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How to know if you're good?

#61
ibnzneksrul said:
Progressing as a musician is a process, a journey. You never really "arrive" at being "good" - you progress, you grow, you get better, you set goals you want to accomplish, and when you acomplish them you set more goals that you have to keep striving for. You don't measure yourself against other musicians - that either leads to disappointment or feeling superior. You measure yourself against yourself 6 months ago, 2 years ago, 5 years ago. You put the time in to keep improving yourself, and hopefully you have a hell of a lot of fun along the way. ;)
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well said!
 
#62
Phalex said:
Music is the ultimate team sport. Playing bass is more about making the other members of the band look good rather than trying to impress people with your technical prowess.

I would say the measure of how good you are isn't about what you can do that I cannot. It isn't about how long you've been playing or how many basses you own.

It's not even found in the number of other bassists who think you are greatest bass player ever to come out of where ever it is you come out of.

The measure of a bass players worth is found in the number of very talented people that want you to play bass for them.

I have to have some of the best people in my area playing in my band. They are all so much more blessed with ability than I am, yet they genuinely like having me on the team.

Does that have any bearing in a co-operative effort like a gig? Not so much.
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+100

I don't think I'm on par with bassists like Wooten etc

I don't do slap (I can, I just don't like the sound)

I don't do two handed tapping

Yet, I sit in with maybe a dozen bands a month and many of the players are quite older than me (try like 2x)

Why do I get called back or with invites?

because I play very well with people and can pick up on things quickly
 
#63
ibnzneksrul said:
Progressing as a musician is a process, a journey. You never really "arrive" at being "good" - you progress, you grow, you get better, you set goals you want to accomplish, and when you acomplish them you set more goals that you have to keep striving for. You don't measure yourself against other musicians - that either leads to disappointment or feeling superior. You measure yourself against yourself 6 months ago, 2 years ago, 5 years ago. You put the time in to keep improving yourself, and hopefully you have a hell of a lot of fun along the way. ;)
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Exactly what goals should I have acomplished
 
#65
AlphaMale said:
I have to ask you guys this, why do you listen to Bass soloists?
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To get new and different ideas. I've taken just a motif out of a solo I liked, then worked it into a bassline. I listen to the greats for inspiration to continue to explore. I work on soloing a lot because I like improv and its a great learning tool. I don't solo much on gigs most don't call for it, but I'm ready. Also I can find creative outlet in playing tunes, trying to explore new different colors or rhythms. Also just locking in and working with a good drummer is as big a blast as soloing.

You need to remember you are a bass player first and your going to be judged more on how well you hold the bottom together and how well the band as a whole sounds. Soloing for a bassist is a specialty not the norm like other instruments. Be proud be to be a bass player it is the only instrument that can groove to quote Victor Wooten.

Studying improv it is a great teacher. Also work on ear trainning and transcribe all the time both key to becoming a good soloist. Find others to jam with, get a bass teacher and/or find an improv teacher if you can. Also improv teachers don't always play the same instrument you do.

Last you sound young, remember it takes ten years to learn to be a musician. So be patient, study hard, play with others whenever your can no matter what kind of music it is. Most important remember to have fun. :D
 
#66
AlphaMale said:
I've never been out-shredded by anyone playing a shorter time than me but there are people that are better than me that I've met. But I've met about 3 people that have played for 2 and three years that I know I'm better than and other people agree.
How will I know how good I am?

Let's say by (amount of time) I should be able to play (Riff, or Song)

Third Day: ______
Second Week: _____
1st month: _____
6th week: _____
2nd Month: _____
100th Day: _____
6th Month: _____
8th Month: _____
10th Month: _____
1 year : _____



Please thanks for your help.
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:eyebrow: :eyebrow:

/sigh

lemme see if I can recall.

3 days: come as you are by nirvana
2nd week: nib by black sabbath
1st month: i forgot why this matters ?
 
#67
You know you're good when you know where your comfort zone is. You reach a point at which you're confident that you can go and do your thing with anyone, in front of anyone, and while it may not be their favorite style, they'll know you're doing a solid job of holding down the low end. You also know of about a million things you can't do, but that doesn't mean you're not a good player. It just means you're good enough to know what you need to work on.
 
