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How do I get the Thumb Bass sound using a Non Thumb?

#81
bongostealth said:
In my opinion, the Thumb NT 5 is THE best sounding Thumb because of the pickup placement, as the pickups are closer to the bridge, and because of the Bubinga. The 4 and 6 string versions have slightly different pickup placements (less close to the bridge) which yield a slightly less aggressive tone. Therefore, below is my input in their respective order of importance (according to my experience).

1) The first and foremost thing to getting close to the Thumb tone is to emulate the Thumb 5's pickup placement.

2) You will want to use in-line split-coil pickups just like the MECs on the Thumb NT (or find a pair of used MEC pickups here on TB or eBay). Barts are a popular choice but they tend to be warmer and tamer. The MECs are the more original choice because they are brighter and have a "bouncier" tone, at least to my ears.

3) Pair the pickups with a 3-band preamp. Mids are an integral part of the equation.

4) The Thumb NT is mainly made out of Bubinga. Bubinga is a fairly bright-sounding wood. Therefore, even if you use a bass made mostly out of maple, you will get very close to a Thumb NT sound.
Click to expand...

Does the aggressiveness come mostly from the pickup placement on the 5?

A 6 string bolt on Bubinga with 2 band EQ would be:
1. less aggressive.
2. less sustain.
3. due to the 2 band, getting that 5 string mid growl would be difficult.

There are a bunch of 6 string Bubinga and Wenge combo with 2 bands on sale. But as some others have noted, 2 band eq just might not cut it.....
 
#82
anavar said:
Thumb nt player checking in

nothing sounds like a thumb. Nothing. I have played and owned many warwicks and while corvettes and streamers can get close, once you pop it in a mix and pop some fresh strings on it, its a different ball game.

my suggesting is to look for a Korean Pro series (which i have owned) and boost it with a clean preamp or compressor. Fresh Dr Lo-riders also help.

also wood has ZERO affect on it. I have owned thumbs made of Bubinga/ebony/ovangkol others were ovangkol/maple/wenge and my current one its made of ash/walnut/ebony/wenge/purple heart and they all sounded the same.

save up, get a thumb and never look back.
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It's interesting you say that the wood has zero effect. The 4, 5 , and 6 have different pickup placements and that many people say the placement affect the tone a lot.

I just have to go to a store that has different configurations of the thumb and just try them out side by side.
 
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#83
jpTron said:
I have a Warwick Thumb 5 BO. I changed out the pre for an Aguilar 2 band. Before the swap people would compliment my bass. After the swap people would compliment my tone. It made it really cut through and growl like never before. That could be a cheaper route for you.
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I gotta look into this. I like to play the 6 string and my Corvette is a 6 string too. The 6 BO is easier to find at a cheaper price than the 5 BO. 6 string BO Thumbs don't get a lot of love or attention. LOL
 
#84
AciDBatH666 said:
Part of the reason the thumb has that tone is that it's got stacked pickups in the bridge. I was in the market for a Dingwall, and then they came out with the NG-2 which instead of having a bridge and neck pickup like in the standard Combustions, it came with stacked bridge pickups and the Darkglass Tone Capsule which has low and high mid controls. It's not the same as a thumb, but I can get a similar tone out of it with the on board electronics and pickup location. Also the 4 point switch gives even more options for tone differences (Front pickup, rear pickup, Both in series, both in parallel).
So that's an option that's *relatively* cheaper
Click to expand...

I tried this with a Dingwall Z3 that I had briefly before I sold it. It didn't work. Could be my lack of patience.
Well a new Z3 6 string is on the way in about a...... year or so. I'll give that a try too.

I did get a P kind of sound out the Z3 though. LOL
 
#89
Whippet said:
Is the top a tone wood or cosmetic? Let me guess the price...... 5500 USD?
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cosmetic man. I don't subscribe to the idea that wood has an affect on tone.

so long as it looks good, feels good and is structurally sound, im happy :)

price was um.......high. lets put it that way lol.
 
