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Going beyond the home studio interface

Space Pickle

Space Pickle

Apr 15, 2013
2,469
2,502
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Toronto, Ontario
#1
I have a lot of experience with home studio type interfaces and interfaces that have only a few channels, such as the mbox, Apogee Duet 2, Digi 003. Currently I'm using a Tascam Model 24 which I quite like, but thinking ahead to the next step in the home studio evolution and I may want more available tracks to plug stuff in at the same time.

The Model 24 has 24 tracks, but only 16 available mic pres. I'm thinking I'd like at least 20 available line level inputs in a rack mountable unit, I assume it would go preamps -> interface -> computer. What gear would you need for this? How do you go about adding extra preamps?
 
#2
I'm not as experienced as many others on the TB Recording Gear thread, but many interfaces are equipped with expansion ports like Optical or ADAT that will allow you to add additional mic pre's and keep them time synced.

Looking at the Model 24 you have, it would appear to be a 24 track mixing board with the ability to connect via USB to a DAW, so its not really like the usual Focusrite/Apogee/SSL etc interfaces. Given that you have 20 available inputs how about just getting another sub mixer with however many inputs you want and run its L and R output into one of the Tascam's Stereo inputs (13/14, 15/16, 17/18, 19/20). You would not be able to isolate these track inputs as you would with dedicated Ins/Outs, but it would be a way to get more general input/pres into your DAW.

Good luck, the more experienced folks here will be along in a while to offer even better options.
 
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#3
My studio centerpiece is a MOTU 16A. 16 analog inputs and the ability to add up to 48 more inputs via ADAT, depending on sample rate of course. All you need is enough channels of analog preamps or line level inputs feeding the analog inputs, and then whatever digital inputs you want more the remaining 48. Everything connects to the computer via USB-C. Easy peasy.
 
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#5
Space Pickle said:
Thanks, I didn't realize you could do that.

I should have been more clear, I'm not looking to get more inputs out of my Model 24, I'm just thinking ahead to the next upgrade, maybe in a year or so.
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There aren’t many standalone rack units with that much built-in IO. I think Presonus has a 24-input unit now if memory serves. Antelope makes some units that would qualify, but I generally dislike them as a company which is why I went with the 16A. More IO potential than most folks will ever need by a long shot coupled with good converters is a nobrainer for me. After that it’s just down to the mic preamps you choose to feed it or the line level source plugging into it.
 
#6
I'm totally diggin' my MOTU 828es. I'm setting up an ethernet-based system and I've selected AVB for my interconnect protocol (open source, license-free). I'm using Thunderbolt2 to attach it to my DAW. It will also support USB2

2 mic pre's, ADAT (SMUX or standard), S/PDIF on RCA jacks and TOSLINK, MIDI, balanced analog I/O, SMPTE/MTC conversion, built-in DSP, web interface, AVB/TSN, all for under $1K.

Expand to your hearts content
 
#8
Space Pickle said:
Thanks, I didn't realize you could do that.

I should have been more clear, I'm not looking to get more inputs out of my Model 24, I'm just thinking ahead to the next upgrade, maybe in a year or so.
Click to expand...

If you don't need more inputs, why the move from the Tascam? What is it about the Tascam that's not working for you anymore?

Like @silky smoove - my mobile rig is centred around a Presonus 16R. My home rig is centered around a Presonus 1824c. 16in-16out for the former, 8-in-8out for the latter - both in 1U units and USB connections. Works great!
 
#9
DirtDog said:
Like @silky smoove - my mobile rig is centred around a Presonus 16R. My home rig is centered around a Presonus 1824c. 16in-16out for the former, 8-in-8out for the latter - both in 1U units and USB connections. Works great!
Click to expand...
I'm not using either of those Presonus units. I've got a little Presonus Studio 24C in the storage room of my studio as a backup in case my main interface (MOTU 16A) ever fails and I need to get through a session, but that's the only Presonus product I own. They have great products, so I'm sure they're excellent.
 
