Would like to experemint with a harmonizer . Possible disaster with upright? Been suggested : Boss PG6 or TC quintessence. Anyone have any experience with other units, or any at all for upright. Perhaps this is pure folly or , a fresh idea?. Trying to fill some musical space when the fiddle player drops out playing to sing. We are a mere duo.
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Double Bass Harmonizer for upright (! ? )
- Thread starter Dan Hannum
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Not an EUB player, but an EUB would probably eliminate feedback issues possibly compounded(?) by a 3/4URB
I am amped thru K&K PU and preamp/Genzler Acoustic Array. What sort of issues could arise? Thinking glissandos and huge string excursion might sound wonky, seeing the only bass demo I have heard was thru a slab Sadowsky
I am amped thru K&K PU and preamp/Genzler Acoustic Array. What sort of issues could arise? Thinking glissandos and huge string excursion might sound wonky, seeing the only bass demo I have heard was thru a slab Sadowsky
You can totally do this. You just need to use a pickup which is on the feedback-resistant side, Underwood, Full Circle etc, and take the same precautions as anyone in very loud situations, such as damping the afterlengths. I use a few different pedals in certain settings, and it's fine. Some octavers can send you into wild feedback no matter what, but harmonizers can work well. I use a C4 synth pedal, and it can also do harmonizing. I like that I can create sounds that compliment my acoustic sound, and then use them alongside the natural sound of the bass. What pedal is right for you is really up to how you're imagining to enhance your sound.
Here's something I did, it's not on stage here, but I have done the bass-enhanced-with-synth-chords live, it works. Totally.
I'll be interested to hear how it works out for you.
Edit: I'm not sure which K&K pickup you're talking about, but if it's the bridge wing one (Bass Max?) I think it's OK. Your equipment seems fine to me. Don't point the amp directly at the bass.
Here's something I did, it's not on stage here, but I have done the bass-enhanced-with-synth-chords live, it works. Totally.
I'll be interested to hear how it works out for you.
Edit: I'm not sure which K&K pickup you're talking about, but if it's the bridge wing one (Bass Max?) I think it's OK. Your equipment seems fine to me. Don't point the amp directly at the bass.
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Holy cow, Brent!!! That's amazing! Just wonderful. I can't imagine how long you worked to arrive at that finished product. Absolutely, jaw-droppingly beautiful. Congratulations! Rave on!
That’s awesome. Was it difficult to get it to track properly?
Is there any latency in the sound?
The reason I’m asking is that I am looking to increase the attack and fill out the sound, when playing pop/rock.
(Should probably just double on an electric bass, but trying to avoid that
Brent: I thank you immensely for this. I have the K+K Pure/BassMax setup on a 100 yr old German carved 3/4 strung w/ helicore hybrids. (alternate w/a Fishman BP100 or a Vics wing single) Looking very strong at the Boss PS6, advised by the sales jockey at one of the big boxes. 3rds and 5th harmonies the priority. Shouldnt be a feedback issue. Were quite a low volume duo with a restaraunt lounge deal
Great video work and wonderful composition. I play a homebuilt eub and Ibanez BTB675 at church and sometimes add a little reverb. Thru Berringer amp with Ultra Bass. The ultrabass stays off as it only makes mud.
Thanks everyone for your kind comments.
You have to play clean enough. Pizz is no problem, but with the bow you have to be careful not to have too much extraneous noise and artifacts. Basically, you have to be aware of the fact that the pedal has to be able to "hear" your intent. But the tracking on the one I have, the Source Audio C4, is the best I've ever tried by a mile. I don't notice any latency. I do always blend in some of the straight sound, so maybe that's a factor.
You could absolutely use it to fill out the sound when playing pop/rock music. If you just want to fatten things up, there's a lot of ways to do that, if you're able to dig in to the app they have. If you want to use harmonies, you have to be aware that it's limited to whatever scale etc, you choose. The tune I posted all fits an A lydian scale. I was really interested in that song because it has a lot of motion, and a real melody, but I could set up the mode and go. I was also pretty fascinated to find a hit song in the current era with no drums. But anyway, you have to plan your performance out pretty good. There's also an arpeggiator, and the same thing applies, you have to know what's going to come out, unless you're improvising alone, and I can tell you that's very risky (but fun)...
Of the 2 you mentioned, I'd be more likely to go for the Boss, just because I know they're built like a tank, and maybe a little Japan pride. But I'd try to hear things first to compare. For example, 2 other pitch shifters are the Digitech Whammy and the EHX Pog. People who know them almost always say the Whammy tracks better, but the Pog sounds more musical. So there's that balance to consider too. I'm incredibly busy just now, but if I can squeeze out a few minutes, I'll try to record something with pitch shifting only for you to hear.
