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Getting folks on the same sheet of music

I have a bit of a pickle with my main group I am in. I sing all the songs, play lead guitar, book the shows, create the flyers, promote the shows, maintain the website, manage our social media accounts, manage our media (CDs, streaming and videos), own the PA and set it up along with the lights, and attempt to keep track of everyone's schedules in a calendar. Let me say also, I don't do this as a living. I have a full-time job, 5 days a week. But I play 3-4 times a week.

Yeah. It's a lot of work for one person. Burn out is just a checkbox away.

So, the problem is, the other guitarist talks the good talk, thinks we are the next coming of the Beatles, believes that because we are all mature and experienced musicians (40+ years or more for most of us) that we are better than most of the other groups around. We definitely do not suck and have been breaking barriers that other bands can't in our region. But, IMHO, we have a long way to go to compete with the top shelf local bands.

The other guitarist is focused on the "look at us" factors, wants to rehearse all the time to put together the "show" but he struggles remembering his parts or even being able to find a part that fits without playing nonstop. Two years in and he is still making excuses about why he fumbles around and noodles. He is a good guitarist, and does make, at times, so very tasty chord selections, but but I think he doesn't practice (except at our rehearsals) and I really think he struggles to remember the stuff shown to him. Even with notes in front of him he forgets stuff all the time it seems. This includes even things like when we have gigs, even though I am VERY detailed about when gigs are.

He also plays very loudly and nothing any of us say to him makes a dent... he complains he can't hear himself or just hears me ( run direct into FOH, ampless stage for me). The last video we had of us playing all you could mainly hear was him. Drums and bass didn't even overpower him. I was barely a blip on the radar, so the excuse I was too loud is bunk. He also doesn't know when to NOT play. He very much is more into him and not the dynamics or overall sound of the group, even though he will adamantly say that he is all about the band sound.

Then there is his insistence that me being in other projects prevents us from being the best we can be, and that by not giving absolutely 100% to this group *I* am holding us back. I play in two other groups, sing some and play guitar, play bass in one and do very well at managing it as well as REMEMBERING the material. He can't do it, and it clearly bothers him that I can. So it becomes my fault he doesn't feel we are progressing as we should.

There is a lot more, but bottom line is I am pretty much done. The band is becoming entirely too much work (I know it takes a lot of work, but when you are the only one of five guys doing everything it excessive work) and there is no balance between how much I do and what everyone else contributes. The pickle is that:

  1. We practice at the other guitarist house
  2. He started the band with me and, honestly, he will be heartbroken if he is fired or the band ends.
  3. We have broken some tough venues and ending the group would seem like we wasted all that time building the brand.

So, instead... I am slowly dragging this on... It isn't enjoyable anymore and I know it's time to end it. But not sure how to do that without there being hurt feelings.

Maybe I shouldn't care, but I do. He is a good friend and person, I just don't want to be in a band with him any longer. I feel like it is holding me back. I honestly have held off booking anything further because I don't want to do more shows with him. But that is not fair to the other guys in the group.

If I quit, not tooting my own horn, just stating reality, but the band will not be able to continue. Even if they could replace me, finding someone to take over all the other stuff that I do would be nigh impossible. The current guys are clearly not up to the task, so asking someone to come in and do all that I do would be a miracle.

I know the answer I will get: "Surround yourself with the people that are going to make you better, not hold you back." This guy is holding me back. I would like to go back to one guitar and replace him with keys (we also have saxophone, bass and drums). More options and more what I want to play. But I don't have it in my heart to fire him. I have a friend who has a band that all the players are plateaued, don't have any desire to reach for more, and are content playing easy peasy stuff until they die. 20 years and he can't let em go because they are his friends and they have built a brand that gets people in the seats, even though they are mediocre at best. So he books it once every other month or so (if that) and leaves it at that for other projects that challenge him. That is what I may end up doing too. Maybe.
 
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I have a bit of a pickle with my main group I am in. I sing all the songs, play lead guitar, book the shows, create the flyers, promote the shows, maintain the website, manage our social media accounts, manage our media (CDs, streaming and videos), own the PA and set it up along with the lights, and attempt to keep track of everyone's schedules in a calendar. Let me say also, I don't do this as a living. I have a full-time job, 5 days a week. But I play 3-4 times a week.

Yeah. It's a lot of work for one person. Burn out is just a checkbox away.

So, the problem is, the other guitarist talks the good talk, thinks we are the next coming of the Beatles, believes that because we are all mature and experienced musicians (40+ years or more for most of us) that we are better than most of the other groups around. We definitely do not suck and have been breaking barriers that other bands can't in our region. But, IMHO, we have a long way to go to compete with the top shelf local bands.