#68
To say you can out shred other players means nothing. Maybe they don't take it seriously as you do but it's an awful way to judge how good you are. Take the advice from here you will become better trust me only if you want to. Post some music and ask for others advice so we can hear your potential.

I have been playing for almost 11 years now and have been coming back and forth reading and taking all that I can from this website since 1999. For the first few years that I've been playing it was a struggle to become the best that I could. I'm 22 years old and holding my own with all my knowledge I gained. You will forever grow and grow and well you get the point. (I've had two alias so far) Honestly I can say that I am like a wise elder in a small foreign town. But to say that would be with all cockiness and an untrue statement in some respects. I have gotten to where I'm at as a bassist and musician/instrumentalist because of what I've taken from here and being a working musician after high school for 3 years.

What does this all mean you ask. Well AlphaMale, you ask how do you know if you are good. The only person that can answer that is you because so far we don't know what you sound like, who you are or what your goals are as a person. I'm in the Navy currently heading to the sandbox like most other military personnel that sacrifice so much. I took it upon myself to give up bass temporarily so I can serve my country. I now play bass, study music and going for my degree in music.

In the past years prior to my service I've asked the same question to myself. I can ask other players on my ship and others that I've befriended in cities from Connecticut to California. Yes being enlisted sucks cause the moving but you meet great people. And of all those people I have gotten quotes, Why aren't you in music school?, Why are you in the Navy? You should get your degree and teach? Hey can you teach me what you are doing?

For years I've spent countles hours perfecting my technique and learning all my notes/scales/chords/theory. It's taken a few years but I'm no where near I want to be. Studying other musicians and playing solo allows me to do my own thing and I know that is who and what I am. I've played in many bands and was highly sought after in my old hometown during high school and afterwards. You know you are good when you are confident. It's taken me almost a decade to figure that out. I can sit here and tell you so much more but for the fact that I'm limited to a certain amount of time requires me to stop. Looky here man. What ever you want to do with you life you can't go around saying you are the best or you think you are.

"You're a big fish now but when you go out there you are going to be the small fish." Andy Shone-guitarist/lost friend
(the best he ever said to me the last time I ever saw him)

Point is where ever you are you constantly have to prove yourself. There will be others better than you and others that are worse but however the hierarchy lines up you must work together.
 
#69
I don't want to know if I am good or not. I want to know how does ONE know if they're good.
How does one know if they're progressing well. No one has tried to answer the thing I posted which would've answered my question. Instead I got a bunch of answers based off of stereotypes. I'm not trying to be mean but it' the truth.
You guys say blah blah blah "out-shred" but you guys love soloists.
Being a bass soloist has nothing to do with getting gigs and applying to the role in the band. I doubt many of you even read my posts or replies. You don't have to see how well I am at playing if you would just answer the question my question would get answered.
Stop telling me about what my personality should be because honestly you guys know very little about me. I can be a total egotist and be a good bass player I can be a total recluse and be a good bass player. I don't want to how you think a bass player should act. I don't care about the humility speeches you guys are giving me. Personality has nothing to do with playing bass. And Bass is not only a support instrument . Stop trying to fit into a stupid Niche seriously. If we all conformed to what everyone else thinks a bass player should act like, there would be know innovation. SO seriously. Stop telling me how to act. If Domenicio Dragonetti wouldn't have reinvented the bass we'd all be playing the electric Cello right now. It was his new attitude and his devotion to technical skill that changed the way the bass was played in instrument. Telling me how to ACT does not help me at all. I don't care. Half of you people just said the same thing everyone else said. Very few people here were supportive. To make generalizations about how someone should act is ignorant because it has nothing to do with musicianship.
And stop down playing technical skill, that is by far the most ignorant thing I've heard any musician say. And I just heard it tons of times in this thread. The better you're able to play the better music you can make. The better you can play the wider variety.

Now I want know what should ONE be able to play by a certain point of time to tell if one if they are progressing below average, average, or above average. That's why I made he form. I'm asking nicely if you can fill it out. If I get another stupid response I will no longer reply to this thread. I have seen some helpful ones and I hope some helpful people continue to reply. This thread can help a lot of people if we all work together.
 
