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Honesty on the forums about items for sale

#21
ebonalley said:
I agree that its the responsibility for the buyer to ask the critical questions. However, I also feel that the seller has a responsibility for full disclosure. I was more thinking of the OP's situation where the seller was apparently not meeting their end of the bargain and had the OP not asked the right questions, he may have been "mislead".
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Again, no. If you discover that the seller has been less than truthful BEFORE you buy the bass, then why would you buy it in the first place? It would seem that the logical person would just walk from that particular purchase, rather than buying the item, only to leave negative feedback for something that happened BEFORE the sale.
 
#22
gigslut said:
I've done a lot of selling on CL and ebay. In addition to full disclosure, I've found that if you rate your items' condition conservatively, buyers are usually pleasantly surprised when they receive the item or arrive to inspect it, and have less leverage to haggle or complain after the fact.
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That is EXACTLY what I do whether I am selling a bass or amplifier here, or if I am seling golf equipment (I have had a golf club fitting/clubmaking/repair business for more than 24 years). I find that by rating things conservatively (say "9.0 out of 10", when an item is in virtually mint condition, or "good used condition" when something is closer to excellent-plus), it always results in happy buyers.
 
#23
There's a lot of good stuff in the original post but I don't think most situations are so very clear cut. I've bought and sold way too many things here and nearly all were great transactions. Occasionally things arrive in worse condition than I expect, I personally see that as a normal risk. If the difference is too much I'll ask to return it or get a partial refund but that's very rare.
What makes things hard is people's very different ideas of condition. I try to write a good description but I don't go into as much detail as I used to. I find many people who contact me don't read even half of what I write so I end up answering a lot of questions either way. I try to take good pictures but some colors are really hard to capture accurately, as is minor damage. I don't see talking to people about a piece of gear as a waste of time, it's a normal part of the selling process.
I definitely don't see variation in description detail or picture quality as an honesty issue.
 
#24
Its too bad there isn't a standard layout for a post on the classifieds, kindof like unofficial rules about it. Some of the best deals you find in the classifieds, like one pick of headstock, one of body(front and back of both) one of electronics, and whatever else is important. Maybe highlight the dings and scratches, some people look for beaten instruments to refinish, don't let the instruments history be a bad selling point, make it personal tell its story like a battle scar!
 
#25
I bought a bass recently from a TBer and he forgot to disclose the case was completely destroyed.... Literally you could pull the bottom of the case a bit and see the bass.

Happy with the bass and not worried about the case as I just happened to have another one (complete fluke), but most TBer's would go nuts.

Great post and let's ensure bad feedback is given when items are not as represented....
 
#26
Caveat emptor, ask lots of questions before buying. I don't care where you're buying, if it's online there will always be unscrupulous sellers.

The worst sellers are the ones who disclose all the little flaws, one by one, but "forget" to mention the big deal-killing flaw like a big chunk of wood missing on the back of the neck. Or the pedal that only works with batteries, and not at all with an adaptor.

Most of my TB transactions have been with great members here, but there have been a few duds.

The most disheartening was with a seller who was actually a moderator here for a while (in the GFS forum!). He was selling a SB-2 and mentioned loads of little nicks, compression bumps, the cracked pickguard, etc....

...but failed to mention this gaping repair hole, half of which was visible even with the neck mounted. And the sloppy re-glue job from when the fretboard was lifted off. Unbelievable.

9f824a41.jpg


Of course I immediately demanded a refund. He refused, saying he already spent the money on medical bills. I flipped the bass (with full disclosure and pics) on another bass forum, lost $150 in the process.

Bottom line....caveat emptor. Always.
Edited for spelling errors.
 
