from the climate in Brooklyn, New York and from wherever the wood originated (Africa, Europe, South America, Alaska, Southeast Asia, etc.). To prevent checking on a new instrument with a thin finish that was built in a higher-humidity environment, you would need to humidify aggressively, either the room or the instrument in its case.
I agree the company could better communicate why they choose to use a thin finish, and continue to do so when so many customers question it.
But I disagree it is any sort of issue or problem. It's purely cosmetic, and is direct evidence that Fodera is not using cheap, thick finishes like mass-produced instruments. Wood is a natural material. It moves, expands, and contracts with changes in relative humidity, and different species of wood (and different pieces of the same species) will move at different rates. Consequently, the finish surrounding it is also forced to move, possibly irregularly. At the end of the day, bass guitars are literal instruments--that is, they are tools. Beautiful tools that are works of art in and of themselves, but nevertheless still tools; therefore, Fodera rightly prioritizes function over form. If you want a piece of art that looks great and doesn't have the potential for checking, you can always buy a sculpture. But if you want a piece of art that can be used to produce art, well, here we are
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Sure it's this one. Just a total Swiss army knife of a bass. Best passive I've ever owned by a mile.
Re: whether or not the cracking is a "serious" issue, I wouldn't really care if it hadn't expanded to be noticeable in the places where my hand actually sits/attacks. It's not prohibitive, but I would prefer it not be there, much less get worse. And I feel like when we're talking about $6k+ basses, it should be a way more anomalous occurrence.
It is just interesting that Fodera is the only bass brand that I had owned that the finish always cracks. Yes, I understand about the wood moves, and yes that I am in El Paso it is dry heat, even though they aren't expose to the extreme heat, all the basses including my old Alleva Coppolos with Nitro fisnish never cracker, but Fodera basses they do.Fodera is correct, as I wrote earlier this month. Your other basses are not particularly instructive comparanda because they employ different (probably thicker) finishes and may be older. No matter how seasoned the wood, it undergoes the most movement in its first few years as it settles into its new shape, a shape in which it is under serious tension. (Depending on string gauge, a 4-string bass guitar with a 34-inch scale length places a total string tension of 150 to 200 pounds on the neck; this increases if you go up to 5 strings and/or 35" scale.) Put colloquially, the wood is still learning that is it now a bass guitar. Yes, older wood is still impacted by environmental changes, but a new bass is all the more so as the wood adjusts to its new form. If your Foderas were new or near-new when you acquired them (I seem to recall you received a custom a couple years back), it makes sense they were particularly prone to checking.
Plus you are in western Texas, more precisely El Paso. That is literally the Chihuahuan Desert!!! As you surely know, this means a dry, desert climate with low humidity year-round. That's extraordinarily different from the climate in Brooklyn, New York and from wherever the wood originated (Africa, Europe, South America, Alaska, Southeast Asia, etc.). To prevent checking on a new instrument with a thin finish that was built in a higher-humidity environment, you would need to humidify aggressively, either the room or the instrument in its case.
I agree the company could better communicate why they choose to use a thin finish, and continue to do so when so many customers question it.
But I disagree it is any sort of issue or problem. It's purely cosmetic, and is direct evidence that Fodera is not using cheap, thick finishes like mass-produced instruments. Wood is a natural material. It moves, expands, and contracts with changes in relative humidity, and different species of wood (and different pieces of the same species) will move at different rates. Consequently, the finish surrounding it is also forced to move, possibly irregularly. At the end of the day, bass guitars are literal instruments--that is, they are tools. Beautiful tools that are works of art in and of themselves, but nevertheless still tools; therefore, Fodera rightly prioritizes function over form. If you want a piece of art that looks great and doesn't have the potential for checking, you can always buy a sculpture. But if you want a piece of art that can be used to produce art, well, here we are
re the finishes
the earliest fodera basses i have were oil finishes (ca 1985-1991). oil was my preferred finish. i recall that some people at the time did not like that sound.
i think they transitioned to heavier finishes for some basses with maple tops in 1989 or so(?)
afaik, jason was the instigator of the "no oil finishes regime." i asked for an oil finish during the first years of his tenure and he said they were no longer doing them because they were more labor intensive. mind you this was 17 years ago, so i may not have this exactly correct.
after jason took over i requested that they would make the finish as light as possible. i am someone who hears a difference between a heavier and lighter finish (not saying objectively better/worse, just different).
the earliest fodera basses i have were oil finishes (ca 1985-1991). oil was my preferred finish. i recall that some people at the time did not like that sound.
i think they transitioned to heavier finishes for some basses with maple tops in 1989 or so(?)
afaik, jason was the instigator of the "no oil finishes regime." i asked for an oil finish during the first years of his tenure and he said they were no longer doing them because they were more labor intensive. mind you this was 17 years ago, so i may not have this exactly correct.
after jason took over i requested that they would make the finish as light as possible. i am someone who hears a difference between a heavier and lighter finish (not saying objectively better/worse, just different).
