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Guitar tube head in an effects loop?

Discussion in 'Amps and Cabs [BG]' started by The Sailor, Feb 28, 2013.


  1. The Sailor

    The Sailor

    Feb 14, 2012
    Nor Cal
    I am not much of an amp guy so bare with me here... Ive currently been gigging with an Eden WTX500 and while it is hands down the best amp ive ever used, when i engage the mid shift for that aggressive style rock tone it becomes too trebly to even be usable. Even with the treble knob cut very far down. Ive been looking into overdrive pedals to get an aggressive tone and getting a graphic EQ pedal to put on my pedal board too because i figured that could fix it. But then i was thinking today, could I run a vintage style guitar tube head through my effects loop for that kind of tone? It might help scoop out some of the treble and give more of a crunchy mid tone. Has anyone tried this? if so, is it worth the money or should i just get a big muff like everyone else. :help:
     
  2. chaosMK

    chaosMK

    May 26, 2005
    Albuquerque, NM
    Too much hip thrust
    Sounds cumbersome. I'd get some kind of pedal to do the job. There are many options.
     
  3. Fuzzbassian

    Fuzzbassian

    Jan 12, 2012
    you could use a sansamp in the same way
     
  4. two fingers

    two fingers Opinionated blowhard. But not mad about it. Gold Supporting Member

    Feb 7, 2005
    Eastern NC USA
    Yep. Any number of stomp boxes should get the job done. Plus, I had a few Edens and their EQ points were always both sensitive and weird. Try leaving the push/pull on the mid in. That lower mid point should help beef the tone up a bit.

    The amp in the effects loop just seems really complicated and probably won't make the Eden get all "Holy Grail" on you. It's a modern amp not prone to "warm tubey" tones. Use a pedal in front like the SanAmp, or EBS Valve Driver, or something like that. It will be cheaper, easier to set up, and probably sound better.
     
  5. bongomania

    bongomania Gold Supporting Member Commercial User

    Oct 17, 2005
    PDX, OR
    owner, OVNIFX and OVNILabs
    +1
    The biggest problem with the "amp head in loop" idea is that you'd have to also get a dummy load and an attenuator box, in order to make the amp output even work in the loop---so with the head there's three odd-shaped boxes, not cheap, three extra patch cords, and extra power cord plugins needed too.

    Compare that against just one really good overdrive pedal. :) Not a Muff.
     
  6. spacebassed

    spacebassed Supporting Member

    Jan 31, 2009
    Exactly, you can't run a tube amp without a speaker load attached or you'll blow the OT. I'd look into one of the Sans Amps pedals.
     
  7. MooseLumps

    MooseLumps Supporting Member

    Nov 4, 2007
    Portland
    Most tube amps. Hughes and kettner, vox and others make tube amps that don't require power soaks and would work well. At 3-5 :smug: times the cost of a good harmonic booster.
     
  8. JimmyM

    JimmyM Supporting Member

    Apr 11, 2005
    Apopka, FL
    Endorsing: Ampeg Amps, EMG Pickups
    You can use a guitar amp with the lows rolled off and an ABY pedal to switch it in and out. You will probably also want a buffer pedal before the ABY to bring the levels back up to what they were before you split the signal, but it can be done and is often done by way more ambitious bass players than me. I use pedals...definitely the easier way to go. That way your basic sound doesn't change, it's not a hassle to set up (or beg for two channels on a multi-band show), and many come with a blend knob in case you want to mix clean and dirty signals.
     
  9. aftec

    aftec

    Feb 16, 2013
    Loops are usually line level unless they are switchable between instrument and line level. Line level will send way too hot signal to an input of an amp.
    What you can do:
    1. Use and isolated ABY switch (midi or non midi) and send the line out of the amp/preamp(some amp's line out work in standby too, than you don't need a dummy load) to the return of the bass amp if your bass amp supports feeding a second signal through your return. With the ABY you can select between the preamps.
    2. Your selection of dirt box before the input.
    3. Get a GK head
     
  10. ALL tube amps need to see a load whilst in operation. Not doing so will cause the amp to eventually fail no matter who made it!
     