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#90
Whippet said:
Does the aggressiveness come mostly from the pickup placement on the 5?

A 6 string bolt on Bubinga with 2 band EQ would be:
1. less aggressive.
2. less sustain.
3. due to the 2 band, getting that 5 string mid growl would be difficult.

There are a bunch of 6 string Bubinga and Wenge combo with 2 bands on sale. But as some others have noted, 2 band eq just might not cut it.....
Click to expand...

I will answer your question in its corresponding order:

1. My observation has been that the Thumb 5 is more aggressive due absolutely to the pickup placement. Even the Thumb 5 2-band bolt-on is more aggressive than the 4 and 6 Thumbs because of the pickup placement. In my opinion the reasons are as follows:
a) The Thumb 5 uses two jazz-shaped pickups. Because they are naturally slim-shaped pickups, they are placed closer together and are also both placed closer to the bridge because they fit there. Not only that, but those are split-coil pickups with the two coils placed in-line within the pickup, thus saving space and allowing both pickups to be placed closer together and closer to the bridge. This placement allows the pickups to capture that low-mid nasally attack naturally present close to the bridge due to the higher tension around the bridge. (This is how Jaco got his tone when panning to the bridge pickup only). Also, notice that the slant of the pickups is parallel to the bridge saddles, allowing for even distances from the bridge saddles across the strings. Thus, providing consistent attack across the strings. This is why some builders, such as Dingwall, will slant their pickups parallel to the slanted placement of the bridge saddles.
b) The Thumb 4, however, uses the exact same pickups but places the neck pickup further away from the bridge and closer to the neck. This reduces some of the low-mid and nasally attack because the neck pickup is capturing a "floppier" vibration, which is more present the closer to the neck you go. Not only that, but the neck pickup is placed perpendicular to the strings and not slanted parallel to the bridge saddles.
c) The Thumb 6 uses two soapbar-shaped pickups which are also split-coil. However, the coils in those pickups are placed just as you would find in a P pickup, and the treble coil is closer to the neck with the bass coil closer to the bridge. Now, the soapbars are not thin like the jazz pickups. Therefore, they are not placed as close together, and together are not placed as close to the bridge, although they are both slanted parallel to the slant of the bridge saddles. Combine all of that with the P placement of the coils, and this is why the Thumb 6 also has slightly less attack than the 5.

2) With regards to sustain, I could not tell you because I've never really paid attention to that other than I know that my notes have always rung fine.

3) Yes, the bolt-ons have 2-band pre-amps. And yes, mids is an integral part of the equation. But this is easily remedied by installing a 3-band pre-amp.

I hope this helps.
 
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#91
Whippet said:
Does the aggressiveness come mostly from the pickup placement on the 5?

A 6 string bolt on Bubinga with 2 band EQ would be:
1. less aggressive.
2. less sustain.
3. due to the 2 band, getting that 5 string mid growl would be difficult.

There are a bunch of 6 string Bubinga and Wenge combo with 2 bands on sale. But as some others have noted, 2 band eq just might not cut it.....
Click to expand...
The bolt on is supposedly more naturally mid-range-y from what I've heard; so the mids are already there and kinda makes up for not having a mid knob. I never touch the onboard eq, but you could always do the 'poor man's mid bump' by cutting the bass and treble slightly. I'm also going by my BO 5 string so IDK if the 6 would be any different. On a side note, I gotta say that my Warwick sounds the same unplugged (growly as hell) as it does plugged in, so it's more about the construction of the bass itself than the onboard pre.
 