#10
I use an 8ch rack mixer to expand the # of inputs for a DP-32. The effects loop it has also helps with the limited nature of the DP. At most I’ll use 6 channels at once recording with friends but 99% of the time it’s a single channel routed within the unit. The mixer sums a pile of keyboards and rack units for convenience only.
 
#12
silky smoove said:
I'm not using either of those Presonus units. I've got a little Presonus Studio 24C in the storage room of my studio as a backup in case my main interface (MOTU 16A) ever fails and I need to get through a session, but that's the only Presonus product I own. They have great products, so I'm sure they're excellent.
Click to expand...

I meant more along the lines of comparable choices in 16-in/16-out 1U units - to uncover for the OP that there’s some quite capable devices with lots of inputs in a compact form factor. If that’s what he’s looking for....
 
#13
DirtDog said:
I meant more along the lines of comparable choices in 16-in/16-out 1U units - to uncover for the OP that there’s some quite capable devices with lots of inputs in a compact form factor. If that’s what he’s looking for....
Click to expand...
Absolutely. The 16R and 16A seem like similar ideas. The 16A has no built-in mic preamps as it's just an IO platform for a nice set of converters and all preamps or line inputs either need to connect via the analog TRS inputs or digitally via optical. The 16R appears to have at least one mic pre, but maybe there's one for all 16 channels. The specs aren't super clear to me. Cool stuff regardless.
 
#14
DirtDog said:
If you don't need more inputs, why the move from the Tascam? What is it about the Tascam that's not working for you anymore?

Like @silky smoove - my mobile rig is centred around a Presonus 16R. My home rig is centered around a Presonus 1824c. 16in-16out for the former, 8-in-8out for the latter - both in 1U units and USB connections. Works great!
Click to expand...

Hey, no issue with the Model 24, I quite like it. I'm just thinking ahead 6 months to a year when maybe hopefully my family moves from a small condo unit into a house and I can have an actual home studio music room. I'll probably keep the M24 to run the PA and make scratch recordings of jams and rehearsals, but I'd also like a separate "more pro" sounding setup and workflow for making and releasing instrumental music. I'm thinking high end electric drums, guitar modelling, midi keys/synth, EWI, and theremin. Everything direct, because judging by the absolutely insane real estate prices in Toronto I doubt I'll be able to afford a house with a properly designed studio, it's likely going to just be some sound dampening in the basement.

I just wasn't sure how the hardware all works together once you move on from the sort of all in one preamp & converter units. I can't possibly afford even the smaller Trident consoles, and I can't justify the expense of an Audient ASP 4816, but maybe a rackmount unit like the aforementioned MOTU setup, or the Audient ASP 880 might fit the bill. I really want things to be racked up and well organized, my current studio setup is a mess and it drives me crazy.

Anyway, I'm getting way ahead of myself here but just trying to get some ideas floating around my head I guess.
 
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#15
Space Pickle said:
Hey, no issue with the Model 24, I quite like it. I'm just thinking ahead 6 months to a year when maybe hopefully my family moves from a small condo unit into a house and I can have an actual home studio music room. I'll probably keep the M24 to run the PA and make scratch recordings of jams and rehearsals, but I'd also like a separate "more pro" sounding setup and workflow for making and releasing instrumental music. I'm thinking high end electric drums, guitar modelling, midi keys/synth, EWI, and theremin. Everything direct, because from looking at the absolutely insane real estate prices in Toronto I doubt I'll be able to afford a house with a properly designed studio, it's likely going to just be some sound dampening in the basement.

I just wasn't sure how the hardware all works together once you move on from the sort of all in one preamp & converter units. I can't possibly afford even the smaller Trident consoles, and I can't justify the expense of an Audient ASP 4816, but maybe a rackmount unit like the aforementioned MOTU setup, or the Audient ASP 880 might fit the bill. I really want things to be racked up and well organized, my current studio setup is a mess and it drives me crazy.

Anyway, I'm getting way ahead of myself here but just trying to get some ideas floating around my head I guess.
Click to expand...

Sounds like having lots of line inputs is your key requirement moving forward, along with perhaps a more compact form factor. I think you have the right idea. There's so many good solutions that are coming in ever so more compact packages.

