Happy being a "Pocket or Groove"player?

[DrThumpenstein]

I'm with you: Groove is paramount.

I've seen dudes play impressive solos but seem to be unable to stop their busy, overplaying selves from trampling over the actual song by playing the same way instead of meshing with the other musicians in the band. I've also seen bassists play really nice, virtuoso bass solos and then jump right back into the groove and reinforce a good tight sound. I don't think being a good soloist precludes being a groovemeister, but I'll take the groovemeister every time, whether they can solo or not.

The only bass solo I ever play in public is, you know, that part in Brown Eyed Girl where the rest of the band stops playing for a couple of bars while the bass line continues unabated.

To me, most of the time, the best thing about a bass solo is that it's not a drum solo!

 

[bucephylus]

The bass player’s primary role is to lock down the harmonic and rhythmic elements into a compelling groove. We define the heart of the tune. That role must be delivered first and foremost, and without remorse.

Soloing is like the frosting on the cake. It’s not just wiggling your fingers. It takes skill, study, and knowledge. It’s a great pursuit, and nice tool to have when appropriate. But, it means diddly if the groove isn’t there. You don’t short cut the groove to get there. Truly great soloist bassists play mean grooves first and foremost, and great solos when called upon. It’s not an either or thing. More of an If, Then.

Oh, another aspect about a great groove is that it is delivered in context and full awareness of the overall mix of the tune.

 

[REV]

If you can still groove when you solo, go for it. If not, stay in the pocket. If soloing is important to you, you have to have something to say musically and you have to learn how to say it.

 

[Keyser Soze]

Correct me if I am wrong but I have read that Jaco was an ego maniac, who thrived on the soloing aspect of being a bassist in the limelight. It is that same cockiness that got him killed in a nightclub by a bouncer one night!

Jaco's propensity to self medicate for his mental health issues with street drugs and/or alcohol is likely responsible for getting him "killed in a nightclub by a bouncer one night!"

 

[PaulCISSA]

I'll solo a few bars if it does the piece we're playing justice - transition into a bridge or segue into a different movement of the composition. But I like the pocket, I make groove with some of the very good drummers I work with and my distaste for soloing is well known in all the bands I play with. I let the guitarists and BL's argue over gets the wank-fest for any given song. I make groove.

 

[Passinwind]

Being a pocket player myself and understanding my position in every band that I have played in, how many members feel the same way or strive to be "soloist's" requesting a solo in every song? Sometimes I feel my lack of theory has stifled my advancement, but my ear training has allowed me to play almost anything I can sing or hear. I am at the end of my career, and nothing worst than sitting back in your recliner with regrets of things you could or should have done. Any comments?

Do it all to the best of your ability and sensibility, and if at all possible don't let labels define you.

 

[StatesideRambler]

I rarely solo(ed) in my life (I’m 68) and I have too often been disappointed by those who do. I won’t catalogue the reasons but, again, “Serve the song!”

 

[bherman]

Here's one way to look at it - when going to see a really great band, if you could call the shots how many times in a show would you want to listen to a drum solo? For me its once. I take the same position on bass solos. Even for really great bass players , I prefer to listen to him support and lead the band, with a solo or maybe two during a show. Not endless noodling and solos. Thats not our role in a band.

 

[bolophonic]

I’m always happy to hold it down in any genre — never ever had a desire to take a solo or improvise.

 

[Mediocrity Man]

I'm content with supporting the band and adding a touch of flair when needed. We don't have to be Geddy or Jaco to be great bass players.

 

[Cutter8]

Correct me if I am wrong but I have read that Jaco was an ego maniac, who thrived on the soloing aspect of being a bassist in the limelight. It is that same cockiness that got him killed in a nightclub by a bouncer one night!

I’d say severe and untreated manic depression (bipolar I), not ego, was what lead to Jaco’s death.

 

[delta7fred]

Almost none of the songs we play in our cover band have bass a solos in them, some don't even have lead solos.

