How Could I Increase the Volume of my Setup?

[ThinCrappyTone]

I have a '72 Ampeg V4 amp (non-bass), and a modern Ampeg 810e cabinet (probably early 2000s?), and I play an '86 MIJ Jazz Bass Special through the rig with nothing but a cable between the bass and amp head. My band's g*****rist plays through a ~2000 Marshall JCM Slash Signature half stack, at 50W (100W capable), and is turned up to typically about 8 (when his rig is turned up to 100W even on 2-3 it drowns out my setup). My rig typically cannot compete with his, and I was hoping to get suggestions for increasing the volume of my setup. Should I splurge and get a 2x15 additional cab with a slave amp (to keep the tone of the tubes from my main amp), or do you think that this situation doesn't seem typical and that I should service my amp to see if there may be a problem with it? Or do you think that replacing the pickups on the bass may be enough to increase the volume? Or is there another method that I haven't considered that you could recommend? Thanks in advance!

This has probably been said, but your guitarist needs to turn the hell down

 

[joel406]

Galien Kruger MB800

Mesa subway D-800+

With your existing speakers that would fix your problems.

Oh yeah turn down the Guitar.

 

[74hc]

Is your GP deaf?

First reply nails it!

Sounds like I would not be as concern about volume at this point, but the longevity of my ears.

 

[BillyBA]

Replace the knobs on your amp with these

 

[lfmn16]

I'm 64 and played a lot when Marshall amps were just about the only thing guitar players used (70's) and a V4 or V4-B no matter what you are using for a cab will just not keep up with a Marshall if the guy plays it loud and they are supposed to be played loud, some of you guys must be playing cocktail music. I owned a V4-B back in the day and while it was a nice head and sounded pretty good it absolutely did not have enough oomph to keep up with a Marshall amp in fact most guys who played in bands with them used an SVT head with either two SVT cabs (8x10) or two V4-B cabs or both. I used to use my V4-b only for rehearsal. One more thing that head is only going to put out 100 watts no matter how you got the gain or the master volume set, it will just get more dirty sounding, the cleanest and hence the loudest way is to set the master (power amp volume) on 10 and use the gain (preamp volume) as the volume control, that is exactly the way a non-master amp works, they have no master the power amp is up all the way and the volume is controlled by the volume control (gain).

Back in the old days we didn't have PAs that could carry the load. My guitar player has a ridiculous setup (two Marshall heads, two 4X12 cabinets) but he knows where the volume knob is. We get asked to turn UP by soundmen far more often than we get asked to turn down.

 

[Ric5]

Not if you have an SVT.

What did you say?

Sorry my ears are still ringing

 

[bobyoung53]

Back in the old days we didn't have PAs that could carry the load. My guitar player has a ridiculous setup (two Marshall heads, two 4X12 cabinets) but he knows where the volume knob is. We get asked to turn UP by soundmen far more often than we get asked to turn down.

Yeah I think most people nowadays realize that playing too loud drives everyone up in the band. I jammed with a guy who had a 50 watt Marshall last week and he didn't blow us out the door, I did bring my SVT though. Another thing is that back in the olden days Marshall's didn't have master volume controls and you had to crank them up to get THAT sound but that being said those were and still are by far the best sounding guitar amps I've ever heard. I would gladly trade today's buzzy sounding guitar amps for a Marshall that roars from from the early 70's or 60's.

 

[bobyoung53]

What did you say?

Sorry my ears are still ringing

I've been using them for over 40 years and have very good hearing and my ears have never rung from my SVT either single or double cab, now cymbals, snares and other guitar players are a different story.

 

[lfmn16]

Another thing is that back in the olden days Marshall's didn't have master volume controls and you had to crank them up to get THAT sound but that being said those were and still are by far the best sounding guitar amps I've ever heard. I would gladly trade today's buzzy sounding guitar amps for a Marshall that roars from from the early 70's or 60's.

Good point. I play guitar in a trio and use a Marshall 100 and 4X12 cabinet. In rehearsal we could almost sing without a PA because we keep the volume really low (keep it low on stage too). I use ear plugs no matter how quietly we play. I have a friend that had to quit playing because the tinnitus got so bad. I've got the religion now.

 

[bobyoung53]

Good point. I play guitar in a trio and use a Marshall 100 and 4X12 cabinet. In rehearsal we could almost sing without a PA because we keep the volume really low (keep it low on stage too). I use ear plugs no matter how quietly we play. I have a friend that had to quit playing because the tinnitus got so bad. I've got the religion now.

That's too bad, I've been lucky I guess but I always try to stay away from cymbals, snares and loud guitarists. I've never been able to wear ear plugs, takes me right out of the rock n roll reality.