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#93
bongostealth said:
I will answer your question in its corresponding order:

1. My observation has been that the Thumb 5 is more aggressive due absolutely to the pickup placement. Even the Thumb 5 2-band bolt-on is more aggressive than the 4 and 6 Thumbs because of the pickup placement. In my opinion the reasons are as follows:
a) The Thumb 5 uses two jazz-shaped pickups. Because they are naturally slim-shaped pickups, they are placed closer together and are also both placed closer to the bridge because they fit there. Not only that, but those are split-coil pickups with the two coils placed in-line within the pickup, thus saving space and allowing both pickups to be placed closer together and closer to the bridge. This placement allows the pickups to capture that low-mid nasally attack naturally present close to the bridge due to the higher tension around the bridge. (This is how Jaco got his tone when panning to the bridge pickup only). Also, notice that the slant of the pickups is parallel to the bridge saddles, allowing for even distances from the bridge saddles across the strings. Thus, providing consistent attack across the strings. This is why some builders, such as Dingwall, will slant their pickups parallel to the slanted placement of the bridge saddles.
b) The Thumb 4, however, uses the exact same pickups but places the neck pickup further away from the bridge and closer to the neck. This reduces some of the low-mid and nasally attack because the neck pickup is capturing a "floppier" vibration, which is more present the closer to the neck you go. Not only that, but the neck pickup is placed perpendicular to the strings and not slanted parallel to the bridge saddles.
c) The Thumb 6 uses two soapbar-shaped pickups which are also split-coil. However, the coils in those pickups are placed just as you would find in a P pickup, and the treble coil is closer to the neck with the bass coil closer to the bridge. Now, the soapbars are not thin like the jazz pickups. Therefore, they are not placed as close together, and together are not placed as close to the bridge, although they are both slanted parallel to the slant of the bridge saddles. Combine all of that with the P placement of the coils, and this is why the Thumb 6 also has slightly less attack than the 5.

2) With regards to sustain, I could not tell you because I've never really paid attention to that other than I know that my notes have always rung fine.

3) Yes, the bolt-ons have 2-band pre-amps. And yes, mids is an integral part of the equation. But this is easily remedied by installing a 3-band pre-amp.

I hope this helps.
Click to expand...

Thank you very much for the detailed information. Just what I was looking for. It all makes sense now.

A 5 BO with 2 band in Bubinga Wenge combo converted to 3 band would be one of the answers I could look into.

Once again thank you very much for the info.
 
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#94
jpTron said:
The bolt on is supposedly more naturally mid-range-y from what I've heard; so the mids are already there and kinda makes up for not having a mid knob. I never touch the onboard eq, but you could always do the 'poor man's mid bump' by cutting the bass and treble slightly. I'm also going by my BO 5 string so IDK if the 6 would be any different. On a side note, I gotta say that my Warwick sounds the same unplugged (growly as hell) as it does plugged in, so it's more about the construction of the bass itself than the onboard pre.
Click to expand...

I really have to just try the BO5 vs NT5 at the store. What you say about the bolt on makes sense.

The funny thing is that some of the BO5 made in 2016 have a 3 band eq but the prices on these are high though. The pre2016 didn't have them. The price difference between the BO 2 band and NT 3 band is just so ridiculously different that it makes me wonder if I am getting the full Thumb with a BO.

Bongostealth explained it well so the way to go might be a BO 5 with a 3 band alteration. The 6 string BO with a 3 band alteration might be acceptable but then again that's a whole different thing.

Anwyay thanks for the information. much appreciated.
 
#97
Whippet said:
Ok I gotta try this. I got that red one too. Going to have to go through the toy box and get that old thing out!!!
Click to expand...
It is my magical practice tool. Whenever I join a new band or project and need to bone up on stuff, I use a site that strips audio from youtube videos as an mp3 and then connect my computer to the input and my awesome headphones (in my avatar) in the output, fire up Winamp, and I'm good to go. That's actually what I was doing when the avatar picture was taken.
 
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#99
thumb.png Guitar center has this one for $1249. Bolt on 5. The neck through are super nice but the price is at least $2500. They do sound awesome. I installed a bartolini preamp in one with the original pickups and it sounded even better.
 
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