The other guitarist is focused on the "look at us" factors, wants to rehearse all the time to put together the "show" but he struggles remembering his parts or even being able to find a part that fits without playing nonstop. Two years in and he is still making excuses about why he fumbles around and noodles. He is a good guitarist, and does make, at times, so very tasty chord selections, but but I think he doesn't practice (except at our rehearsals) and I really think he struggles to remember the stuff shown to him. Even with notes in front of him he forgets stuff all the time it seems. This includes even things like when we have gigs, even though I am VERY detailed about when gigs are.

He also plays very loudly and nothing any of us say to him makes a dent... he complains he can't hear himself or just hears me ( run direct into FOH, ampless stage for me). The last video we had of us playing all you could mainly hear was him. Drums and bass didn't even overpower him. I was barely a blip on the radar, so the excuse I was too loud is bunk. He also doesn't know when to NOT play. He very much is more into him and not the dynamics or overall sound of the group, even though he will adamantly say that he is all about the band sound.

Then there is his insistence that me being in other projects prevents us from being the best we can be, and that by not giving absolutely 100% to this group *I* am holding us back. I play in two other groups, sing some and play guitar, play bass in one and do very well at managing it as well as REMEMBERING the material. He can't do it, and it clearly bothers him that I can. So it becomes my fault he doesn't feel we are progressing as we should.

There is a lot more, but bottom line is I am pretty much done. The band is becoming entirely too much work (I know it takes a lot of work, but when you are the only one of five guys doing everything it excessive work) and there is no balance between how much I do and what everyone else contributes. The pickle is that:

  1. We practice at the other guitarist house
  2. He started the band with me and, honestly, he will be heartbroken if he is fired or the band ends.
  3. We have broken some tough venues and ending the group would seem like we wasted all that time building the brand.

So, instead... I am slowly dragging this on... It isn't enjoyable anymore and I know it's time to end it. But not sure how to do that without there being hurt feelings.

Maybe I shouldn't care, but I do. He is a good friend and person, I just don't want to be in a band with him any longer. I feel like it is holding me back. I honestly have held off booking anything further because I don't want to do more shows with him. But that is not fair to the other guys in the group.

If I quit, not tooting my own horn, just stating reality, but the band will not be able to continue. Even if they could replace me, finding someone to take over all the other stuff that I do would be nigh impossible. The current guys are clearly not up to the task, so asking someone to come in and do all that I do would be a miracle.

I know the answer I will get: "Surround yourself with the people that are going to make you better, not hold you back." This guy is holding me back. I would like to go back to one guitar and replace him with keys (we also have saxophone, bass and drums). More options and more what I want to play. But I don't have it in my heart to fire him. I have a friend who has a band that all the players are plateaued, don't have any desire to reach for more, and are content playing easy peasy stuff until they die. 20 years and he can't let em go because they are his friends and they have built a brand that gets people in the seats, even though they are mediocre at best. So he books it once every other month or so (if that) and leaves it at that for other projects that challenge him. That is what I may end up doing too. Maybe.
Thats s lot of baggage for you to put up with. The group might not have to break up but one member needs to be let go.
 
Just because he is a friend doesn't mean you need to be chained to an anchor. Record a show, then sit down with him and talk (not a rehearsal or gig).

Show him the video, and tell him your issues. You don't want to lose a friend, or waste what you started, but he has two choices - he can make certain changes, or you will leave the band. Either way, you will still be friends, but you won't continue as things are.

IMHO.
 
Maybe you could read some management books, like the book "how to win friends and influence" and give you a last chance of finding some approach that might work.
Last time I told bandmates they didn't practice enough, it didn't go too well.
I lost patience because their ambitions were delusional compared to the work they puted in.
 
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I'm in a similar boat with my current cover trio - in fact I've sailed on this same one for many years with different crew members. Some are really just along for the ride..

Fact: The band would cease to exist w/o your hard work & dedication - What you are doing with the tagalong guitarist is enabling bad behavior. He sounds like a jealous sig. other in giving you grief for wanting to work with other musicians..
That signals it's more of a social get - together rather than a working concern as most good players at least in my neck of the woods play in multiple bands if that's where the work is.

How are your other projects? Everyone on the same page? Any defect preventing it from succeeding? Can you picture the problem act raising their game or is it just a pipe dream? What's more important to you - being in a great band or possibly damaging friendships?
If you can answer these questions truthfully I'd figure there's your answer..
 
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He can’t stay in the band unless he is willing to change. He does deserve a chance to do that. You gotta sit down with him and have the talk. Do the other member agree with you? If they do and can present a united front then do it as a group. Coltrane used to say “I need to make a change”, I like that. The music is not working. He will make it personal but it’s only personal if he is unwilling to try a new way to play in the group. All musicians have to be flexible and change their playing to fit in any band. If he won’t change or resists changing that is when it becomes personal. You should fold the group and sacrifice everyone else just for one guy. He is not that powerful although I’m sure he wants you all to think he is. Don’t ruin the group to save his feelings. Be straight. Explain you value his friendship but his role in the band is problematic.
 
