Have scales ruined music?

[Jazz Ad]

Different type of music..... when was the last time Bach was jamming with Miles Davis, Coltrane, etc. Scales are GREAT for written music, but IME, slow me down when creating music on the fly in a jam band.

Music is music.
Bach was the most famous improvisator of his time and jammed constantly. Most classic musicians did.

 

[Fuzzbass]

I think I saw that video. Yes, Carol criticized players who used scales (improperly), but her point wasn't that scales are bad (mmmmkay?), it was simply that a good musician must also understand chords.

 

[major10th]

Actually, 2 notes is a harmony, not a chord. A chord is always 3 or more notes.

I guess a lot of guitarists will have to start calling them power harmonies instead of power chords

 

[canadian_man_44]

Why is this in the Basses forum?

So you can get a post in before the mods see it and move it to the correct forum.

 

[Chef]

No.
Scales have not ruined music.

 

[jallenbass]

No.
Scales have not ruined music.

Agreed.

 

[chuck3]

Bach was jamming with Miles Davis

does anyone know where I can get that CD?

 

[bassman314]

I thought a chord was 2 or more bass players playing the same note

 

[HeadyVan Halen]

Scales haven't ruined music, players that ONLY play scales is what she's talking about.
You think CK doesn't know scales? Right.
It's just like the English language. Just think everytime someone asked you "How's it going?"
And you said 'I am fine. Things are going great. Thanks for asking' in a monotone voice..got to have some style/swag whatever the kids call it these days


P.S. I can't read...no, no not music, words. I don't even know how I typed this

 

[Root 5]

Actually, 2 notes is a harmony, not a chord. A chord is always 3 or more notes.

False.

 

[Nev375]

Scales were great for light rock or light jazz, but then heavy metal came along and screwed everything up.

 

[topo morto]

Twelve Tone Equal temperament has ruined music. "Classical music" in the 20th century pushed a lot further and a lot more experimentally into the area of unequal temperaments. Harry Partsch was one composer who chose not to make the compromise of composing for 12TET and instead pushed for microtonal composition.

Before reading the full OP, that was the kind of way I read the thread title too... insofar as there are too many people who think scales are the most fundamental idea in harmony... there even seem to be a few in this thread...

 

[Turock]

This is now semantics (and not as important IMO as the original thread), but I've always been taught that a chord is 2 or more notes.

Wikipedia quote:
Otto Karolyi writes that "two or more notes sounded simultaneously are known as a chord..."

There is not enough information provided by two notes to define a chord. Anyone who believes that two notes make a chord, I challenge them to name one of those two note chords.

 

[Root 5]

There is not enough information provided by two notes to define a chord. Anyone who believes that two notes make a chord, I challenge them to name one of those two note chords.

You can get away with playing only two notes because the listener's ears will hear what's missing; the missing note is/are implied. You may choose to play the root-five. You may choose to play the root(tonic) and a colour tone - like a seventh, ninth, or thirteenth; you may omit the tonic and play the third and seventh, for example.

Ok: I'll cite Guy Capuzzo, Ph.D in music theory from the University of Rockester, NY.
" A chord is two or more notes played at the same time."

 

[topo morto]

There is not enough information provided by two notes to define a chord.

A lot of people do think of a chord as 3 or more notes, And I agree that that's the more traditional definition, and it is good to know what words mean...

...but at the end of the day, words should mean useful things. Maybe the definition of chord as '3 or more notes' is silly. Why is 3 a magic number? why not 2, or 4, or 29?

Do we have a meaningful word for '2 or more notes playing together', which is a more useful meaning?

 

[Turock]

You can get away with playing only two notes because the listener's ears will hear what's missing; the missing note is/are implied. You may choose to play the root-five. You may choose to play the root(tonic) and a colour tone - like a seventh, ninth, or thirteenth; you may omit the tonic and play the third and seventh, for example.

Ok: I'll cite Guy Capuzzo, Ph.D in music theory from the University of Rockester, NY.
" A chord is two or more notes played at the same time."

Name one.

 

[topo morto]

You can get away with playing only two notes because the listener's ears will hear what's missing; the missing note is/are implied.

There's nothing to say there's necessarily anything 'missing' when you play two notes together.

I agree that in certain contexts a listener's ear may 'join the dots', but sometimes dots are just dots, with no joining to be done.

 

[Turock]

A lot of people do think of a chord as 3 or more notes, And I agree that that's the more traditional definition, and it is good to know what words mean...

...but at the end of the day, words should mean useful things. Maybe the definition of chord as '3 or more notes' is silly. Why is 3 a magic number? why not 2, or 4, or 29?

Do we have a meaningful word for '2 or more notes playing together', which is a more useful meaning?

Why three (or more)? Because three is the minimum number of notes required to define a chord.

 

[Tehrin Cole]

Well,first of all,chords are derived from scales!As are melodies.
I think what she's speaking of are players who have alot of chops,and can't reign them in!
In other words,players who play inappropiately on a musical situation that may only require you to play only the most basic of elements.
As a bassist,your main 2 jobs are to 1:Carry the rhythm,and 2:Shore up the harmony!
As a musician,your job is to serve the music meaning,no matter how proficient you are on your instrument,you have to respect the music,and the composer.
I have alot of chops,...alot! However,when you hear,or see me play,90% of the time,I'm playing bass,...I'm on the bottom.

I want you to understand where she's coming from,when she says that!
Scales are paramount to music,and you learn them whether you realize it,or not.(she'll probably be the first one to tell you this).

Who she's referring are cats with alot of chops who are more about themselves,than they are about respecting,and serving the music at hand!

 

[Turock]

Well,first of all,chords are derived from scales!As are melodies.
I think what she's speaking of are players who have alot of chops,and can't reign them in!
In other words,players who play inappropiately on a musical situation that may only require you to play only the most basic of elements.
As a bassist,your main 2 jobs are to 1:Carry the rhythm,and 2:Shore up the harmony!
As a musician,your job is to serve the music meaning,no matter how proficient you are on your instrument,you have to respect the music,and the composer.
I have alot of chops,...alot! However,when you hear,or see me play,90% of the time,I'm playing bass,...I'm on the bottom.

I want you to understand where she's coming from,when she says that!
Scales are paramount to music,and you learn them whether you realize it,or not.(she'll probably be the first one to tell you this).

Who she's referring are cats with alot of chops who are more about themselves,than they are about respecting,and serving the music at hand!

I believe you're right.