  11. bongomania

    bongomania Gold Supporting Member Commercial User

    Oct 17, 2005
    PDX, OR
    owner, OVNIFX and OVNILabs
    There are a couple of tube amps that have a dummy load built in, for recording purposes. Just a couple though, I would not have gone so far as to suggest it's common, or to imply that all models from those two brands will work.
     
  12. Use the SA or a MXR80, but NO WAY am I getting naked with you.

    (The correct request is to 'bear' along with you. However your sig [The Sailor] may be no more than a Freudian slip in this case).
     
  13. The Sailor

    The Sailor

    Feb 14, 2012
    Nor Cal
    Thanks all for your input. So far the best option sounds like a combination of a sansamp and some sort of a drive pedal. However, ive been offered a Peavey 120 watt all tube for 200 dollars which will cost less than a sansamp and pedal... i hate these decisions... all my problems would be solved if only i could afford an ampeg svt :( anyway, What would i use as a dummy load. (not saying im picking the tube amp, i just want to keep my options open)
     
  14. why a combination of a Sansamp and a drive pedal? The Sansamp bass driver DI has a drive knob, you can get good drive from that. Next to that, the bass driver simulates tube sound pretty good. I'm pretty much in the same spot about affording a good amp (I really want a Fender Bassman 100T), so I'm getting a sansamp. Which is a good affordable solution. You should find out a thing or two about it, I've seen (and heard) a lot of people use the Bassdriver DI and it never dissappoints.
     
  15. IPYF

    IPYF

    Mar 31, 2011
    If it's a XXX I wouldn't do it. Obviously I'm just guessing but that's the only Peavey tube head that I know of that would come in at that price point and be 120 watts. It's a scratchy guitar amp at its very best and would not suit a bass no matter where you put it in the chain.

    These little fellows come up from time to time over here. It's a tube amp and it's compact. I've been thinking of getting one of these just for the gigglies of it. Maybe it's a solution for you?

    http://valvetone.com.au/impact_mk3.html
     
  16. The Sailor

    The Sailor

    Feb 14, 2012
    Nor Cal
    Im mistaken, i didnt know the sansamp had a drive feature i thought it was just an EQ! Also i think the peavey was a butcher which apparently is some sort of vintage head they used to make... And that mini tube head looks awesome! Ive actually been researching one very similar to that. I saw one on craigslist for 200 dollars which isnt bad! Definately be looking into those.
     
  17. IPYF

    IPYF

    Mar 31, 2011
    Yeah I'd avoid that Butcher too. The only Peavey Valve head that is good for bass is a modified Windsor.
     
  18. The Sailor

    The Sailor

    Feb 14, 2012
    Nor Cal
    Alright thank you! Time to go check out a sansamp. Ive also been thinking about selling off my eden head and some other gear and just splurging on an SVT Cl.
     
  19. Just to stir the pot a bit more - I dislike the SansAmp --- totally.

    Too sterile and modern sounding for my tastes.

    I mean, it'd work OK as a DI if i had no other option but I much prefer the MXR M80 +DI a lot more with it's "Get outta trouble" button and it's fuller, richer sound and tweak ability.
     
  20. DigitalMan

    DigitalMan Wikipedia often mistakes my opinions for fact Supporting Member

    Nov 30, 2011
    To stir the pot a bit more. It's the best amp you've ever used, until you try to use a feature that you want to use (mid shift) and then it's no longer the best amp you've ever used.

    A viable alternative is to sell it and find an amp that is great for everything you want to do that you've never used.

    Or you could buy a big muff.

    (How would you load the tube guitar amp if you used it in a loop? An external load box would add a lot of cost to the solution. You can't run a tube amp head without a speaker load attached to it.)
     

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