How to play Johnny B. Goode?

[BlueP]

Our band has started doing this song and we all agree that we need to listen to it to learn it ...

And therein lies a problem ... which version

For me, the original source is the chess recording

And therein lies another problem

It is really hard to hear everything that Willie Dixon is playing

But I can hear enough to compare to tabs and figure that just about every tab on the web is no where near what Willie Dixon plays

There is one which looks really close if not exact and therein lies another problem ... Willie Dixon was a master player and it just ain't easy to readily pick off the line played by the master

The band I am in seems happy enough with my quarter note walk approach and I figure that if I keep chipping away I can hopefully present something half decent

As for all the hacks who claim to be a doing a version of someone elses cover version then so be it ...

Another way I think this can be looked it is with an example

If someone presents a piano piece written by Beethoven , are they actually playing Beethoven or are they just hacking away in vain trying to impress everyone on the back of a dire performance

It is mentioned in a post above that the devil is in the detail
And I agree

Johnny b Goode may be in the form of 12 bar blues and that in terms of form may imply a sense of simplicity

But that doesn't mean it is easy to play ...

Having said all that, blues lends itself to interpretation and if one can't get anywhere near what Willie Dixon played then I suppose we don't play the song at all or if we do, just give it our best shot

So for me, it's a situation of being respectful as to the origin, paying my dues, and then saying ok, I am doing my best and in that not discredit it by 'claiming' it's an easy song ...

Let alone disrespecting the lives lead by our forefathers and the amazing music and standard that they laid down, to which many of us today will never be able to meet

......
To the opening question, listen to the original and Willie Dixon provides the answer ....that part is pretty clear on the original recording ... some of the other notes are audible but there is a fair bit of stuff that appears to be happening on the bass and whilst it's a fun song and hardly a peace of classical music, Willie sounds like he is having a great time with it ...

 

[JTE]

My take is this- instead of saying one particular performance is the only way to play it, listen to multiple versions by Chuck. That lets you findvwhat he thought was important to the song and what's superfluous. The sillines of confusing "song" with "recording" or "arrangements" is mystifying to me.

 

[BlueP]

Fair enough, but the recording is the original source and a starting point

In saying this I am not meaning that it has to end up sounding like the recording because obviously the engineering and instruments being used can't be replicated

My point is that as far as learning how to play it, there is a difference between learning from an original source as compared a multitude of people who covered it

Especially if it is in context of a band as compared a solo song such as something done by Robert Johnson and then adapted to a band

Crossroads as an example

Anyway, call it silliness and mystifying, and whilst I ad lib most of what I play, there is a particular challenge to learn to play a willie Dixon bass line from a song such as Johnny b Goode as recorded at Chess Records

For me it is similar to learning s blues put down by Paul Chambers ... as another example ...

As it stands and at best I can only ad lib this song too but at least by listening to the original I can appreciate that it's not an easy song from the bass line and for me I think it is important to pay our dues and at least try to give some respect to the people gone before us

And if that means trying to learn from the source, as hard as what that is in some situations, then so be it ....

 

[JTE]

Absolutely agree with it as a starting point, and learning exercise. The SONG is Berry's lyrics, vocal melody, the chord progression (including proper turnaround, ), and signature guitar licks. Copping Dixon's line is useful and laudable, but gigging the song requires that I play it so it sounds good with THESE musicians on stage with me NOW.

jte

 

[BlueP]

Hi JTE

Yep Agreed

 

[Manticore]

Absolutely agree with it as a starting point, and learning exercise. The SONG is Berry's lyrics, vocal melody, the chord progression (including proper turnaround, ), and signature guitar licks. Copping Dixon's line is useful and laudable, but gigging the song requires that I play it so it sounds good with THESE musicians on stage with me NOW.

jte

Precisely.

 

[cazclocker]

It's been mentioned a couple of times already, but NO FOUR IN THE TURNAROUND!!!

 

[popgadget]

Hi,
If I may pick nits, I thought the original recording was in Bb.
Thank you for your indulgence,BassCliff

I kept debating whether or not to make that same point...

That was the first thing that came to mind when I saw it. Most of the CB songs were in "piano" keys as Johnnie Johnson was a major part of the composition.

 

[Fergie Fulton]

Fair enough, but the recording is the original source and a starting point

In saying this I am not meaning that it has to end up sounding like the recording because obviously the engineering and instruments being used can't be replicated

My point is that as far as learning how to play it, there is a difference between learning from an original source as compared a multitude of people who covered it

Especially if it is in context of a band as compared a solo song such as something done by Robert Johnson and then adapted to a band

Crossroads as an example

Anyway, call it silliness and mystifying, and whilst I ad lib most of what I play, there is a particular challenge to learn to play a willie Dixon bass line from a song such as Johnny b Goode as recorded at Chess Records

For me it is similar to learning s blues put down by Paul Chambers ... as another example ...

As it stands and at best I can only ad lib this song too but at least by listening to the original I can appreciate that it's not an easy song from the bass line and for me I think it is important to pay our dues and at least try to give some respect to the people gone before us

And if that means trying to learn from the source, as hard as what that is in some situations, then so be it ....

Maybe so, but the recording released may not be the definitive one...it may just be the take that was good enough.....in other words had the correct feel but has a few mistakes in it...or the lest amount of mistakes.

Most recordings, back in the day, use multiple takes in a live situation, no layering as we have to day.
In the studio it was physically demanding to play session and not drop notes, so was common for recording that were released to have the correct feel rather than be perfect.

As JTE says do not confuse a recording with a performance, the reality of which version was released is not always based on musical correctness.
A song has to evolve to the person performing it.

Take the great bar 10 debate, do you move from the V to the IV on the way to the I at bar 11 as he does on the start?
Well if we look at the notes, and i will use Bb as the key, the bass can always move to Eb as part of the walking bass line because it is using the 7th of the F, so for the sake of a better term Eb is implied...not played. But if Chuck plays a Eb, or implies an Eb at bar 10 you have it covered with the F7 walk that contains Eb at the very point of change.

Now some may hear it as being played, rather than implied, and play Eb and walk from Eb as the root to no longer imply it, but define it... thus changing the nature and flow of how the vocal would work at bar 10, because they heard it at the start..and assume it always plays that way....after all its only a 12 bar type attitude.

It may be a simple song, but one of the most misunderstood songs, for me anyway, ever played...because many that play it... just don't get it.

 

[BlueP]

Thanks Fergie

 

[BlueP]

Hi Fergie

And just to add,

Chuck Berry and his music , I feel, represents an interesting juncture in modern music

He was a solo artist but performed with countless musicians

And his music whilst reflective of its time was also cutting edge in terms of execution

I have read somewhere that Johnny b Goode was auto biographical

I also saw him on a you tube clip where he answers questions from the audience and he mentions some of his songs are also fiction because he hasn't experienced everything in life ...

Whilst I like Johnny b Goode, I also like nadine, maybeline, Carol and little queenie

I was born in 1958 and the first versions of Carol and little queenie was the stones ...

It was years later that I took the time to go back and listen to chuck berry ...

Anyway .. enough rambling from me ...