Like @silky smoove alludes to above, there's more than one way to skin a cat and depends a lot on how much you want to be doing "in the box" vs on a control surface of some sort. And budget, of course!

In the past, I've used everything from small 2x2 interfaces to a MOTU 828mkIII 8 channel to a Presonus SL 16.4.2 large form factor digital mixer. All satisfied the requirements of the day....and then my requirements changed! I do regret selling that MOTU, though. That's great stuff. Took me a bit to wrap my head around its routing architecture and built in DSP, but hell, that was a capable unit.

For my home recording setup today, I've opted towards a bit of a middle ground with my home right (Presonus 1824c): enough I/O for my needs (a couple of vocal mics, bass preamp, guitar preamp and one analog synth permanently connected. Choice of monitors (headphones, reference monitors). I have a Presonus FaderPort 8 I break out for when I get to the mixing stage of things. Don't use it much for tracking, but I suppose I could. All of this was arrived at through trial and error and as I refined my workflow. I'm sure it'll change. The one thing I could see adding is an outboard channel strip/500 series rig for the vocal mics. I would rather do that channel input tweaking outside of the box.

My mobile "field recording" rig is 16x16 with a six channel headphone amp wired in permanently and racked in a 4U rack with a power supply. In that application I could be running 4-6 drum kit mics, a couple of mic'd guitar cabs, a bass DI and 2-3 vocal mics with room for keys or other instruments if needed. Up to six mono headphone feeds. All controlled by a MacBookPro running the Presonus mixer and recording apps. Arrived at that through a bit of trial and error. Sadly haven't used that setup since last March - it's been at my guitarist's studio waiting for the time we can get back together safely.
 
#16
silky smoove said:
Absolutely. The 16R and 16A seem like similar ideas. The 16A has no built-in mic preamps as it's just an IO platform for a nice set of converters and all preamps or line inputs either need to connect via the analog TRS inputs or digitally via optical. The 16R appears to have at least one mic pre, but maybe there's one for all 16 channels. The specs aren't super clear to me. Cool stuff regardless.
Click to expand...

Cool.

Yeah, it's kind of odd that Presonus doesn't mention its XMAX preamps in the 16R material. For the 24R and 32R, the marketing blurb does mention "remote XMAX preamps"...not entirely sure what that means. But the Presonus comparison matrix show 16 "recallable" XMAX preamps on the 16R. I'm going with that there's 16 preamps in that unit.

[Invalid or Expired Link Removed]

Big difference in the architecture between 1824c and 16R is that the 1824c has gain controls, line/mic selector switches and phantom power switch on the hardware. 16R hardware only has a mute and headphone volume control - everything else controlled in the box with their UC and Capture software. The 1824c has 8 analog XMAX preamps - that's nicer than the usual one or two you get on a lot of interfaces with more than two inputs.
 
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#18
Space Pickle said:
Yes, the Presonus StudioLive 32 or 64 seems like an interesting option as well, I've been considering that too.
Click to expand...

It’s pretty good bang for the buck. Yes, there’s higher quality stuff out there but with the state of things in 2021, we’re splitting hairs for home studios. Dead simple to set up and use as well.

The rack versions come in 24 and 32 channels. The 64 channel is desktop mixer form factor.
 
#19
I've used the RME Fireface 802 for a few years and love it. 4 clean pres, lots of line level ins/outs, ADAT expansion as needed, and class compliant so I can use it with an iPad if I want. I imagine it's one or two generations out of date by now, but it's been SUPER valuable in my home studio. Highly recommended.
 
#20
Space Pickle said:
I'm just thinking ahead to the next upgrade, maybe in a year or so.
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I don't think this is the best attitude, no matter what you are doing.
Get problem solvers, when you have a problem and need a solution for this.

Hey Doc, it is nice that you can offer a solution for my recent illness. But could you please write me a prescription for an illness I might suffer from or not in the near future.

Maybe you should upgrade your attitude towards life:-) That's for free.
 

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