 

[Ric5]

I've been using them for over 40 years and have very good hearing and my ears have never rung from my SVT either single or double cab, now cymbals, snares and other guitar players are a different story.

When I encounter drummers and guitars that are too loud I stop playing and plug my ears ... sooner or later they get the message ...

But to this day there are drummers and guitar players who hate me for that ... but I say screw them

So whenever I see the guitars playing through sealed 4x12 cabs that is a huge red flag of warning to me.

 

[rtav]

 

[Bassmec]

A lot of tube guitar heads, especially marshalls, sound like crap with the volume below 6 or so. I would keep him on the 50w mode, but I wouldnt expect it to sound great if he turns down much. It isnt unreasonable to want to play guitar through a 50w head and have it turned past halfway. Thats really where those heads come alive, and they sound brittle before it.

Your 100w tube head is not enough. V4s are great heads but unless you are running a stereo rig with another head, it probably will struggle. They can compete with 20w tube heads but not 50+.

I would sell it to a guitarist (guitarists love those) for $700 and grab something else. Maybe a traynor 200w or 300w, or a peavey 300w. If you miss some of that ampeg bite, grab a tech 21 VT bass pedal.

We run a Sunn Concert Bass (a conservative 200w) with a VT bass pedal into an efficient peavey 215D. Keeps up with a marshall 50w head run stereo with a marshall 100w head. All tube.

A decent quality power soak would help out, getting good power valve and transformer saturation for guitar at lower levels.X
We would do that in the studio anyway because the output of a decent quality ribbon microphone like a Royer R121, won't be improved by sticking it in front of a cab at stupid loud.X

 

[lfmn16]

That's too bad, I've been lucky I guess but I always try to stay away from cymbals, snares and loud guitarists. I've never been able to wear ear plugs, takes me right out of the rock n roll reality.

I used to feel like that until I played with a drummer that smacked his snare drum so hard it physically hurt. I started wearing earplugs and have worn them almost every gig since, no matter how quietly we play. To each his own.

 

[Nev375]

Is your GP deaf?

He's workin' on it.

 

[Stumbo]

A decent quality power soak would help out, getting good power valve and transformer saturation for guitar at lower levels.
We would do that in the studio anyway because the output of a decent quality ribbon microphone like a Royer R121, won't be improved by sticking it in front of a cab at stupid loud.X

My thoughts exactly. Seems to me guitarists playing that loud want attention rather than sitting well in the mix.

 

[mpdd]

One guy I play with has the Rolling Stones 410 ampeg guitar combo and that amp is ungodly loud and will not distort or go into overdrive until it's at passenger jet type volume. He was cool enough to just bi amp his ac15 and fender tube combo so I could actually hear myself.

 

[jam.majors]

If I decide to ditch tubes this looks promising! Thanks!

I don't think you need necessarily (fully) ditch the tubes. If the V4 allows for running at no load, you can get the quilter and slave into it. Then you also have a back-up head.
Or, if the V4 allows running at 8 ohms, you can run the v4 into one of the discrete 410s of that 810e you have, and slave into the quilter for the other 410 (being careful to balance the power output). (Per this link yours may allow for 8ohm operation.)

 

[Funkmabassup]

If you play with really loud guitars a 100w amp for bass is no good imao

 

[dbsfgyd1]

I have a '72 Ampeg V4 amp (non-bass), and a modern Ampeg 810e cabinet (probably early 2000s?), and I play an '86 MIJ Jazz Bass Special through the rig with nothing but a cable between the bass and amp head. My band's g*****rist plays through a ~2000 Marshall JCM Slash Signature half stack, at 50W (100W capable), and is turned up to typically about 8 (when his rig is turned up to 100W even on 2-3 it drowns out my setup). My rig typically cannot compete with his, and I was hoping to get suggestions for increasing the volume of my setup. Should I splurge and get a 2x15 additional cab with a slave amp (to keep the tone of the tubes from my main amp), or do you think that this situation doesn't seem typical and that I should service my amp to see if there may be a problem with it? Or do you think that replacing the pickups on the bass may be enough to increase the volume? Or is there another method that I haven't considered that you could recommend? Thanks in advance!

Adding speaker area is the least expensive way to add decibels, besides threatening your guitarist with death if he doesn’t turn down. One other over looked suggestion is for you to make sure you aren’t waisting your wattage on frequencies you can’t hear in a combo setting, like ultra lows. Try boosting your low mids 200-250 and cut the sub bass touch. That isn’t going to sound real great playing by yourself, but when your are playing with others, it will ride nicely in the mix.