I have a bit of a pickle with my main group I am in. I sing all the songs, play lead guitar, book the shows, create the flyers, promote the shows, maintain the website, manage our social media accounts, manage our media (CDs, streaming and videos), own the PA and set it up along with the lights, and attempt to keep track of everyone's schedules in a calendar. Let me say also, I don't do this as a living. I have a full-time job, 5 days a week. But I play 3-4 times a week.

Yeah. It's a lot of work for one person. Burn out is just a checkbox away.

So, the problem is, the other guitarist talks the good talk, thinks we are the next coming of the Beatles, believes that because we are all mature and experienced musicians (40+ years or more for most of us) that we are better than most of the other groups around. We definitely do not suck and have been breaking barriers that other bands can't in our region. But, IMHO, we have a long way to go to compete with the top shelf local bands.

The other guitarist is focused on the "look at us" factors, wants to rehearse all the time to put together the "show" but he struggles remembering his parts or even being able to find a part that fits without playing nonstop. Two years in and he is still making excuses about why he fumbles around and noodles. He is a good guitarist, and does make, at times, so very tasty chord selections, but but I think he doesn't practice (except at our rehearsals) and I really think he struggles to remember the stuff shown to him. Even with notes in front of him he forgets stuff all the time it seems. This includes even things like when we have gigs, even though I am VERY detailed about when gigs are.

He also plays very loudly and nothing any of us say to him makes a dent... he complains he can't hear himself or just hears me ( run direct into FOH, ampless stage for me). The last video we had of us playing all you could mainly hear was him. Drums and bass didn't even overpower him. I was barely a blip on the radar, so the excuse I was too loud is bunk. He also doesn't know when to NOT play. He very much is more into him and not the dynamics or overall sound of the group, even though he will adamantly say that he is all about the band sound.

Then there is his insistence that me being in other projects prevents us from being the best we can be, and that by not giving absolutely 100% to this group *I* am holding us back. I play in two other groups, sing some and play guitar, play bass in one and do very well at managing it as well as REMEMBERING the material. He can't do it, and it clearly bothers him that I can. So it becomes my fault he doesn't feel we are progressing as we should.

There is a lot more, but bottom line is I am pretty much done. The band is becoming entirely too much work (I know it takes a lot of work, but when you are the only one of five guys doing everything it excessive work) and there is no balance between how much I do and what everyone else contributes. The pickle is that:

  1. We practice at the other guitarist house
  2. He started the band with me and, honestly, he will be heartbroken if he is fired or the band ends.
  3. We have broken some tough venues and ending the group would seem like we wasted all that time building the brand.

So, instead... I am slowly dragging this on... It isn't enjoyable anymore and I know it's time to end it. But not sure how to do that without there being hurt feelings.

Maybe I shouldn't care, but I do. He is a good friend and person, I just don't want to be in a band with him any longer. I feel like it is holding me back. I honestly have held off booking anything further because I don't want to do more shows with him. But that is not fair to the other guys in the group.

If I quit, not tooting my own horn, just stating reality, but the band will not be able to continue. Even if they could replace me, finding someone to take over all the other stuff that I do would be nigh impossible. The current guys are clearly not up to the task, so asking someone to come in and do all that I do would be a miracle.

I know the answer I will get: "Surround yourself with the people that are going to make you better, not hold you back." This guy is holding me back. I would like to go back to one guitar and replace him with keys (we also have saxophone, bass and drums). More options and more what I want to play. But I don't have it in my heart to fire him. I have a friend who has a band that all the players are plateaued, don't have any desire to reach for more, and are content playing easy peasy stuff until they die. 20 years and he can't let em go because they are his friends and they have built a brand that gets people in the seats, even though they are mediocre at best. So he books it once every other month or so (if that) and leaves it at that for other projects that challenge him. That is what I may end up doing too. Maybe.

If it we me, this guy would have been long gone., and it would have taken me less time than it took you to write this post to come to that decision. Life is way too short to be working with this guy, and I'm sure your band mates are getting cheese with their time being wasted as well. As the BL, can him. The rest of the band will understand.

On a side bar, try off loading some of your band work on the rest of the guys in the band.

Best wishes.
 
I have been in bands with friends that were not succeeding musically in the project. For me, the best course of action was to fold from the project altogether rather than try firing or replacement of members. After the current project is defunct, you can then pick up the pieces to make something new.
 
I have a bit of a pickle with my main group I am in. I sing all the songs, play lead guitar, book the shows, create the flyers, promote the shows, maintain the website, manage our social media accounts, manage our media (CDs, streaming and videos), own the PA and set it up along with the lights, and attempt to keep track of everyone's schedules in a calendar. Let me say also, I don't do this as a living. I have a full-time job, 5 days a week. But I play 3-4 times a week.

