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Geddy's bass tone

#41
Russ Ryan said:
The Rick is a different beast. To each it's own. For whatever it's worth, the Rick I had out with Ged was SO stable regarding neck adjustments, etc. Fender's, I find, have to be constantly tweaked because of different environments, etc. The Rick was setup at rehearsals and never change for the whole tour.
My two cents
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Hey Russ, cool of you to hop on board and share your insights and experiences. Hopefully you're not getting flooded with private messages! ;)

I can attest to the stability of Ricks... I don't think I've adjusted mine in... years! Does Ged's Rick still have the little capacitor inline with the bridge pickup? As you may know, a lot of players bypass that little cap to get more low end out of their old Ricks and I've always wondered if Ged did the same.
 
#42
Russ Ryan said:
Interesting! The pickups, to me are set maybe a little lower than "Standard" because of Ged's playing style. He hits REALLY hard. I have discussed this with him. I hate lowering the pick-ups too much for obvious reasons. Ged plays so hard he hits the E & A strings on the pick-ups quite often. Trust me, it is part of his sound.
You're right, the wiring is not wrong. Ged ALWAYS runs both pick-ups full, and tone full. I started with Ged in 97 so if he did anything different before then, I can't say, but in the 10 plus years I've been with him, all knobs on max.

I set the pick-up height on playing style for Ged. For my many years, there is no hard and fast rule for all the artists I have worked for. Read all the books you want, playing style, certian guitar, etc, listen and learn to what is best.My two cents!
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Russ,

Very nice to have you here. Good advice that I highlighted from you.

I've found a sound that I like for myself. Figuring out The mystery of Geddy's jazz tone stems from my desire to dissect and figure things out. I've always scratched my head as to why Fender has not been able to duplicate the sound. Given the resources of the company and the amount of variables involved. The "X" factor of that bass should be a methodical process of elimination. Granted I'm just a person sitting in a house in Houston texas who does this for fun, and they are the pros at putting things together.

Look forward to your posting of future results. Jeff
 
#44
Russ Ryan said:
Follow up. Geddy will always use the BadAss bridge, unless he receives a "Signature Model" like the Jaco. Ged will not change anything on Signature Jazz because out of respect to that particular artist. He has always said that is their instrument and will not change it.

Did you say flatwounds? Interesting.
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Yea, Fender 9050ml flats. Aged about 2 years.

I've used the BAII bridges in the past, and I do hear the difference they make. I do not like them with flats! With rounds they tend to give the string a snappier response. I'm not as concerned with the sustain issue, as the attack fundamental.

I've run Smith slapmasters 40-95 gauge, ghs lights, and the Roto mediums. While not bad, they lacked the aggressiveness I wanted, and the bass had too much top end. (thin sounding pups) I kept at the rounds for about two years.

Recently I switched to flats. I bought a vintage bridge and stuck it on. I was having intonation problems till I measured the bridge location. The GL jazz has the bridge located approx 5/16" further back than a standard jazz. 35 1/16 vrs. 35 7/16, if I remember correctly. I solved the problem by buying new longer stainless screws and longer tighter springs. Now the vintage style bridge is solid with no spring rattles.

I've tried Chromes, Roto flats, and the Fender flats. On my bass the Roto's just did not work. The Chromes worked very well, but wre old and broke. I've had two sets of broken in Fenders for awhile so, on they went. They really suit this bass. Now I was getting closer to that sound, but totally old school. Unless I swap pickups for an overwound set. The vintage setup stays.

My bass is bright almost "brittle" sounding. I believe this stems from the thin neck, and how it resonates with the body.
I had thought that Geds original neck was thicker than the Sigs based on pictures. When he stated his new neck was faster than his old one that kinda confirmed my suspisions.
 
#45
I am definitely interested in hearing more on the subject Russ, keep 'em coming!

Being a huge Rush fanatic, the only thing I wish Geddy would do is experiment with different basses a bit more. If it were me, I would be playing everything from the Jazz to a Bongo to everything in between. Each album would be something new, but hey, what do I know?