#27
ebonalley said:
I agree that its the responsibility for the buyer to ask the critical questions. However, I also feel that the seller has a responsibility for full disclosure. I was more thinking of the OP's situation where the seller was apparently not meeting their end of the bargain and had the OP not asked the right questions, he may have been "mislead".
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guy n. cognito said:
Again, no. If you discover that the seller has been less than truthful BEFORE you buy the bass, then why would you buy it in the first place? It would seem that the logical person would just walk from that particular purchase, rather than buying the item, only to leave negative feedback for something that happened BEFORE the sale.
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I agree, a wise person would walk away from the transaction however, if you don't somehow identify what's going on, then you are passively condoning the behavior, which ultimately hurts the community. I imagine that a PM to the seller would probably be appropriate in most cases.
 
#28
guy n. cognito said:
You know, I've bought dozen of instruments from folks on this forum, and the vast majority are honest. It's certainly not enough of an issue to avoid the practice altogether.
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Don't get me wrong, I wasn't specifically implying members on TB I was implying buying equipment online in general. I'm sure most of the people selling stuff on TB are honest people.
 
#30
I agree, there is nothing like being lied to....I have sold a lot of stuff on Gearslutz through the years and listed everything I could about the item, even though I only have a crappy ipod for pics and they do NOT look good at all, I try and list bad things that even I have a haRd time seeing, then when they get the item they are pleasantly surprised!
 
#32
Same here. I had a GREAT buying experience with a bass I got from (BIGJE2) the TB classifieds. I think the reason is that we spend so much time talking on here, it really helps us get to know each other, and makes the buying experience a little less nerve wracking. Dunno. It worked for me.

I didn't know about being able to leave feedback though. Someone tell me how? The guy I bought from (BIGJE2) was a very standup guy, and I'd definitely like to be able to leave a great feedback.
 
#34
Sometimes people don't know, though.

I sold a fretless Fender P bass to Baird6869 who has posted in this very thread. (Nice to see you!). I am not a big Fender connaisseur. As soon as we met about the bass, he pointed out that the tuners were not original. I had not included that in my post because I really had no idea. It didn't wreck the deal, but I guess it could have.

We don't all have the same knowledge about basses, much less about what is original and what isn't. It's important to keep in mind when you buy.

John
 
#35
I agree as well. Most of my deals have been positive on the receiving end. Not long ago I traded a near mint, modded, Lakland JO5 for a US Fender Jazz! Trader conveniently forget to mention the stock Fender tuners were replaced with Hipshots. I later identified the person as a 'flipper'. He immediately posted my bass for sale here and on eBay!

On the other side of the coin.....I have sold/traded 2 basses (at different times) that turned out to have neck issues. I honestly did not know about them as I know nothing about necks, setups, bass building, etc. I just didn't know. One guy just dealt with it and I compensated the second guy for his troubles.

Having said that, I usually take clear and detailed pics and type a concise description of what I'm selling/trading. Full disclosure to the best of my knowledge.

Lastly.....ads with vague descriptions and horrible photos are a huge turn-off!! Be a salesman! Learn how to 'sell'!
 
#38
Everybody has different standards. Here's how I protect myself when buying: I ask the seller to describe and send pics of any flaws or blems that make the item not mint or not factory original. I also only pay with PayPal, so I have recourse if the item arrives not as described.
 
#39
I think the most important thing is to make it right if anybody is ever dissatisfied. Just take the item back and work out shipping costs based on the circumstances. Even with good intentions sometimes people just have different ideas about condition and price (which in a perfect world would be a good proxy for condition).

I'd only ever go to negative feedback if return/refund was refused.
 
#40
AltGrendel said:
I just wish that if someone lists a fretless bass or neck that they list if it's lined or unlined in the thread title.
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A few peeves of mine beyond the basic "just be honest for crying out loud!" bits :)

1. Add a 'lined' or 'unlined' to your thread title for fretless ads

2. Close the thread by using the thread tools pull down - if the icon on the thread doesn't change to a lock the thread is open.

3. If someone leaves you feedback, and you simply reply to the feedback they left you, they don't get feedback. Click on the number in their profile and leave them a proper feedback if they left you one (I've as much feedback like this as I've received)

I've had a lot of good experiences here, with great folks. Got my main bass here as well from SparkDog a while back, but not everything has gone as smoothly as it could have. It is a process that usually works though, and we should keep it that way.
 

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