Double Bass Hearing yourself on a gig

[SRL]

Last week I played a (typical for me) gig - small bar, indifferent audience, no PA, small group (on this occasion guitar, sax and DB), we're jammed into as small an area as possible...

Lack of space dictates that my Shuttle 3-10T is on the floor beside me - there is no space to even put it on a chair to get it closer to my ear. When we play the buzz of conversation gets louder - I do not have a problem with this, folk want to have a good time. But I cannot hear myself - I think there's no point increasing volume as it'll piss off the punters, the bar owner and ultimately it's a battle I cannot win.

My first thought was 'I need a more direct pickup' (rather than the Ehrlund EAP) but I remember having this problem before I had the Ehrlund. So I start thinking about the amp.

The problem as I see it is that I'm too close to it - the sound from the speaker doesn't arrive at my ear therefore my options are: -
1. Put the amp on it's back so the speaker points directly up at me; or
2. Buy a small passive PA speaker that connect to the extra output on the shuttle head and put that on top of the amp pointing up at me; or
3. Get hold of an amp like a PJB flightcase (or Super Flightcase) with up firing speakers; or
4. Buy a headphone amp and use it as a personal monitor system; or
5. Something else....

Any thoughts?

It's only a problem because whenever I can't hear myself I dig in more - and of course it doesn't do any good.

Steve

 

[Eric Hochberg]

Try facing it towards the back wall. You'll get a lot of reflection of sound and I bet you'll hear yourself better.

 

[Phil Rowan]

+1 to what Eric said. Also, might sound silly but have you tried just putting your ear up to the side of the fingerboard/neck as you play? IME this usually helps me hear myself in loud situations like that. Is it possible at all to put your amp in front of you so it acts like a wedge monitor? A small portable personal PA like the Mackie SRM150 might help too, especially since it can be mounted on a mic stand. Maybe hi-fi earplugs like those made my Etymotic?

 

[Ric Vice]

Lack of space dictates that my Shuttle 3-10T is on the floor beside me - there is no space to even put it on a chair to get it closer to my ear. When we play the buzz of conversation gets louder - I do not have a problem with this, folk want to have a good time. But I cannot hear myself - I think there's no point increasing volume as it'll piss off the punters, the bar owner and ultimately it's a battle I cannot win.

1. Put the amp on it's back so the speaker points directly up at me; or

I don’t this would work very well, as most speakers are designed to work on a vertical axis, with the exception of the Acoustic Image down firing 10’s. Up firing speakers, are a different matter altogether. Seems, like the speaker would be “fighting gravity” using it that way.

2. Buy a small passive PA speaker that connect to the extra output on the shuttle head and put that on top of the amp pointing up at me; or

Seems like this would be a good thing to try, except for the additional gear you’re going to have to carry around. Mackie makes a small powered one, that a couple of TB members like.

3. Get hold of an amp like a PJB flightcase (or Super Flightcase) with up firing speakers; or

One of our TB members Treyzer found that the Super Flight Case and Ehrlund EAP, with its Preamp, didn’t work well together. He ended up sending the pickup it back for a refund

4. Buy a headphone amp and use it as a personal monitor system; or

Once again, this would be complicated, and probably not worth the effort IME, IMHO

5. Something else....

Any thoughts?Steve

Possibly, I like the Ampwedge. It will raise the front of your cabinet to varying heights, it’s small, lightweight, and has a small footpring. I use one all the time.
Link Removed

Steve[/QUOTE]

 

[KCLRbass]

IEMs have saved my life. I highly recommend in-ears if you don't have a lot of space and are struggling to hear yourself. I can always hear myself now.

 

[Huy Nguyen]

I'm getting a speaker stand. I've always liked the ideaand play the best when the amp is up at ear or chest level. I own a PJB Flightcase 150 (upfiring speakers) and the speaker on a stand is still a better option.

 

[Treyzer]

All rooms have different acoustics; If you're not on tour with a good sound man who is usually paid to deal with all the sound issues, you alone have to deal with the acoustics of the venue you're playing in:

Some places have low ceilings, some have very high ceilings and there are all kinds of floor and wall surfaces to consider; brick, carpet, wood, glass:

How and where I set my amp and how I set my IQ (small joke) depends more on the room than any other factor; In addition, as strange as it may sound, air pressure and humidity also have some effect on the sound your getting;

I've been playing for some time and have yet to find a one size fits all approach; How and where I set my amp/speaker and the EQ settings I use while playing in a very large hotel foyer with 2 story floor to ceiling glass walls, doesn't necessarily work in a much smaller room that has a wood floor, 9 ft ceilings and sheetrock/plaster walls; It really just comes down to using your ears as well as what sounds good to you; that also changes every day

(I'm using semi-colons as the period button on my keyboard died) :-(

 

[Michael Eisenman]

(I'm using semi-colons as the period button on my keyboard died) :-(

Does your keyboard have a number pad? There's a decimal point there.

 

[Treyzer]

Does your keyboard have a number pad? There's a decimal point there.

No Michael, I'm on a Mac

Thanks for trying to find a workaround!

 

[Treyzer]

One of our TB members Treyzer found that the Super Flight Case and Ehrlund EAP, with its Preamp, didn’t work well together. He ended up sending the pickup it back for a refund

Ric, lately I've gone back to my old EA cab and my old Walter Woods Amp, It's heavier, but can be easily loaded in on a dolly; It seems to provide what I'm currently hearing when I need to be amplified (almost always)

 

[SactoBass]

I too was having trouble hearing myself on stage. My solution was building a new bass cab with eight of these drivers in it....

 

[rake]

No personal experience here, but this seems interesting.
Invalid Link Removed

 

[Exploiter8]

If your current rig is a single cab, why not get an additional matching cab? The extra height might be all you need, plus you'll be louder. All of this in the same footprint of your current rig.

X8

 

[Ric Vice]

Ric, lately I've gone back to my old EA cab and my old Walter Woods Amp, It's heavier, but can be easily loaded in on a dolly; It seems to provide what I'm currently hearing when I need to be amplified (almost always)

Treyser,
I forgot you had a Walter Woods. For all of my casual gigs I still use ye old Woods MI-400-8 with a EA VL 108. I've never found a better combination with my bass, Evah Parazzi Weichs, and the Ehrlund. I have a VL 208, it's a nice box but at 48 lbs it's not coming out of the house. The Audiokenisis TC 112 does all the heavy lifting, paired with a Walter Woods Ultra. I've tried other amps, but other than my Ampeg B-15N(C) which has a nice retro vintage sound, but weighs 80 lbs, I've always prefer the Walter's amps. There are lighter amps, but I'm not convinced there's any thing better out there, at least for me. I think the're worth their weight in gold and if you wanted to buy one these days, you would have to use that gold for the purchase.



Ric

 

[SRL]

Thank you (everyone) for your suggestions.

I think first thing to try is turning the amp round to reflect off the back wall. After that .... I may have to open my wallet (moth balls and all).

Hdiddy, how do you find the Ehrlund with the Flightcase 150? (I worked my way through the long EAP thread and saw that MrSidecar got on ok with it - so I'd be interested to hear your take.)

Steve