#70
Maybe I'll throw in another one here:

When you do a recording and strip away all the other instruments and just listen to the raw bass recordings and you can tap your feet and bounce along to it, then you can be satisfied with what you have achieved. This is how i judge myself because i have found that you can't really tell how you sound like when you are playing. And the raw recording never lies, it reproduces every little mistake you make in the clearest details. And i really hate it for that :p. But hey if you're looking to see how good you are, that's a good way to check.

I'm saying "you" as a general term. As in anyone. And i don't think that the ability to play certain songs is a good way of measuring progress.
 
#71
user101 said:
Maybe I'll throw in another one here:

When you do a recording and strip away all the other instruments and just listen to the raw bass recordings and you can tap your feet and bounce along to it, then you can be satisfied with what you have achieved. This is how i judge myself because i have found that you can't really tell how you sound like when you are playing. And the raw recording never lies, it reproduces every little mistake you make in the clearest details. And i really hate it for that :p. But hey if you're looking to see how good you are, that's a good way to check.

I'm saying "you" as a general term. As in anyone. And i don't think that the ability to play certain songs is a good way of measuring progress.
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How the **** does listening to a recording, tapping your feet, and bouncing along to it tell you what you should be able to play at after a certain amount of time?
 
#72
I think you are failing to realize that your question is essentially unanswerable.

I'll give you an example. At 15 years old I had my first lesson. I learned how to fret notes, pluck them and what a few of the notes on the fretboard were. The teacher showed me how to play "Pretty Woman" and told me to practice it for next week. By next week, I could play it recognizably well, and by that I mean if you heard me play it, you would recognize it as the bass line to "Pretty Woman". But that's about it. It wasn't good but yes, I could play it.

I can still play "Pretty Woman", the difference is that now it is good. There is way more to playing a song that has nothing to do with being able to hit the right notes. There is far more nuance than that. Is your muting good? Are the notes even and/or articulated well? How's your sense of timing, phrasing? And on and on...

I'm sure had I mis-spent my practicing time trying to learn complicated songs when I first started, I could have played them (at some tempo anway). That wouldn't have made it good.

Alot of people can play the "Star-Spangled Banner", how many can play it like Hendrix did (good)?

Hell, Rosanne Barr can sing the 'National Anthem' (ok well that's debatable, but I mean, she knows all the words...) what does that say about her as a singer? Nothing.
 
#73
The only measurement that matters is if you play a song and people enjoy it.

Whether it is Larry Graham thumping on a single note for the entire length of "Everyday People" or Entwistle blazing through "The Real Me", it doesn't really matter. They're both good.

No one can tell you when you should be able to do "Everyday People" or "The Real Me" well. You may play for 20 years and never be able to pull off "Everyday People" or you might practice night and day for 3 months and play every note of "The Real Me" perfectly. Neither of those examples necessarily indicate you are a good or a bad bassist. There is no timetable that applies to being a good bassist. The question is irrelevant.

A good musician plays what's appropriate for the song and plays within their own abilities.

If you want to know how good you are, set a goal and a reasonable timeframe to learn a piece. When you're ready, play it with (or for) others. If it sounds good, you're a good bassist and (I presume) that's where you want to be.
 
#74
being an overall good musician is something that takes a lot of experience. people talking about how many gigs you get are right, because that definitely means other people think you are good. But don't listen to people poo-pooing technical aspects and shredding. I can't think of any truly great musicians that weren't amazing at the technical aspect of music. The ability to do that kind of stuff is extremely important, even if you don't use it often
 
#75
AlphaMale said:
Now I want know what should ONE be able to play by a certain point of time to tell if one if they are progressing below average, average, or above average. That's why I made he form. I'm asking nicely if you can fill it out. If I get another stupid response I will no longer reply to this thread.
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If you keep getting stupid answers, then you might want to take a look at your question. "What should I be able to play" is probably the most commonly asked beginner's question, and no one has ever gotten a quick and easy answer to it. No one ever will either.

1. There's playing a song, and there's playing a song. It's one thing to squeeze out most of the notes in mostly the right order, and it's another thing to play a line the way it should be played. But both of those count as playing it.