With the PS6, you'll have to be ready to switch all the knobs around in between each tune you'll want to use it for. You might be able to learn to do that quickly enough, I don't know. There is something nice about seeing it all in front of you. With the C4, you can set up presets for each tune, and switch between them. But I've occasionally forgotten which preset is which... If you connect your phone/ipad to the pedal, you can see the names of the presets and select them. So either way is complicated, I guess it depends what kind of complications you want in your life
You have to play clean enough. Pizz is no problem, but with the bow you have to be careful not to have too much extraneous noise and artifacts. Basically, you have to be aware of the fact that the pedal has to be able to "hear" your intent. But the tracking on the one I have, the Source Audio C4, is the best I've ever tried by a mile. I don't notice any latency. I do always blend in some of the straight sound, so maybe that's a factor.
You could absolutely use it to fill out the sound when playing pop/rock music. If you just want to fatten things up, there's a lot of ways to do that, if you're able to dig in to the app they have. If you want to use harmonies, you have to be aware that it's limited to whatever scale etc, you choose. The tune I posted all fits an A lydian scale. I was really interested in that song because it has a lot of motion, and a real melody, but I could set up the mode and go. I was also pretty fascinated to find a hit song in the current era with no drums. But anyway, you have to plan your performance out pretty good. There's also an arpeggiator, and the same thing applies, you have to know what's going to come out, unless you're improvising alone, and I can tell you that's very risky (but fun)...
Of the 2 you mentioned, I'd be more likely to go for the Boss, just because I know they're built like a tank, and maybe a little Japan pride. But I'd try to hear things first to compare. For example, 2 other pitch shifters are the Digitech Whammy and the EHX Pog. People who know them almost always say the Whammy tracks better, but the Pog sounds more musical. So there's that balance to consider too. I'm incredibly busy just now, but if I can squeeze out a few minutes, I'll try to record something with pitch shifting only for you to hear.
With the PS6, you'll have to be ready to switch all the knobs around in between each tune you'll want to use it for. You might be able to learn to do that quickly enough, I don't know. There is something nice about seeing it all in front of you. With the C4, you can set up presets for each tune, and switch between them. But I've occasionally forgotten which preset is which... If you connect your phone/ipad to the pedal, you can see the names of the presets and select them. So either way is complicated, I guess it depends what kind of complications you want in your life
I suppose I could write out the names of the presets on my setlist . Think I'm up for the learning curve. Anticipating this adding a nice dimension in a duo setting of a mere violin/vocalist and bass player. Have secured the Boss PS6 unit. Brent, you have been very generous and I thank you.
Good luck! Just to be sure I’m not misleading you, the C4 is the one with presets. With the PS6, probably I’d make a diagram of the 4 knobs for each tune, and mark the settings so I could switch them quick.
Let us know how it goes!
Let us know how it goes!
I have had success running my bass through numerous ambient pedals. Either pickup directly into the pedal or mic into preamp or amp and used the send/returns for the effects. Here is a noisy drone ambient improv through Black Hole Symmetry with a 5th above and lots of distortion at the end. Spend time to see how the pedals reaction to minute changes in your playing.
Both your videos on TY are excellent. Thanks for sharing and hopefully some more in the 2023.
Just a simple reminder:
When using a harmonizer, the transposed pitched get a Mickey Mouse effect (moved resonant frequencies = formats).
Separating tone pitch and resonance frequencies (to move the pitch and superimpose the original resonance) needs a lot of computing power and might not work too well, so that is never used in an effect unit.
It might be acceptable, but is far from being the natural bass sound. The more the larger the pitch difference is.
When using a harmonizer, the transposed pitched get a Mickey Mouse effect (moved resonant frequencies = formats).
Separating tone pitch and resonance frequencies (to move the pitch and superimpose the original resonance) needs a lot of computing power and might not work too well, so that is never used in an effect unit.
It might be acceptable, but is far from being the natural bass sound. The more the larger the pitch difference is.
Getting an acceptable -piano/like octave above- setting on the PS6 I just bought. I like it. Everyones input has been very helpful
When I use any piezo, my pedal board options always seem to be limited and very fussy.
When I use a KRIVO magnetic pickup, I can use anything possible from the pedalboard and get fantastic results- harmonizers, envelope filters, gain, synth pedals, & crazy spaceship landing stuff. Everything is fair game and works like I'm hoping for. I can also use a huge amount of volume and giant cabs with zero feedback issues or worries.
Plus, after all of that extra noise, on the more simple gigs I'm ecstatic to go back to just my clean bass & bow sounds.
When I use a KRIVO magnetic pickup, I can use anything possible from the pedalboard and get fantastic results- harmonizers, envelope filters, gain, synth pedals, & crazy spaceship landing stuff. Everything is fair game and works like I'm hoping for. I can also use a huge amount of volume and giant cabs with zero feedback issues or worries.
Plus, after all of that extra noise, on the more simple gigs I'm ecstatic to go back to just my clean bass & bow sounds.
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Not a harmonizer but if you are trying to fill in those empty spaces I have had good results using the Boss OC-5 Octave pedal.
Wondering if the Boss OC5 produces a bit cleaner sound. The octave produced from the PS6 is somewhat chimey. Acceptable, but could there be something better? Will look for demo vid on the OC5.