:)
 
#46
glwanabe said:
The GL jazz has the bridge located approx 5/16" further back than a standard jazz. 35 1/16 vrs. 35 7/16, if I remember correctly.
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Ah! That explains something for me! I had put on a set of TI's on my GL and was wondering why I had to cut some of the silk off the E string since it was going over the nut. I bet that was it.
 
#48
Hi Russ! Thanks for sharing here.

I think a large part of the old RIC sound of Geddy's that everyone loves is the distorted Sunn tube amp on the bridge pickup and the Ampeg on the neck pickup. He used a Jazz on Tom Sawyer with the same amp setup from what I can discern and it sounds similar, though not quite as aggressive as the RIC. Nowadays, he doesn't even use an amp from what I've read in interviews. For me the best tone that Geddy has ever had was that on Freewill. While I love RIC basses and their sound, I'd be pushing more for him to get a tube Sunn 2000S in his rig again.

Also, maybe you could convince him to do a lessons video/DVD and show us how to play cool bass lines such as Freewill.

Greg
 
#52
Dude, way too much info. Ged mentioned the new neck was faster because we had Fender sand down the back of the neck. To him it felt faster. When Ged received the fretless "Jaco" during recording, it had a sanded down neck. Ged just loved the feel of it and we had discussed fixing his old original neck. Guy's, trust me, I did all I could to make it work. After many late nights in the studio I suggested getting a new neck, sanded down like the Jaco. He just left it up to me, and I went from there. His original neck can be fixed. I just wanted to try a sanded down one because of how much he loved the feel of the Jaco. Guy's, I'm no guitar genius. I get paid to make the artist happy. Yes, I think I'm pretty good at teching guitars but..... My two cents

glwanabe said:
Yea, Fender 9050ml flats. Aged about 2 years.

I've used the BAII bridges in the past, and I do hear the difference they make. I do not like them with flats! With rounds they tend to give the string a snappier response. I'm not as concerned with the sustain issue, as the attack fundamental.

I've run Smith slapmasters 40-95 gauge, ghs lights, and the Roto mediums. While not bad, they lacked the aggressiveness I wanted, and the bass had too much top end. (thin sounding pups) I kept at the rounds for about two years.

Recently I switched to flats. I bought a vintage bridge and stuck it on. I was having intonation problems till I measured the bridge location. The GL jazz has the bridge located approx 5/16" further back than a standard jazz. 35 1/16 vrs. 35 7/16, if I remember correctly. I solved the problem by buying new longer stainless screws and longer tighter springs. Now the vintage style bridge is solid with no spring rattles.

I've tried Chromes, Roto flats, and the Fender flats. On my bass the Roto's just did not work. The Chromes worked very well, but wre old and broke. I've had two sets of broken in Fenders for awhile so, on they went. They really suit this bass. Now I was getting closer to that sound, but totally old school. Unless I swap pickups for an overwound set. The vintage setup stays.

My bass is bright almost "brittle" sounding. I believe this stems from the thin neck, and how it resonates with the body.
I had thought that Geds original neck was thicker than the Sigs based on pictures. When he stated his new neck was faster than his old one that kinda confirmed my suspisions.
Click to expand...
 
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#53
Okay, I'm going off the top of my head at the moment. I need an Advil already! My notes are in my toolbox which is at the Rush warehouse. I'll give you what I can remember but I promise to give you exact specs when we start rehearsals.

This last tour Ged used the Tech21 Sansamp RPM rack- mount pre-amp for his "Dirt" sound. His distortion sound. Ged has cut back on the 'dirt' drive. I can't remember why but you guys probably know more than me.

The drive level was set around the 10 o'clock position. By the way, just so you know, Sansamp does not use numbers so I refer to the standard 'Clock' position of dials. Mid-Range was, I think, set at around 3K and level was about 1 or 2 o'clock.