2. There are a lot of things that go into playing the bass, and people don't learn them in the same order. There is no correct order in which to learn them.

Everyone's path is different. You've just asked the most apples-to-oranges question there is and now you're getting mad when everyone tells you it's unanswerable.
 
#76
lemur821 said:
If you keep getting stupid answers, then you might want to take a look at your question. "What should I be able to play" is probably the most commonly asked beginner's question, and no one has ever gotten a quick and easy answer to it. No one ever will either.

1. There's playing a song, and there's playing a song. It's one thing to squeeze out most of the notes in mostly the right order, and it's another thing to play a line the way it should be played. But both of those count as playing it.

2. There are a lot of things that go into playing the bass, and people don't learn them in the same order. There is no correct order in which to learn them.

Everyone's path is different. You've just asked the most apples-to-oranges question there is and now you're getting mad when everyone tells you it's unanswerable.
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Thank you for this is the closest thing I got to the true answer.
This is not an unanswerable question. I'm not asking what 'have to' be able to play, I'm asking what I 'should' be able to play.
I know that by the first week a beginner should be able to play 'Smoke on the water'

My problem is people aren't answering the question they're not trying to. IT seems like many of them aren't even reading it. Just like in Music class, some progress faster than others but there are still standards. Imagine in music class if your teacher said "Some kids progress slower, others progress faster so it is impossible to think of a song we should play." and then you understand how I feel but just a fraction of it. Now imagine getting 60 replies of the same thing.
As you can see people are still doing replies on what they think makes a good bass player. The question isn't unanswerable.
 
#77
You cannot approach bass-playing like it's some Olympic sport being judged on speed and technical difficulty. That's an immature approach.

Go to a music store like Guitar Center or Sam Ash and listen to the hordes of superstar wannabees whack out their impressive pyrotechnic bang-clang. They can play circles around the likes of me, but are they better musicians? No.
 
#78
Alpha Male, unlike some people, I think your question IS answerable. Here's how you judge if you're good:

1. Do you put 100% of yourself into your playing, playing as much from your heart as from your hands?

2. Does your playing move people emotionally?

If you answered "yes" to both questions, then you are good. If you answered "no" to one of the questions, then you suck.

Example: Krist Novoselic from Nirvana didn't have good chops and he couldn't shred. But when he played, he put his entire heart and soul into his playing, and he helped move people emotionally when they listened to Nirvana every bit as much as Kurt and Dave Grohl did. Therefore, Krist Novoselic was a great player (I say "was" because he seems to be retired now).

It has nothing to do with chops. However, having great chops doesn't mean you can't move people. Victor Wooten and Dave LaRue move me emotionally as well, and they're about as good as it gets chops-wise. But in the end, it has nothing to do with anything but getting an emotional response in people. I don't give a crap if you can outshred all your friends, and I don't give a crap if you're the worst bassist chops-wise. If you can't move me, you're not good.
 
#80
AlphaMale said:
How the **** does listening to a recording, tapping your feet, and bouncing along to it tell you what you should be able to play at after a certain amount of time?
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I'm sorry for not answering your question, but i have to ask you now, how does being able to play certain songs tell you how good you are after a certain amount of time? If I tell you after x-years of being a bassist you should be playing Donna Lee, then you will practice for x-years until you get it right. And after x-years the only song you will ever know is Donna Lee. Does that make you a great bassist? If you think it does, then go ahead. By the way, i've been playing for about 10 years now and I still can't play Smoke on the Water because I don't even know the chords and how the song goes anymore.

Judging by your reply I take it you didn't bother to try out what i suggested before throwing back your question at me. So let me explain how the **** it works. Listening to your own recording allows you to judge yourself better than listening to your playing. Because when you are playing you are in a world of your own and everything you play sounds acceptable. But when you listen to a playback of your recording it will be different. You will be listening as an outsider and your ears are more sensitive. You will hear exactly how accurate you are in your timing, control and consistency. And that is the best measure i can think of, of how good you are as a bassist. Because it's not someone else that's playing in that recording. It's just you. Is that really so hard to understand?
 

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