Yeah. It's a lot of work for one person. Burn out is just a checkbox away.

So, the problem is, the other guitarist talks the good talk, thinks we are the next coming of the Beatles, believes that because we are all mature and experienced musicians (40+ years or more for most of us) that we are better than most of the other groups around. We definitely do not suck and have been breaking barriers that other bands can't in our region. But, IMHO, we have a long way to go to compete with the top shelf local bands.

The other guitarist is focused on the "look at us" factors, wants to rehearse all the time to put together the "show" but he struggles remembering his parts or even being able to find a part that fits without playing nonstop. Two years in and he is still making excuses about why he fumbles around and noodles. He is a good guitarist, and does make, at times, so very tasty chord selections, but but I think he doesn't practice (except at our rehearsals) and I really think he struggles to remember the stuff shown to him. Even with notes in front of him he forgets stuff all the time it seems. This includes even things like when we have gigs, even though I am VERY detailed about when gigs are.

He also plays very loudly and nothing any of us say to him makes a dent... he complains he can't hear himself or just hears me ( run direct into FOH, ampless stage for me). The last video we had of us playing all you could mainly hear was him. Drums and bass didn't even overpower him. I was barely a blip on the radar, so the excuse I was too loud is bunk. He also doesn't know when to NOT play. He very much is more into him and not the dynamics or overall sound of the group, even though he will adamantly say that he is all about the band sound.

Then there is his insistence that me being in other projects prevents us from being the best we can be, and that by not giving absolutely 100% to this group *I* am holding us back. I play in two other groups, sing some and play guitar, play bass in one and do very well at managing it as well as REMEMBERING the material. He can't do it, and it clearly bothers him that I can. So it becomes my fault he doesn't feel we are progressing as we should.

There is a lot more, but bottom line is I am pretty much done. The band is becoming entirely too much work (I know it takes a lot of work, but when you are the only one of five guys doing everything it excessive work) and there is no balance between how much I do and what everyone else contributes. The pickle is that:

  1. We practice at the other guitarist house
  2. He started the band with me and, honestly, he will be heartbroken if he is fired or the band ends.
  3. We have broken some tough venues and ending the group would seem like we wasted all that time building the brand.

So, instead... I am slowly dragging this on... It isn't enjoyable anymore and I know it's time to end it. But not sure how to do that without there being hurt feelings.

Maybe I shouldn't care, but I do. He is a good friend and person, I just don't want to be in a band with him any longer. I feel like it is holding me back. I honestly have held off booking anything further because I don't want to do more shows with him. But that is not fair to the other guys in the group.

If I quit, not tooting my own horn, just stating reality, but the band will not be able to continue. Even if they could replace me, finding someone to take over all the other stuff that I do would be nigh impossible. The current guys are clearly not up to the task, so asking someone to come in and do all that I do would be a miracle.

I know the answer I will get: "Surround yourself with the people that are going to make you better, not hold you back." This guy is holding me back. I would like to go back to one guitar and replace him with keys (we also have saxophone, bass and drums). More options and more what I want to play. But I don't have it in my heart to fire him. I have a friend who has a band that all the players are plateaued, don't have any desire to reach for more, and are content playing easy peasy stuff until they die. 20 years and he can't let em go because they are his friends and they have built a brand that gets people in the seats, even though they are mediocre at best. So he books it once every other month or so (if that) and leaves it at that for other projects that challenge him. That is what I may end up doing too. Maybe.
Fire him before he destroys you. He doesn't care about anything but his playing. You will feel all the better for it, believe me. I've been there. The only outcome is you lose. You can lose by less, if you dump him. The longer you keep him, the more you will lose. He will take all the kindness you have and kill you slowly with it. Dump him for the sake of the others, if not yourself. Don't let him burn you out.
 
You've gotten this far without reforming him. It is possible, but highly unlikely, that you'll be able to "reform him." After all, things have so far gone well, right? How will you motiviate him to change if as far as he's concerned, nothing is wrong? Let him go. And jeez, try delegating some responsibilities!
 
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Just because he is a friend doesn't mean you need to be chained to an anchor. Record a show, then sit down with him and talk (not a rehearsal or gig).

Show him the video, and tell him your issues. You don't want to lose a friend, or waste what you started, but he has two choices - he can make certain changes, or you will leave the band. Either way, you will still be friends, but you won't continue as things are.

IMHO.

^^^^^^^ x 10
 
He is a good guitarist

He also plays very loudly ... he complains he can't hear himself ... The last video we had of us playing all you could mainly hear was him.

He's not a good guitarist if he can't hear himself without being the loudest thing in the mix. This is musicianship 101 stuff.