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That feels baffling for a company who's famed feature and huge part of its identity is the ability to customise absolutely everything about your instrument to suit you perfectly
TimothyGroovy
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- Aug 3, 2000
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I truly love the basses and the company, but when it comes to finish cracks, even if it's a known issue, we simply can't treat it as acceptable or normal. As a player and personally, I'm okay with cosmetic flaws as long as the instrument plays and feels great, but it's definitely a big deal for buyers who care, especially given the price they paid.
Also, I won't hide my thoughts on back when Jason asked everyone to wait 24+ hours before unboxing a new bass to prevent finish issues and neck movement. For a working, touring musician, waiting 24 hours after landing in a new city just isn't realistic when you have a show to play.
Also, I won't hide my thoughts on back when Jason asked everyone to wait 24+ hours before unboxing a new bass to prevent finish issues and neck movement. For a working, touring musician, waiting 24 hours after landing in a new city just isn't realistic when you have a show to play.
In the Fodera website is still shows the oil finish as an option in the finish, however it is not on the price listing. Last year when I place my order I asked Mike about the going for the oil finish, but I can't remember in detail, but it was something like adding a extra $700+ I say disregard. Some of the upgrades in my own opinion are ridiculous priced. The one I can't believe they charge is the signature from Joey and Vinny is an upcharge of $100.
Are you considering going with glass black? I think that would look very nice. What fingerboards are you considering Ebony , Rosewood, maple, pray ferro, or something else?
Had my bass signed before the upcharge, it does seem a bit excessive but it's their business to run as they see fit. Also had Victor sign my YY standard but he didn't ask for a bill lol.
Here is also another example of a black Monarch that is listed in the classifieds. It has a suptle sparkle to the finish . No affiliation. Has a nice matching headstock.
https://www.talkbass.com/classifieds/fodera-monarch-standard-classic-bass-guitar.1681410/
Black is always a good option, so I'm interested to see how it looks on an instrument. The fingerboard will be Pau Ferro.
The primary body color I have in mind is a fiery red/orange, whether wood or paint.
I've owned 8 Foderas and haven't had one with a finish crack. Sorry to hear about all the ones that do though! At the end of the day I might be leaning with the argument that yes it is a shame on something so expensive, but does it play a part in how incredible these basses sound?
Nah, they need to fix this problem.
My last Fodera costs more than the last new motorcycle I bought. A scratch on my new bike doesn't affect how it rides and handles, but yet I wouldn't accept it anymore than Fodera customers should accept a common issue with the finishes.
I'll be sticking to older Foderas and will not be ordering another new one until they assure everyone that this has been handled.
I wonder if people who have finish cracks didn't let their instrument sit in the box for 24 hours before opening it? It was a loooonng 24 hours for me.
My imperial elite sat in the box for 72 hours. 3 months later is when I noticed finish checking near the control knobs.
You raise a good point about the relationship between cost and quality, and the correlating expectations of customers. I think you are spot-on in regard to a motorcycle, but I don't think it extends to finish checking on a Fodera.
The difference, as I see it, is motorcycles are made of metals, high-performance composites, and engineering plastics whereas bass guitars are primarily made of wood. The two materials are rather distinct in quality. Metal, for example, is very stable, with excellent strength-to-weight ratio, but when it resonates, it transmits a lot of high frequency information and consequently often sounds overly bright and harsh. Wood, on the other hand, is not nearly as stable because it's comprised of cellulose fibers bound by lignin, but when it resonates, our ears find it most pleasing. Therefore, we (mostly) build motorcycles out of metal and instruments out of wood. Each has its qualities and its compromises, and the latter (namely, the fact that wood does not possess the stability of metal and thus will expand and contract) needs to be accounted for when establishing standards. Sure, you can use a thicker finish, but then you are dampening the resonance of the wood. It's all trade-offs.
I do think it's valid to question whether the tonal benefits of a thin finish are worth it on electric instruments. I can hear the difference on acoustic instruments like the guitar and double bass, but electric instruments derive so much of their tone from the pickups and strings (and amps, etc.) that the contribution of the wood--especially since it is a solid body and not a thin soundboard--may be so marginal that a thicker finish with its unchecked aesthetics is preferrable. That's certainly the opinion of the masses. But Foderas are not aimed at the masses.
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I have a 2011 Emperor Standard Special. It has a satin (?) finish. I bought it on TB in 2024, and it moved from CA to WA with me in 2025. There is no checking or finish cracking at all. I'm not rough with it, but I've never taken undue care to avoid temperature or humidity changes.
I have basses from other boutique builders just as pricey as Fodera that also use thinner finish with no cracking. I live in Montreal with extreme swinging climates. From terrible humidity to winter dryness. Others have figured it out...why not Fodera?
It's a growing and serious problem. One they should take much more seriously.
It becomes a question of trust...and right now...I don't trust Fodera's work.
I'm sticking to my old Fodera even though I am in the market for a newer one.
It's a growing and serious problem. One they should take much more seriously.
It becomes a question of trust...and right now...I don't trust Fodera's work.
I'm sticking to my old Fodera even though I am in the market for a newer one.
