Double Bass How many of you slack the E string when slapping?

[GretschWretch]

I've been watching jug band videos on YouTube, and it appears most of the bassists who take slap solos have the E string at standard pitch. I know that Bill Black, when he was with Elvis, slacked the E. To me that seems the approach that would be least damaging to your hands. And except for the G, the notes on the E string really are not much used in those genres; in many instances a three-string bass would do fine.

So how many of you are slack slappers and how many slap at standard pitch on the E?

 

[Don Hergert]

Standard pitch for me. FWIW, I don't think I've ever seen a slapper go with the slack E. Keep in mind, that's in the context of bluegrass slappers, I am not very active among RaB slappers, although I watch them whenever I can.

 

[Keith Rawlings]

I’ve never done this but I know two very prominent slappers who use a down tuned bumped set; meaning they use A, D, G and high C strings in place of the standard EADG set. They are psychobilly players and speed is what they need, although I don’t like the floppiness of the strings when tuned this way. The pizz tone definitely loses something and it’s not for me. My $0.02.

 

[bassfiddlesteve]

I've been watching jug band videos on YouTube, and it appears most of the bassists who take slap solos have the E string at standard pitch. I know that Bill Black, when he was with Elvis, slacked the E. To me that seems the approach that would be least damaging to your hands. And except for the G, the notes on the E string really are not much used in those genres; in many instances a three-string bass would do fine.

So how many of you are slack slappers and how many slap at standard pitch on the E?

I don't really think many bass players did this. If you listen to Bill Black's playing on the early Elvis records you can hear fairly conventional slap bass playing. I could be wrong, but I think the slack E string story came from somebody who was unfamiliar with slap bass technique that was trying to explain what they were hearing. A similar thing happened with "Big Noise From Winnetka" by The Bobcats. Many people thought Bob Haggart was employing some sort of new technique until they saw him performing it with drummer Ray Bauduc playing Bob's G string while he fingered the notes.

- Steve

 

[GretschWretch]

I don't really think many bass players did this. If you listen to Bill Black's playing on the early Elvis records you can hear fairly conventional slap bass playing. I could be wrong, but I think the slack E string story came from somebody who was unfamiliar with slap bass technique that was trying to explain what they were hearing. A similar thing happened with "Big Noise From Winnetka" by The Bobcats. Many people thought Bob Haggart was employing some sort of new technique until they saw him performing it with drummer Ray Bauduc playing Bob's G string while he fingered the notes.

- Steve

IIRC, the context for my opinion was a discussion of trying to form Elvis's back-up band, and Black got into the mix because he played slap, thereby obviating the need for a drummer. But I don't remember anything about a slack E.

 

[Who da Ville]

I slap with my E string normally tuned.

I recently listened to an episode of the podcast "Cocaine and Rhinestones" about the history of Country music (recommended if you're into that sort of thing). The narrator/researcher said that in the early country music years, backbeats (and especially drums) were frowned upon because they came from black music, and at many country fans embraced the Caucasian heritage of this music. He said that Elvis toured with a guitarist who slacked his strings and hit on the 2 and 4 beats to provide a backbeat (along with the slap bass, of course), because drums were too blatantly non-country; he could play with a back beat while still appearing to be a string band.

Yes, I agree this whole premise is ironic; Elvis clearly learned his music from watching & listening to black musicians. But in his early career, he played mostly for white, racist, country music fans.

FWIW...

 

[bassfiddlesteve]

IIRC, the context for my opinion was a discussion of trying to form Elvis's back-up band, and Black got into the mix because he played slap, thereby obviating the need for a drummer. But I don't remember anything about a slack E.

I'm confused. In your original post you said "I know that Bill Black, when he was with Elvis, slacked the E."

- Steve

 

[GretschWretch]

I'm confused. In your original post you said "I know that Bill Black, when he was with Elvis, slacked the E."

- Steve

That was a presumption -- possibly mistaken -- on my part. Even if I was correct, the slacking could not have been much or the string would have been too floppy to produce a useful "clack."

 

[Who da Ville]

I totally mis-remembered the story of the slacked guitar hitting on the 2 & 4. On recollection, I think the story was about Hank William's band, sorry for the mis-information.

 

[Keith Rawlings]

I slap with my E string normally tuned.

I recently listened to an episode of the podcast "Cocaine and Rhinestones" about the history of Country music (recommended if you're into that sort of thing). The narrator/researcher said that in the early country music years, backbeats (and especially drums) were frowned upon because they came from black music, and at many country fans embraced the Caucasian heritage of this music. He said that Elvis toured with a guitarist who slacked his strings and hit on the 2 and 4 beats to provide a backbeat (along with the slap bass, of course), because drums were too blatantly non-country; he could play with a back beat while still appearing to be a string band.

Yes, I agree this whole premise is ironic; Elvis clearly learned his music from watching & listening to black musicians. But in his early career, he played mostly for white, racist, country music fans.

FWIW...

That podcast is amazing! I’m waiting for a stand alone Bob Moore episode as well as a Joe Zinkan and Junior Huskey episode somewhere down the line. The A Team episode was wonderfully done but I literally wanted Moore (Bob)!

 

[bobsax]

fascinating... Any links to YouTube would be greatly appreciated

 

[brianrost]

That's weird to think that country bassists slapped to somehow sneak in a backbeat.

Jazz bass players had been slapping back pretty much as soon as the bass started to replace the tuba. One can also hear it in a lot of blues records.





BTW that routine in "Big Noise From Winnetka" was lifted from an old folk fiddling technique called fiddlesticks

 

[Don Hergert]

Jazz bass players had been slapping back pretty much as soon as the bass started to replace the tuba. One can also hear it in a lot of blues records.

Yes!

In his autobiography, Pops Foster, one of the early original slappers in old jazz, discusses slap bass being present around ca. 1900 in the original, primarily black New Orleans jazz circles. And he wasn't the only person doing it. So by the time country music was evolving in the early 1920s, slap bass in jazz would have been pretty well known. Thus if there were racial overtones guiding the development of country music (which wouldn't surprise me), there should have been the same logic in play about both drums and slap bass.

Not to discount the negative effects of racial prejudice, but I think more likely in this case, the emergence of country music in the early 1920s was too early for amplified instruments that could keep up with drums. Thus because acoustic guitars and other acoustic instruments, including double basses, couldn't be heard over them, drums were excluded, similar to traditional bluegrass. In fact, traditional bluegrass might have brought the opposition to drums with it as it evolved out of country and hillbilly music.

BTW, I saw no mention of slacking the E in Pops Foster's biography.