Last night I soloed for exactly 16 bars (2 songs with 8 in each) because that is what the original recordings had in them. If we don't play those 2 songs I don't get a solo but don't loose any sleep over it as I still get paid (more I suspect than if I wedged a solo into every song).

 

[kbraker510]

I strive to be in the pocket.

 

[quindecima]

Wrong, He was an alcoholic and died from complications from that, whoops I thought we were talking about Jamerson.

Correct me if I am wrong but I have read that Jaco was an ego maniac, who thrived on the soloing aspect of being a bassist in the limelight. It is that same cockiness that got him killed in a nightclub by a bouncer one night!

 

[JoeWPgh]

It's all about the groove, 100% of the time. If you want to solo, fine. But that's icing on the cake if you can lay down the groove. If you can't lay down the groove, no one is going to care about your solo.

 

[LBS-bass]

Being a pocket player myself and understanding my position in every band that I have played in, how many members feel the same way or strive to be "soloist's" requesting a solo in every song? Sometimes I feel my lack of theory has stifled my advancement, but my ear training has allowed me to play almost anything I can sing or hear. I am at the end of my career, and nothing worst than sitting back in your recliner with regrets of things you could or should have done. Any comments?

I am totally a pocket player and I'm very happy with that role; to me, that's what the bass is about. Can I play fancy stuff? Sort of, when I work at it, but I don't usually whip that stuff out at shows. I have issues that limit me at a technical level, so I'll never be hugely fast. But I practice at home to learn things that challenge my skill level and being able to do that makes the stuff I usually play easier. But I don't generally solo and I don't generally want to.

 

[LBS-bass]

That would depend which personality he was at the time. Dude was untreated bipolar.

This. He may or may not have also had a drinking problem, but bipolar type I will get you in exactly the sort of mess Jaco was in. I believe his family also thinks this to be the case.

 

[Keger Jupit]

Very early in my career, a trio I was in did a song where I soloed. It was the only song we played that had a solo of any kind. Our guitarist/singer/songwriter was wickedly talented, but couldn't play leads to save his life. My solo was actually his idea & it worked really well.

Fast forward 25 yrs...my current band is going into the studio in a week, & they wanted me to solo on 2 of the 7-8 songs we plan on recording. On one of them I will, but I actually turned down the second solo...because it seems kinda...frivolous...self-serving? I don't know...but I haven't played a single solo with any other band between these two.

Soloing/noodling can be fun, & I wanked around much more when I was younger, but after playing for 5-6 years I realized it wasn't doing the songs any favors, & it was so much more satisfying to just throw down. I don't feel like I've missed out on anything, although I totally agree about theory/lessons/formal training. Wish I'd pursued that end of things more...there's still time though...hmm

I do get a great deal of pleasure playing interesting/melodic lines; IOW, I don't play it the expected way except when first learning something. After that all bets are off...as long as the song is served well, & my band mates aren't puking in the corner...

 

[The Bass Clef]

If “you” aren’t happy playing in the pocket and laying down a groove for the band, then why in the world would you choose bass over all the other instruments out there? For the vast majority of it, I think “solo bass” is more of an expression of ego than anything else (lookey what my fingers can do), because most of the actual solo bass music itself listens down like a “how to” manual. But that’s just me, if you’re entertained by it then more power to ya. I don’t mind a little bass solo here and there in the context of a concert, but nothing but bass doesn’t do much for me.

 

[LBS-bass]

If “you” aren’t happy playing in the pocket and laying down a groove for the band, then why in the world would you choose bass over all the other instruments out there? For the vast majority of it, I think “solo bass” is more of an expression of ego than anything else (lookey what my fingers can do), because most of the actual solo bass music itself listens down like a “how to” manual. But that’s just me, if you’re entertained by it then more power to ya.

There's a sub-genre of playing that's more like "lead bass" and it can work pretty well when instrumentation is limited and you're covering a lot of territory. But you need serious chording and picking skill to do it and I can't really understand why most people who play in that style don't just pick up a guitar at that point. I do appreciate their skill, though.