Everything else was slightly boosted, but not much, if I remember. Because we take a the XLR out, the XLR level is set at the 12 o'clock position. Myself and the sound engineers set it there as it seems to be the most optimal setting.

Input settings are set at, once again, working with what is best for the sound guys. That is MOST important to Ged. He trusts our input. Believe me, he (RUSH) pays us good money for more than just putting out a fresh bottle of water!

I'll let you know on exact settings when I actually see the gear

Jomyo said:
Russ,

As a longtime fan and supporter of Rush I also agree it's great to have you here!

So, could you tell us Ged's Sans Amp settings? Please!!!?? :D
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#54
Naw! You should hear me play Ged's bass... talk about sucking!
No offense, if you wave, I will only wave back if you are blonde, female, with really large....

ProfGumby said:
Howdy Russ!!

Awesome to see you here....and to the tone that can be reproduced....I'm very interested to hear that.....
:hyper:

And to the post above, all I can teach you, I feel, is how to take a bass that looks like Geddy's and make totally sucky sounds on it.......but I am trying......

Oh, BTW, I will be in attendance at the Milwaukee show this coming summer.....I'll wave to ya!
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#55
This is turning into one of the best threads ever! :)

Russ, it's so great to have you here, man :cool: We really appreciate all of your info...inside info on Geddy's gear is like finding nuggets of gold.

Another poster made the point Geddy playing the Jaco on the Snakes and Arrows track...I agree! If I didn't know he was playing something other than his Jazz, I'd never have guessed.

Russ, is Geddy so aggressive that his plays his bass 'out', like actually messes up the intonation, breaks the nut, goes thru frets quickly (especially with those Rotos...he still uses Rotos, right?)?

I guess I never noticed how hard he plucks until I saw his backstage bit on the Rio dvd, I believe...he was just sitting backstage, unplugged with his bass and warming up and he was really nailing that thing.
 
#56
Russ ... very interesting info ... I always thought that Geddy got the Ric like tone with the neck volume on 10, bridge volume on 7, and tone on 10. I was also suprised that Chris Squire soloed the neck pickup on his famous 60s 4001 bass.

Sometimes our perception differs from reality.

Also interest that Geddy experimented with musicman style basses. I must say I have enjoyed his work on the Wal, the Rickenbacker, and on the Jazz. I think I like the Ric best.

I also love the dryers. It is cool the Rush and Geddy don't take themselves too seriously.

Very interesting thread.
 
#58
Ged plays hard like I said. He never breaks nuts, etc. An interesting point about intonation. I intonate Ged's basses pretty much the regular way. Twelfth fret harmonic and then the 12 fretted note.
In what I do is all about working with the artist. I find the standard intonation set-up usually works with 99% of the guitar & bass players I work with. The only time I have had to change this is in a studio situation for a certain song or if the artist is into the "Buzz Feitan" tuning method. I truly dislike the "Buzz" thing. I'm of the belief the Buzz thing tries to tune a guitar or bass into a perfect tempered instrument. The guitar is a equal tempered instrument.

I could go into this but way too much writing.
Yes, Ged still uses Roto's, the standard Swing 66, long scale set. And yes, they do wear out frets big time! But they do have a certain sound. We actually used Ernie Ball round wound strings for the second half of the R30 tour. I won't go into why and don't ask. He's back to the Roto's.


Slaphappy said:
This is turning into one of the best threads ever! :)

Russ, it's so great to have you here, man :cool: We really appreciate all of your info...inside info on Geddy's gear is like finding nuggets of gold.

Another poster made the point Geddy playing the Jaco on the Snakes and Arrows track...I agree! If I didn't know he was playing something other than his Jazz, I'd never have guessed.

Russ, is Geddy so aggressive that his plays his bass 'out', like actually messes up the intonation, breaks the nut, goes thru frets quickly (especially with those Rotos...he still uses Rotos, right?)?

I guess I never noticed how hard he plucks until I saw his backstage bit on the Rio dvd, I believe...he was just sitting backstage, unplugged with his bass and warming up and he was really nailing that thing.
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